Newton suffering from lingering pain and soreness

[Davidson Deac II]

24 minutes ago, panthers55 said:

The whole idea that not resting Cam in 2016 is the reason the problem is back is ridiculous. It may have impacted early 2017 but he had all last off season and said the shoulder was fine this year until week 8. The obvious answer is he reinjured it in week 8. 

Secondly the idea that Rivera cares more about his job over the players is ludicrous as well. He is known as a players coach and has always taken a very conservative approach in playing a hurt player. He let's the player and medical staff make the decisions. Look at Kuechly,  Trai and Oher and numerous others sitting for multiple games with concussions. Gano is out this week with a sore knee in his planting foot not kicking leg. If Cam's injury was so serious playing would make it worse then he would be sitting. After all Heinieke is getting all the practice reps all week and is ready to go. If Cam gets more injured it won't be any different than the risk any player has by playing each week and getting hit repeatedly. The anti-Rivera mania by the same half dozen posters is really annoying and goes against the reality of the situation. No one risks your 100 million dollar quarterback investment needlessly.

You are correct of course.  But that will not stop the message board medical experts.

Ron deserves some criticism over a variety of things.  Cam's arm issues isn't one of those things.  

[panthers55]

5 minutes ago, Darvinsun said:

Ron Rivera has already proven your statement above wrong, yes no one having a brain would play their millionaire QB needlessly, but Ron is only using half of his brain. He played Cam the last 4 games of the season when he knew he had a damaged shoulder.  Why take any risk with that even if he could still play we weren' going to playoffs even if we won all 4 remaining games so that is NEEDLESS. Again this yr when we were trampled up under the sun with no chance of a comeback and is where I believe the injury occurred he had Cam, Olsen who was on borrowed time, and CMC taking hard hits who is our only RB they seem to want to play in another NEEDLESS game. I believe he doesn't value offensive guys like he does his defensive guys that is why Luke was not playing he took him out and if anyone should have been made to continue to play in that game it should have been Luke with all those missed tackles.

We aren't out of the playoffs and you are wrong. Rivera has said that he defers to the medical staff. You think Tepper would be fine risking Cam if he thought it would be a problem especially if he isn't keeping Rivera anyway.

[Darvinsun]

4 minutes ago, panthers55 said:

We aren't out of the playoffs and you are wrong. Rivera has said that he defers to the medical staff. You think Tepper would be fine risking Cam if he thought it would be a problem especially if he isn't keeping Rivera anyway.

Steelers game we were not making a comeback game was literally over at halftime. Why was he in there playing during 4th qtr and Luke sitting on bench? Game was well lost. 2016 we were not fighting for a playoff spot.

Deferring is all Ron does. You are a coach, a manager of a team. Your sole job is to make decisions. And yes even the hard ones if all your going to do is deferr what are they paying him for. Half of the time he says he hasn't even talked to the medical staff about some players injuries and I am at a lost for words on those comments bc the game was on Sunday and here it is Tuesday or Wednesday and you don' know the condition of your star players.

 

[Mr. Scot]

21 minutes ago, panthers55 said:

I am pro Panthers. I am also pro-Norv. And if Rivera is gone I will also be pro whoever replaces him. I think that is the perfect perspective.

Not when it ignores reality.

There's a difference between "pro Panthers" and "pro status quo". I was "pro Panthers" when Jimmy Clausen was here too. Didn't mean I wanted to keep him.

Sometimes the status quo isn't what's best for the team.

[panthers55]

2 minutes ago, Darvinsun said:

Steelers game we were not making a comeback game was literally over at halftime. Why was he in there playing during 4th qtr and Luke sitting on bench? Game was well lost. 2016 we were not fighting for a playoff spot.

By your theory Rivera must have kept him in purposely hoping he gets hurt? Do you still think Rivera decides who plays when and where on offense?  I am positive Norv decides that.  Rivera may decide the defensive rotations now, but not for the Steelers game 

[panthers55]

3 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

Not when it ignores reality.

There's a difference between "pro Panthers" and "pro status quo". I was "pro Panthers" when Jimmy Clausen was here too. Didn't mean I wanted to keep him.

Sometimes the status quo isn't what's best for the team.

True that change is inevitable. But comparing Clausen to Shula is again your extreme comparisons. We went 2-14 with Clausen and 15-1 with Shula. I said it was time to move on from Shula when he couldn't help Cam transition to a more pocket passer and could figure out how to use McCaffrey. Status quo versus blowing everything up as you decry. Seems to me the answer is in the middle.

[tiger7_88]

On 12/6/2018 at 11:27 AM, Anybodyhome said:

Yeah. A lot of the speculation in this thread is also lacking one thing: Cam's decision. At some point, Cam needs to step up and say, "Coach, I can't go today," regardless of what anyone else thinks or says.

Nope.

Sorry, that's a coaching/management decision.  Any player with a competitive spirit will want to drag his ass back out on that field for the short-term benefit of his team at the long-term expense of his health.  That's when the adults in the room, coaching/management, are supposed to make the damn adult decision.

But Ron "Save me Cam! This time at the expense of your health!" Rivera has never been an adult-in-the-room.  That's a foreign concept to him.

[tiger7_88]

4 hours ago, MHS831 said:

What concerns me?  He has relied on Cam's elusiveness and running ability to avoid pressure, going with some weak OL at times.  Cam took a beating for years and RR did not protest too much, methinks. 

Protest????!?!?

You forget that ol' Ron "would have taken a shot too".

Protest, lol. 

[Mr. Scot]

34 minutes ago, panthers55 said:

True that change is inevitable. But comparing Clausen to Shula is again your extreme comparisons. We went 2-14 with Clausen and 15-1 with Shula. I said it was time to move on from Shula when he couldn't help Cam transition to a more pocket passer and could figure out how to use McCaffrey. Status quo versus blowing everything up as you decry. Seems to me the answer is in the middle.

Or you could stop trying to troll people by picking the most unpopular member of the coaching staff and writing walls of text championing their virtue.

It's a thought 

[Mr. Scot]

8 minutes ago, tiger7_88 said:

Protest????!?!?

You forget that ol' Ron "would have taken a shot too".

Protest, lol. 

I do have to admit that for a "player's coach" Rivera sure does have a funny relationship with his players.

He regularly blames them for losses, is willing to ride two of his most productive players (Newton and McCaffrey) into the ground regardless of whether they're tired or even hurt, but has been known to pull one of his tougher players (Kuechly) out if he has a boo-boo.

But hey, at least this season, he was willing to admit that maybe there was some fault on the part of the coaching staff.

The light might finally turn on if we give it another eight years or so 

[panthers55]

24 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

Or you could stop trying to troll people by picking the most unpopular member of the coaching staff and writing walls of text championing their virtue.

It's a thought 

If I am trolling then you are the king of the trolls and live on this site. Once again extreme characterization time again. Anyone who doesn't agree with you is a troll. Just a thought.

[panthers55]

20 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

I do have to admit that for a "player's coach" Rivera sure does have a funny relationship with his players.

He regularly blames them for losses, is willing to ride two of his most productive players (Newton and McCaffrey) into the ground regardless of whether they're tired or even hurt, but has been known to pull one of his tougher players (Kuechly) out if he has a boo-boo.

But hey, at least this season, he was willing to admit that maybe there was some fault on the part of the coaching staff.

The light might finally turn on if we it another eight years or so 

Funny that the players don't feel the same way you do and always seem to support Rivera. Maybe you are the one out on.left field and this are your thoughts not theirs.

[TheSpecialJuan]

[Mr. Scot]

1 hour ago, panthers55 said:

If I am trolling then you are the king of the trolls and live on this site. Once again extreme characterization time again. Anyone who doesn't agree with you is a troll. Just a thought.

Nah, not everyone. Just some. and for the record, I'm not the only one who knows your MO.

But if you're not trolling, and your football knowledge is just so lacking that you actually do believe that Mike Shula was good at his job and Ron Rivera is a solid head coach, I apologize.

59 minutes ago, panthers55 said:

Funny that the players don't feel the same way you do and always seem to support Rivera. Maybe you are the one out on.left field and this are your thoughts not theirs.

Players defended George Seifert.

High character guys will always take the blame on themselves (which is why it's so telling that Rivera never does).