The reason Rivera shouldn't return.

[Pantherman]

Player feelings do factor in to this kind of decision.

Some what. But when it comes to your fan base getting tired of losing season after season. Also you are losing money left and right because people don't want to come to games because of the losing. Then the owner has to side with the fan base and go with a change at HC. IF Ron can get above the amount of wins he had in his first year. Then something is wrong. Fox came in year one and went 7-9. Then the next year Fox took his team to the SB. Yet Ron can't mange to even get to the 500 mark or better in his second year. I've seen very little progress as a whole for this team. Yes after we are out of the playoffs this team finally showing improvement. But it was that way last year as well. So what is happening currently doesn't mean crap. Plain and simple.

[Panths]

Sometimes we give players the 3 year rule to see if they are a bust or not. Why do we not extend the same to the coaches? Look at Pete Caroll and the seahawks in his 3rd year. After 2 seasons of 7-9 mediocrity, they just posted two consecutive 50+ wins, are going to the playoffs with a 10-6 or 11-5 record, and they look downright scary right now. Scary and young; as in they're going to be good for a few years to come.

Rivera certainly had some growing pains, but I have to admit I like what I've seen lately when it comes to his decision making. He hasn't called any questionable game time decisions that I can recall in the past few weeks. He's putting young players in during a lost season to see what we have, regardless if he'll be here next season or not. That's pretty risky and could certainly be counter to the 'win now and save my job' mentality. But it's shown to be paying off decently; we've had some good play from players I didn't even know were on the team. If this was Fox and company we'd have signed back Chris Harris to play safety and we wouldn't see DJ Campbell showing potential. AND the players haven't quit on him and have even said they want him to stay. That's pretty big.

Chud's been calling good games as well, even with the 'washed up' Williams. He seems to be understanding how to use Cam correctly too.

There are signs that it's coming together for this staff and team; we beat down the Falcons team who just thoroughly manhandled the previous superbowl team. We beat a chargers team that consistently kicks ass in december, and at their place no less. I think two more games like the last few and this crew deserves one more year.

[jtnc]

Some what. But when it comes to your fan base getting tired of losing season after season. Also you are losing money left and right because people don't want to come to games because of the losing. Then the owner has to side with the fan base and go with a change at HC. IF Ron can get above the amount of wins he had in his first year. Then something is wrong. Fox came in year one and went 7-9. Then the next year Fox took his team to the SB. Yet Ron can't mange to even get to the 500 mark or better in his second year. I've seen very little progress as a whole for this team. Yes after we are out of the playoffs this team finally showing improvement. But it was that way last year as well. So what is happening currently doesn't mean crap. Plain and simple.

JR isn't losing money, stadium has sold out 103 in a row, 104 Sunday.

[Fiz]

Guys players aren't going to come right out and speak ill of the dead. The closest you'll get is Charles Johnson going on a drunken rant on twitter about it.

Firing hurney was the final nail. You can't attract anyone half serious about the GM job and tell them they can't hire a coach.

Unless accorsi likes what he sees, pulls a dick Cheney and nominates himself.

[KJ89]

Im really starting to think Rivera should get another year. Chud needs to be canned, or change something. I think Chud and other coaching is a bigger problem then Rivera.

He should get a third year if we win the next 2 games.

[Fiz]

If you're giving Ron another year because of how the team has played, how does that same courtesy not extend to chud?

Cam has been the first or second best qb in the nfl since the break, and the offense has been steam rolling people.

This is with the critical injury to Ryan kalil!

[davos]

If you're giving Ron another year because of how the team has played, how does that same courtesy not extend to chud?

Cam has been the first or second best qb in the nfl since the break, and the offense has been steam rolling people.

This is with the critical injury to Ryan kalil!

That's the issue right there though

We are in complete Chargers mode.

We lose to 1-11 and beat 11-1...that's all you have to know about this team imo.

[Fiz]

You either keep everyone or fire anyone.

The only person immune to regime change is Sam mills III, and he's just the damn get back coach.

[Pantherman]

Im really starting to think Rivera should get another year. Chud needs to be canned, or change something. I think Chud and other coaching is a bigger problem then Rivera.

He should get a third year if we win the next 2 games.

Wait... What? How are completely blaming Chud for this. Ron is the HC and he has the power to change things on this team at any time. If Ron failed to step in and say ha Chud less change things up and do something different to get this team a change of pace to get things rolling. But did Ron do that way earlier in the season? No he didn't. Ron is the HC and his the one that should be blamed for not working more closely with his staff to change things when what your doing is not working in the first place. Yes blame Chud for some of the play calling and stuff. But blaming Chud for all this and not blaming Ron is dumb. Ron is in charge of the team and the coaching staff. He needed to step in and change something or work with his staff to do so. But Ron failed to do so. So Ron is mostly to blame for things not changing until late in the season that finally got this team going. Sorta!!

[PantherTrain84]

Ugh, I dont get you guys on here. When I was saying lose out for a draft pick all you guys said "Wowz, you are not true fan of the Panthorz!! Get the fug off this board" Then when we win you guys are like "noooo, Rivera must not return, these wins are meaningless and mean nothing!"

[Mr. Scot]

Let's be clear, here. This isn't Madden where you can just hit a reset button.

You bring in an entirely new coaching staff, you're starting over from scratch. Newton and the rest of the players have to learn a new offense, defense, etc. I know some will say "just hire a guy with a similar system" as if it were that simple. It isn't. The terminology is different. The approach is different. Everybody's starting from square one, which essentially means 2011 all over again.

Lots of coaches who eventually turned into perennial winners had rough starts, but nobody's got the patience to see the hard work through these days. If you're going to pull the plug just two years in, who's going to have time to see anything through?

People have 'lottery mentality' when it comes to coaches and players. "This one wasn't an instant success? Well, let's just get a new one". You complain about mediocrity, but how is the team ever supposed to get past mediocrity if nobody ever has the time to build anything. It's the same approach Jon Gruden had with QBs, and the same one the Raiders have been using to choose coaches.

You want to start over? Fine. But understand what it is you're advocating.

[KJ89]

Wait... What? How are completely blaming Chud for this. Ron is the HC and he has the power to change things on this team at any time. If Ron failed to step in and say ha Chud less change things up and do something different to get this team a change of pace to get things rolling. But did Ron do that way earlier in the season? No he didn't. Ron is the HC and his the one that should be blamed for not working more closely with his staff to change things when what your doing is not working in the first place. Yes blame Chud for some of the play calling and stuff. But blaming Chud for all this and not blaming Ron is dumb. Ron is in charge of the team and the coaching staff. He needed to step in and change something or work with his staff to do so. But Ron failed to do so. So Ron is mostly to blame for things not changing until late in the season that finally got this team going. Sorta!!

You're right.

I was saying more the play calling then Chud himself.. Rivera should have changed it yes.

The play calling actually has changed though, and you'd think Chud would be smart enough to continue what's working, and change what isn't, but I have little faith he will. So Chud needs to either step it up, or GTFO.

Something's gotta change, but I'm not sure if RR or Chud are even getting fired at all. So hopefully they change what needs to be changed, or bring in someone new. Cuz it's not working.

But yes, you're right. RR's at fault as much as Chud.. But Chud is the supposed offensive mind. If he can't change something, then I don't want him.

BUT I don't want someone new necessarily.

My biggest problem is firing these guys and bringing in someone who is just as bad, or worse.

I say keep Rivera for one more year. If that means keeping Chud, so be it.

I think the coaching is less of a problem at this point then some of you think. Like it's been said, the play execution has lost us plenty of games, where the coaching was helpless.

One more year. If they screw up that one, GTFO

[KJ89]

Ugh, I dont get you guys on here. When I was saying lose out for a draft pick all you guys said "Wowz, you are not true fan of the Panthorz!! Get the fug off this board" Then when we win you guys are like "noooo, Rivera must not return, these wins are meaningless and mean nothing!"

How are either of those two things relevant.

[carolina-chuck]

That says it all. Even reporters know that the guy shouldn't be brought back.