The Cam Newton and Race Thread!

[Mr. Scot]

I will put it this way if we do draft Newton I dont want him starting this year or next. Not that I dont like him but that I like rookie QB's to sit for 3 years til they grasp the knowledge and speed of the NFL. Unfortunately in todays NFL that hardly happens.

That's part of the reason why I'm not interested in any rookie this offseason.

We've already got young prospects. Rather than get yet another one, it makes way more sense to go after what we don't have, i.e. some veteran experience and leadership.

People will say Newton is worth the pick regardless, I don't agree. Luck would have been, but he's not coming out, so better to just go the veteran route and see what we have in Clausen. If that doesn't pan out, look for the franchise guy next year.

Oh wait...scratch all that stuff. I meant to say that I hate Cam Newton personally for no reason :rolleyes:

(yes, there are indeed people goofy enough to believe that; heck, some idiot will probably be stupid enough to quote me on it as if it were serious)

[Squirrel]

That's part of the reason why I'm not interested in any rookie this offseason.

We've already got young prospects. Rather than get yet another one, it makes way more sense to go after what we don't have, i.e. some veteran experience and leadership.

People will say Newton is worth the pick regardless, I don't agree. Luck would have been, but he's not coming out, so better to just go the veteran route and see what we have in Clausen. If that doesn't pan out, look for the franchise guy next year.

Oh wait...scratch all that stuff. I meant to say that I hate Cam Newton personally for no reason :rolleyes:

(yes, there are indeed people goofy enough to believe that; heck, some idiot will probably be stupid enough to quote me on it as if it were serious)

Thats the way I see it but its not Clausen that I think will excel but Pike. Give him a couple years and he will surprise.

[frash.exe]

Well if I was a great GM I wouldnt be sitting here. But QB is such a big gamble why waste it on a first rounder? More Starting QB's in the NFL were drafted past the first round.

when you've got a very bad QB situation the "what if we fail" mentality is much more venomous

we don't have the convenience to make conservative "safe" picks. We did that in the past and look what it led us to. It's time to ante up

[Mr. Scot]

Thats the way I see it but its not Clausen that I think will excel but Pike. Give him a couple years and he will surprise.

Could be.

Regardless, I don't think you can fairly judge either one by last year's situation. I did see some development in Clausen after a few games, and as has been pointed out lots of guys make big strides from their first year to their second.

So yeah, it's possible that Clausen (or Pike) could turn out to be way better than last year would indicate. And I'm perfectly okay with their getting a shot to show it.

I'm not putting any money on it working out, though :lol:

[Squirrel]

when you've got a very bad QB situation the "what if we fail" mentality is much more venomous

we don't have the convenience to make conservative "safe" picks. We did that in the past and look what it led us to. It's time to ante up

I would rather get a veteran QB. Mcnabb, Palmer or Bulger. That would bring more wins than a rookie QB.

[Brandon]

Thats the way I see it but its not Clausen that I think will excel but Pike. Give him a couple years and he will surprise.

I've seen a lot of film on Pike and he's good. Very accurate, can take risks with the football, has great vision due to height, solid release and good enough arm strength. If he can get up to 230lbs or so (his frame can handle it), I'd be very happy with him starting. Let's not forget he's also very intelligent, graduating with honors in history. With Rip gone I think he'll make a fair bit of progress and has a decent shot at being the starter come September.

[Jackofalltrades]

if you continue to turn a blind eye to peoples ignorant comments and ban people who challenge them youre gonna bring the wrong kind of attention and animosity to Zods real world business. A vbulletin control panel isnt the answer. This board is already being monitored. Pissing off psl holders and paying fans of the Panthers probably isnt a smart move. Were all here to express opinions, but banning one group and shielding another isnt gonna end well. not to mention you arent partial at all on this topic.

Calling everyone racist who challenges whether or not Cam will be a QB, regardless of argument, is what got you banned.

I can't possibly imagine how this would affect Zod's business, to do so is just another example of how far you'll go to make your point, whether reasonable or not.

As for pissing off PSL owners, I don't know what you're talking about.

I'm not partial because I disagree with you? I'm impartial because character means something to me? I'm impartial because I want a QB who will make an immediate impact rather than riding the pine for however long it takes him to transition to the Pro game?

If you admit this is a message board where people share their opinions then why do you take such offense to mine?

I have nothing against black QB's, I liked Peete, I hope we sign McNabb and I'd be content drafting Tyrod Taylor in later rounds.

Get off your high horse and stop playing the perpetual victim. The world isn't out to get you.

I also find it funny that I got more rep from the thread announcing your ban than I've ever gotten in a thread before and it's not even close. But I guess they're all racist too.

[Jackofalltrades]

I've seen a lot of film on Pike and he's good. Very accurate, can take risks with the football, has great vision due to height, solid release and good enough arm strength. If he can get up to 230lbs or so (his frame can handle it), I'd be very happy with him starting. Let's not forget he's also very intelligent, graduating with honors in history. With Rip gone I think he'll make a fair bit of progress and has a decent shot at being the starter come September.

Where does one aquire coaches film from the NCAA?

[Brandon]

Where does one aquire coaches film from the NCAA?

A former business contact of mine was hired on at NFLN and he got me some tape on several guys we drafted last year.

[Jackofalltrades]

A former business contact of mine was hired on at NFLN and he got me some tape on several guys we drafted last year.

Nice, it's good to have hook ups.

[King Taharqa]

Calling everyone racist who challenges whether or not Cam will be a QB, regardless of argument, is what got you banned.

What got me banned was the administrator of a message board (where people DEBATE opinions) couldnt debate or defend his words, so banning me and grandstanding about it was his only option. I was very specific who I was talking to. And once again, you guys cant stand up for yourselves and have to throw "all white people" under the bus. There's plenty white folks on this board I get along with and never had a problem with. There's plenty who dont want Cam Ive never called out. Fact is, one of the most anti-Cam people on a message board felt the need to ban one of the more vocal to prove a point and try to shift opinion on this board.

I can't possibly imagine how this would affect Zod's business, to do so is just another example of how far you'll go to make your point, whether reasonable or not.

Of course you cant imagine. You're a worker, not a boss. Just know any headaches Zod would be dealing with, not his worker bees. For the record, I love Zod, I love this board, and I love the people on it. I just think we got a few entitled bad apples who have the potential to spoil it for everybody.

As for pissing off PSL owners, I don't know what you're talking about.

Of course you dont, because you dont even know what you're getting this board into or who you're dealing with. All you know is KT on the internet.

I'm not partial because I disagree with you? I'm impartial because character means something to me? I'm impartial because I want a QB who will make an immediate impact rather than riding the pine for however long it takes him to transition to the Pro game?

You're not partial because your bias and your commitment to this team seems predicated on the identity of our QB. You've spammed probably 50-60 Cam threads on this board saying the exact same thing in every one. No doubt, you, TRD, Mr.Scot and some of the other "Anybody But Cam" crew have posted in far more Cam threads than King Taharqa. Its been straight ATTACK MODE. Your reasoning that people who want Cam dont care about character is also very immature and grandiose. But pretty much expected from someone with pretty shallow intentions who likes to paint black QBs with a broad brush. Can you tell me one white athlete that Ive ever displayed this kind of behavior towards on this board? Just one? Did I go in 40 Luck threads and talk about him being a "douchebag" or question his intelligence? Do I go in threads where a white athlete has legal problems (ex: Big Ben) and use that as a chance to prop myself up as morally superior or make a broad statement about white athletes in general? No sir I dont. But thats something you do often. Its called an "agenda"

If you admit this is a message board where people share their opinions then why do you take such offense to mine?

Because they are ignorant and you took the coward way out, you banned me without defending them. Then tried to grandstand on it, which in a way only drew more support for Cam on this board. People have been more vocal about their support for him here ever since I got banned. So in a way, you came thru big time.

I have nothing against black QB's, I liked Peete, I hope we sign McNabb and I'd be content drafting Tyrod Taylor in later rounds.

You have nothing against stereotyping black QBs and attacking their character too. "He's big and black, he's big and black, he's another Jamarcus Russell! LOLZ"

Get off your high horse and stop playing the perpetual victim. The world isn't out to get you.

I'm not a victim, Im a prophet. I'm a leader. I say things one day, and the world catches up and agrees months later. Truly ahead of my time. Ask me who I said back in October the Panthers should draft #1? Ask me who I said was the best QB prospect in the draft then. Now here we are, and old KT might not be as crazy as we try to make him out to be. I think thats why people are so upset, they hate to see old KT be right even for something as beneficial to our franchise as this. ;)

I also find it funny that I got more rep from the thread announcing your ban than I've ever gotten in a thread before and it's not even close. But I guess they're all racist too.

Who cares? 3/4th of em are people Ive called out over a 7 year span on this board. They're still bitter and upset that I challenged them. They'll get over it. At the same time, I got my share of rep and pats on the back for calling you out. Its not like people arent concerned with your ability to lead this section of the board. Its not like a lot of vets arent concerned with the quality of the main board ever since some of the mods immersed themselves in the "Anybody But Cam" campaign.

[riddel]

Is it possible to have a sensible and honest discussion on Cam Newton and how his selection relates to race? Can we discuss the realities of it in a civil manner without negativity?

I'll start:

- Are there white folks who do not want Cam mainly because he is a black QB? Yep.

- Are there black folks who do want Cam mainly because he is a black QB? Yep

- Do these two statements describe the majority of Panthers fans? Nope, not even close.

- Is it wrong for a black Panthers fan to hope for a black QB mainly because of his color? No, I don't think so. I think its natural for you to pull for someone you more closely identify yourself with to succeed in an area that has been a challenge historically. If I am being honest, I pull for Steve Nash mainly because I relate to Steve Nash and like to see him excel in a position where people who look like me typically do not. While this is racist by definition, its not exclusionary in that I still pull for plenty of black athletes as well. I do not exclude other players because of their race.

- Is it wrong to pretend to know what is in the heart of your fellow huddlers and accuse them of racism despite having no evidence as such? Absolutely, its plain wrong and immature. Once the race card is thrown out, all conversation ends and defensive posturing begins. Its intellectual tripe.

There are some thoughts of mine. Anyone want to comment?

Remember, lets keep this honest and civil. Can we do it?

Smokescreen.

Seriously. I'd take this guy at 3-5 after we trade the #1 pick away to Buffalo, Cincy or Zona, although I doubt he gets by Buffalo and Cincy if we have Zona's pick....but you never know.

I don't want to use the #1 on him, but of all the choices, he's the guy I'd pick "right now" too.

[Kurb]

I'm certainly surprised the direction this thread took..

*sigh*

- Is it wrong to pretend to know what is in the heart of your fellow huddlers and accuse them of racism despite having no evidence as such? Absolutely, its plain wrong and immature. Once the race card is thrown out, all conversation ends and defensive posturing begins. Its intellectual tripe

[DaCityKats]

what else would you expect.good post KT.