Tua's 3 Month CT Results: All Clear

[stbugs]

2 minutes ago, davos said:

Scenario wise, how would people feel if we drafted Hennessy or Biadasz in R2-3 then a tackle mid round along with grabbing a new starting LG (There will be significant upgrades over GVR available) in the FA? 

I personally want Andrew Thomas at 7 but if the board goes full meltdown in a Tua or Herbert scenario, there's still ways we could reshape the OL and that could be a clear path. 

Just saying...I think there's more than one way to build the line.  There's potentially 3 foundational centers in this draft.  We need to get one IMO and that is just as critical as LT in this day and age.  The interior collapsing was just as big of an issue as speedy edge rushers. 

You build what you can with the people you want long term.  This part isn't directed at you but if this new staff thinks Tua or Herbert is that long term piece, people here will need to understand they will be targeted ansd that doesn't mean the line will be neglected.  If the word is true and the Hurney replacement will be on board by draft time and eventual take over, I will have optimism that we're building from the lines out.  (1) 2020 1st rounder doesn't make an offensive line.  It's a process.   

 

We screwed the pooch on OL last year. I liked the Cs last year better than this year. Marty has a Ryan Kalil falling into his lap at 47, but he HS blinders on for Little and couldn’t wait to give up pick 77. We’d have our C position set and could have gone for the LT. Heck, pick 77 and 100 (wasted on Grier) could have gotten us a LG easy. We’d basically be done after taking our favorite T at 7. SMH, now we still have holes at LT, LG and C that we hope will get filled somehow.

[thefuzz]

4 minutes ago, davos said:

Scenario wise, how would people feel if we drafted Hennessy or Biadasz in R2-3 then a tackle mid round along with grabbing a new starting LG (There will be significant upgrades over GVR available) in the FA? 

I personally want Andrew Thomas at 7 but if the board goes full meltdown in a Tua or Herbert scenario, there's still ways we could reshape the OL and that could be a clear path. 

Just saying...I think there's more than one way to build the line.  There's potentially 3 foundational centers in this draft.  We need to get one IMO and that is just as critical as LT in this day and age.  The interior collapsing was just as big of an issue as speedy edge rushers. 

You build what you can with the people you want long term.  This part isn't directed at you but if this new staff thinks Tua or Herbert is that long term piece, people here will need to understand they will be targeted ansd that doesn't mean the line will be neglected.  If the word is true and the Hurney replacement will be on board by draft time and eventual take over, I will have optimism that we're building from the lines out.  (1) 2020 1st rounder doesn't make an offensive line.  It's a process.   

 

I agree, to a certain extent.  I don't feel that you can build a competent O Line in an offseason, without severely overpaying for out of town talent, and I'm 100% against doing that.

We can get better there this offseason, but I have scant little faith in Marty Hurney to do so.  As I stated a while back, off the top of my head, I can recall 1 OT or DT that Marty drafted that was good for us for a sustained period of time.....1.  That scares the poo outta me.

That said, if Tua is the guy, I'm fine will all that stuff, but I'm not fine with sending our 2021 1st rounder to move up to grab him, which is likely what it would cost.

I do want one of the good centers, but I wanted one last year too...but at the end of the day, we would possibly be looking at a rookie QB and rookie C, attached to Trai and GVR and a 2nd year LT who got his brains bashed in and couldn't play last season....smells like David Carr a bit in here.

Personally, I'd prefer to keep our picks, let Grier or Allen work through it this season, build up the O and D lines over the next two drafts and try to snag one of the top QB's next season....but that's just me.

If we do mortgage the future to tie ourselves to Tua, I would be in favor of bringing in a Rivers to start for a while so he doesn't get fully thrown to the wolves.

[thefuzz]

10 minutes ago, stbugs said:

I wouldn’t hate it even though I’d hate to lose the draft capital knowing how sucky we’d be with Grier if we move on from Cam. Do not give up next year’s first. Not ever. That could be Lawrence and even if we were settled, you could get a King’s ransom the likes of which we’ve never seen. Forget RG3 and Goff and Wentz and evening Herschel and Ricky. It would be like trading Peyton Manning’s slot.

That said if we got Tua, I’m redshirting him this year. He might be clear but I wouldn’t chance it until the OL is set. Again, I’d rather go for Trevor/others in 2021. 

Ha, pretty much exactly what I just typed.

[davos]

7 minutes ago, stbugs said:

We screwed the pooch on OL last year. I liked the Cs last year better than this year. Marty has a Ryan Kalil falling into his lap at 47, but he HS blinders on for Little and couldn’t wait to give up pick 77. We’d have our C position set and could have gone for the LT. Heck, pick 77 and 100 (wasted on Grier) could have gotten us a LG easy. We’d basically be done after taking our favorite T at 7. SMH, now we still have holes at LT, LG and C that we hope will get filled somehow.

We really did; there were awesome options last season right there for the taking.  Hurney is like he always was.  Exciting first rounders, head scratching 2nd to mid rounders.  I also believe people wildly overlook how bad GVR can be as a pass blocking guy.  He's depth.  There's also a decent amount invested between Paradis and Larsen so it almost makes too much sense to draft a center.  

DTs and IOLs are key this day and age given the way things are evolving.  You want to be able to collapse pockets with these mobile QBs.  Shake them/get them out of wack abruptly; they can shake the speedy edge guys and still beat them.  Justin Madubuike is my fave in this respect along with Kinlaw.  Agile aggressor movable but primarily 3-Techs.   Derrick Brown looks like a nice piece and all but we need more than the run defending space eater that high.  The value brought needs to be maximized.  

So if we're looking at potential value, a QB working out is about as high of value as you get so if you like a guy for the franchise lead, you're going to take that chance.  People need to be ready if Matt, Joe & crew fall for Tua or Herbert.   

 

[davos]

12 minutes ago, thefuzz said:

I agree, to a certain extent.  I don't feel that you can build a competent O Line in an offseason, without severely overpaying for out of town talent, and I'm 100% against doing that.

We can get better there this offseason, but I have scant little faith in Marty Hurney to do so.  As I stated a while back, off the top of my head, I can recall 1 OT or DT that Marty drafted that was good for us for a sustained period of time.....1.  That scares the poo outta me.

That said, if Tua is the guy, I'm fine will all that stuff, but I'm not fine with sending our 2021 1st rounder to move up to grab him, which is likely what it would cost.

I do want one of the good centers, but I wanted one last year too...but at the end of the day, we would possibly be looking at a rookie QB and rookie C, attached to Trai and GVR and a 2nd year LT who got his brains bashed in and couldn't play last season....smells like David Carr a bit in here.

Personally, I'd prefer to keep our picks, let Grier or Allen work through it this season, build up the O and D lines over the next two drafts and try to snag one of the top QB's next season....but that's just me.

If we do mortgage the future to tie ourselves to Tua, I would be in favor of bringing in a Rivers to start for a while so he doesn't get fully thrown to the wolves.

Nice post.  I agree.

I've mentioned elsewhere but the thing I'm looking at is Detroit.  If they find a guy like Okuda or Lamb that they covet, I think they could stay put and it makes NYG the trade partner.  7 to 4 is not a big leap and I think could be had without a 1st.  But we're talking Marty.... god help us all at this point. 

 

[Panthers4real]

Assuming everything heals as it should, what concerns me about Tua is arthritis issues down the road that can be a side effect with this procedure.  I'd hate to spend an early first round pick on a QB that we can only get a couple good years out of due to lingering pain issues from the surgery.

[Mistuh Jones]

yeah.. don't want Glass Joe 

[davos]

Read people.  This isn't proposing that we take him.  Jeez louise.