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Brains vs Brawn

Mr. Scot

By Mr. Scot,
in Carolina Panthers

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LinvilleGorge Grand Master

LinvilleGorge

Posted
Posted
8 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

I think you can teach stuff like footwork, technique, etc.

Accuracy though? To me I think that's just something you either have or you don't.

Go back and watch Josh Allen at Wyoming.

Prior to Josh Allen I full heartedly agreed. Then Josh Allen happened. A guy who couldn't hit the broadside of a barn became a legit elite NFL passer. That broke my brain.

 

 

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LinvilleGorge Grand Master

LinvilleGorge

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6 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

I know Josh Allen is one name people bring up, but I'm not sure how valid that is.

Even accepting Allen though, how many other examples are there?

Its super valid. I watched a lot of his college games living in CO at the time. The guy was wildly erratic with his accuracy. I mean, a few throws a game where you honestly couldn't even tell who was the intended target unless it was intended for someone in the crowd. I mean there was that guy open 10 yards away but surely he wasn't... OMG, yeah I think he was trying to throw to that guy. 😂

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Mr. Scot Grand Master

Mr. Scot

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2 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Its super valid. I watched a lot of his college games living in CO at the time. The guy was wildly erratic with his accuracy. I mean, a few throws a game where you honestly couldn't even tell who was the intended target unless it was intended for someone in the crowd. I mean there was that guy open 10 yards away but surely he wasn't... OMG, yeah I think he was trying to throw to that guy. 😂

But again, how many other examples can you point to?

Accuracy to me has a lot to do with hand-eye coordination, and I don't know that you can teach that.

You can teach somebody how to better place their feet, fix their release point, etc but I think that's only going to go so far.

Hell, even now Allen still has some off-target passes (granted, every quarterback does)

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LinvilleGorge Grand Master

LinvilleGorge

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4 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

But again, how many other examples can you point to?

Accuracy to me has a lot to do with hand-eye coordination, and I don't know that you can teach that.

You can teach somebody how to better place their feet, fix their release point, etc but I think that's only going to go so far.

With definitive statements all you need is one to disprove.

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Mr. Scot Grand Master

Mr. Scot

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1 minute ago, LinvilleGorge said:

With definitive statements all you need is one to disprove.

That'd fall under "exceptions to every rule".

If you only needed one example to disprove anything, that'd open up an awful lot of stuff.

(Including some things related to our current quarterback height debate) 😄

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LinvilleGorge Grand Master

LinvilleGorge

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5 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

That'd fall under "exceptions to every rule".

If you only needed one example to disprove anything, that'd open up an awful lot of stuff.

(Including some things related to our current quarterback height debate) 😄

Just saying. Go back and watch Josh Allen throwing in college versus now. It'll break your brain. That can't be the same guy. Just can't be.

 

 

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ForJimmy Grand Master

ForJimmy

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1 minute ago, Mr. Scot said:

That'd fall under "exceptions to every rule".

If you only needed one example to disprove anything, that'd open up an awful lot of stuff.

(Including some things related to our current quarterback height debate) 😄

Delhomme was pretty bad in college. He was like 52% and went to just over 59% in the NFL.

Also wouldn’t correcting footwork and technique kind of help accuracy?

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SmokinwithWilly Grand Master

SmokinwithWilly

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3 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

But again, how many other examples can you point to?

Accuracy to me has a lot to do with hand-eye coordination, and I don't know that you can teach that.

You can teach somebody how to better place their feet, fix their release point, etc but I think that's only going to go so far.

Hell, even now Allen still has some off-target passes (granted, every quarterback does)

Cam's accuracy throwing off his back foot or relying on his strength when throwing looked very different than when he stepped into a pass. Sadly, instead of fixing our oline so he had time to actually step into a throw, we went and got 2 tall WRs that couldn't get any separation. 

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Mr. Scot Grand Master

Mr. Scot

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Just now, LinvilleGorge said:

Just saying. Go back and watch Josh Allen throwing in college versus now. It'll break your brain. That can't be the same guy. Just can't be.

I've seen some of those things. I get it.

My question there would be which is the more valid statement:

"There are exceptions to every rule"

or

"Hey, If this one guy can do it, that means everybody can do it."

I've seen my fair share of supervisors try to apply that second idea. The results generally haven't been good.

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Mr. Scot Grand Master

Mr. Scot

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2 minutes ago, ForJimmy said:

Delhomme was pretty bad in college. He was like 52% and went to just over 59% in the NFL.

Also wouldn’t correcting footwork and technique kind of help accuracy?

 

2 minutes ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

Cam's accuracy throwing off his back foot or relying on his strength when throwing looked very different than when he stepped into a pass. Sadly, instead of fixing our oline so he had time to actually step into a throw, we went and got 2 tall WRs that couldn't get any separation. 

Those are the kinds of things I'm talking about that you can fix.

But can you easily turn a general vicinity passer into a consistently laser accurate passer? Don't think so.

You can minimize the weaknesses of a Brett Favre or a John Elway, but you're never going to turn them into a Drew Brees.

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LinvilleGorge Grand Master

LinvilleGorge

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5 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

I've seen some of those things. I get it.

My question there would be which is the more valid statement:

"There are exceptions to every rule"

or

"Hey, If this one guy can do it, that means everybody can do it."

I've seen my fair share of supervisors try to apply that second idea. The results generally haven't been good.

Reality is probably somewhere in the middle. It comes down to judging whether or not the accuracy issues are fixable with mechanics or if this guy simply isn't a very accurate thrower of the football. I think everyone is capable of improving their skills in practically anything but some folks are just naturally gonna be better than others and those folks are always going to stay better if they put in the work. It's just a judgement call in every individual case.

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LinvilleGorge Grand Master

LinvilleGorge

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5 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

 

Those are the kinds of things I'm talking about that you can fix.

But can you easily turn a general vicinity passer into a consistently laser accurate passer? Don't think so.

You can minimize the weaknesses of a Brett Favre or a John Elway, but you're never going to turn them into a Drew Brees.

You really need to do this Josh Allen comparison exercise before you keep making these foot in mouth definitive statements. 😂

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