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Is there any chance at all that Shula will be fired soon?

@bobbyagnese

By @bobbyagnese,
in Carolina Panthers

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FootballMaestro Newbie

FootballMaestro

Posted
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I'm not saying Shula is faultless. No one wanted him gone more than me last year when he was holding Cam back...

That being said, it appears he has opened up more this year but our OL is so horrible, we won't see any good from it.

Long-developing routes have always been an issue for Shula, but I think if the personnel up front was better, the offense would look dramatically different.

 

Agreed.

 

But it appears to be a catch 22 as well.

 

Shula, just doesn't appear to have a good feel for the game. All those run plays, running down the clock were ludicrous. Kicking a FG in the third qtr?. Whah?

 

Why not sweeps, bootlegs, short slants, etc., follow up by some intermediate throws, reverses, than a play action, and/or a throw down field, working on Benjamin.

 

Did he see how well Cam was throwing the ball today?

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Gladniator Newbie

Gladniator

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Do you think his calls would look as bad if he had a professional offensive line and a more diverse array of weapons at Cam's disposal?

 

You DON'T call plays based on who you *wish* you had playing for you. You call them for who you do have.

 

And Shula is fail at that.  Utter Fail.

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Mage Grand Master

Mage

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I don't think Shula is nearly as bad of an OC as people on this forum make him out to be.  Is he Bill Walsh?  Absolutely not.  But I think he is better than some people give him credit for.  He has his bad games but he has his strong ones too.

 

With that said, I do agree either we need to change the kind of players we bring on our offense or Shula absolutely has to go.  The issue with Shula is he is running an offense that doesn't suit us.  Like we saw several times last year, we are constantly trying to run a pass offense that relies on pushing the ball downfield consistently.  It works when you have Steve Smith at his absolute peak (2011; this as far as when he was with Carolina though because he is clearly putting far more effort with Baltimore this year) and two killer tight ends in Shockey and Olsen.  It works when you have a quarterback who can escape an incredible amount of sacks and make throws very few others in the NFL can make due to his arm strength and velocity.  But we don't have that kind of personnel right now.  Benjamin is the only player you could argue capable of making plays downfield and that is strictly due to his size and jump-ball skills.  Cotchery and Avant are old and slow.  They are not bad players, but they are scheme reliant players.  

 

We are trying to push the ball downfield when Chandler and Bell are our starting OTs.  Chandler and Bell are the two worst starting offensive tackles in the NFL.  We have 'em both.  We have begun to ask our WRs to run shorter routes, but that isn't the offense Shula likes or desires so it ends up looking like a mess.  If we want to rely on bigger, possession receivers like Benjamin, Cotchery, and Avant, that is fine.  But Shula cannot be the OC for it to work in my opinion.  And now that we can't rely on controlling the clock like we did last year because our running game somehow, someway got even worse (and it was bad last year too if we are being honest), it has been exposed.

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Proudiddy Grand Master

Proudiddy

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Agreed.

But it appears to be a catch 22 as well.

Shula, just doesn't appear to have a good feel for the game. All those run plays, running down the clock were ludicrous. Kicking a FG in the third qtr?. Whah?

Why not sweeps, bootlegs, short slants, etc., follow up by some intermediate throws, reverses, than a play action, and/or a throw down field, working on Benjamin.

Did he see how well Cam was throwing the ball today?

Yeah, no doubt Shula is a problem, I just think we have a lot more pressing ones than him. If we had great talent, especially on the OL, things would be dramatically different.

He does some really dumb things and I agree, he has zero to no feel for the gsme or situation. Down three touchdowns late in the third is NOT time to establish the run or take your time getting plays in. The FG is on Rivera though...

Yeah Shula kind of sucks, but there tons of problems right now and the defense is probably the biggest for me.

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Gladniator Newbie

Gladniator

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If something's not done soon, Cam's high level QB play will go UN-noticed, and for naught, cause the team can't score any points or win any games.

 

But it's clear, both Cam and WR's have ability this year, that they didn't last year (Smith or no Steve Smith).

 

Hell, it's worse that that.  If I were Cam, I'd seriously be considering whether I wanted to resign with the Panthers under Shula.  He has to know there are teams out there with much better offensive coaching that will propel him to year-in-year-out ProBowls and maybe even HoF.   He KNOWS that is impossible with Shula.

 

If I were Cam, I'd have a "secret meeting" with Rivera and Gettleman and let them know *how it is*.  He does have that much power and can force a franchise tag if he wants to (and then play like poo if he's tagged).  Gettleman would have to listen because losing his franchise QB would cripple this team.  

 

Shula needs to go.  No ifs, ands or buts...

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Proudiddy Grand Master

Proudiddy

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You DON'T call plays based on who you *wish* you had playing for you. You call them for who you do have.

And Shula is fail at that. Utter Fail.

Correct, but Shula is a known commodity.

My point was, if the personnel is that bad, the playcalling might not make a difference.

But the argument can be made that the playcalling can disguise a lot of flaws too.

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UpstatePanther Newbie

UpstatePanther

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Yeah Shula kind of sucks, but there tons of problems right now and the defense is probably the biggest for me.

 

unfortunately there is nothing that can be done about our defense except get them healthy and somehow motivate them to play better. offensively, there is ALOT more the Panthers could be doing to win games....

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Proudiddy Grand Master

Proudiddy

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unfortunately there is nothing that can be done about our defense except get them healthy and somehow motivate them to play better. offensively, there is ALOT more the Panthers could be doing to win games....

True, but with the personnel, I don't think it's enough to match what the defense is giving up.

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FootballMaestro Newbie

FootballMaestro

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Correct, but Shula is a known commodity.

My point was, if the personnel is that bad, the playcalling might not make a difference.

But the argument can be made that the playcalling can disguise a lot of flaws too.

 

Yeah, but right now (injured or not; but especially injured), the receivers are better than the RB's on this team. It's not even funny. 

 

Benji, Cotch, Avant, and Olsen, all seem to be more effective on the field, than any of the RB's.

 

And even if you say the OL doesn't block as well (though the OC can have an effect on that to). We can also argue, the OL blocks even worse for the RB's/.

 

Plus, let's be honest: You don't think the offense could use a shake up right now ( I know the defense has been horrendous so far)?

 

Where's Norv Turner? Lol

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