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I dont think Dave even has the locker room as a leader. I cant believe any other NFL coach is looking at the way Bryce has performed and says that's my guy come hell or high water. Tepper is making that call and players know it. Tepper is controlling the locker room. Dave is a figurehead.

Words I never thought Id type Put Jamis Winston in a Panthers uniform

That's not what I'm saying. I'm not saying to not draft a QB next year. I'm saying that if you're Canales and Morgan first thing's first, you gotta GET to next year. I think they're gonna have to do something to make a move for a bandaid QB approach if they're gonna make it to next year.

The size thing is only the half of it. The arm talent issue is every bit as limiting as the size issue. Honestly, outside of having decent mobility Bryce is significantly subpar in every other physical talent category.

From The observer Excerpts In Panthers’ loss to Patriots, Bryce Young needed to be more than turnover-free Alex Zietlow [email protected] 5 hrs ago No fumbles for defensive touchdowns. No drive-ending, momentum-stunting, scratch-your-head interceptions. No spiked iPads or fiery exchanges with his head coach. None of this from Bryce Young. Instead, there was a deep shot on fourth-and-5 to rookie receiver Tetairoa McMillan that never had a chance. There were handoffs on third-and-longs. There were moments when pass protections broke down, and Young, instead of dazzling like he so often did in college and in spurts as a pro, answered to the pressure by dirting the ball away from harm. There were surrenders. sic Young needed to be more than turnover free He wasnt Young finished Sunday 18-of-30 for 150 yards and one touchdown. He was sacked once for 11 yards and ended his day with an 84 passer rating. He’s now 1-15 for his career on the road. That’s the worst through 16 road contests since Dan Pastorini reached that mark with the Houston Oilers from 1971-73. …against a vulnerable Patriots pass defense, different. Young needed to be more than turnover-free. He needed to be special. There are kernels of truth in all this (the excuses for Young). But the prevailing truth that the Panthers found out is that there is a difference between mistake-free football and turnover-free football. Both require accuracy and sound decision-making, but the former not only leaves room for magic but requires it: 1 of squeaking away from sacks, 2 of giving your receivers the room and space to be special, 3 of Steph Curry look-away passes and smiling after taking nasty hits — plays of which Young has proven capable of making. But Sunday wasn’t that. Sunday was merely turnover-free — and, simply, not enough.

You could always sit the rookie a portion of the season or all of it. The Giants sat Dart a quarter of the season, the Chiefs sat Mahommes for a while. Just getting a vet doesn't preclude you from draft a rookie QB. Actually, it's the smart way to go. At #1 overall, it's tough not to roll the dude out there game 1. Outside of the top 5? You have reason to justify not throwing the rookie to the wolves.

No. Its too late to bring in someone to learn the system and have them start right away. DC and Dan made their bed so it is what it is.

I'm back and forth on starting over again. On one hand, what has Dave showed you? The offense isn't anything special. He's not putting his players in position to win. He may have done that when Bryce came back last year, but he's not this year. That's unacceptable coaching. On the other, what is Dave holding back? While we can talk about effort and fight, the players aren't turning on each other (yet). They are fiesty and giving effort. Dave also has Bryce forced upon him, and he's tried. At the same time, Bryce has not been as billed. Would things work better with a more aggressive minded QB? Everything sucks on this team - time to pour baby out with the bathwater and try again. How much more time is this going cost? Is there a redeeming quality about this team that a new coach could come in and build up next year? Who will want to come to the most temperamental owner in the NFL? I can't wait to hear about the meeting of the Daves. I think Canales needs to get this team playing well. No more BS with fundamentals. Get them executing plays on the field. Show me a team that makes plays instead of giving them up. I don't expect 12 wins the rest of the year, but show me some life.

The offensive or defensive minded HC is like the 3-4 or 4-3 argument. Both approaches have proven to work and both approaches have failed miserably when poorly implemented. I do think Tepper leans heavily offense though and given the NFL's push toward rule changes that favor the offense that's the way I personally lean too. I just think the NFL is going to keep tweaking the rules to try to encourage more offense because that's what drives viewership so if that's the case I do think all else being equal you're better off with an offensive minded focus.

Not an entirely fair comparison. Over the past 3 decades, rules have been changed to heavily favor offenses and to increase scoring. But the past 3 years have been blowouts.

Yeah I dont think we beat cowgirls at home. They might be worse beating then last year if bryce starts.

My other reaction is ‘but but he is a defensive minded guy’. Which I prefer anyway. I was not in favor of a single aspect of this migration to an offense focused organization. Or barely a single aspect. Dan Campbell seems an exception, he is pretty hard nosed.

Tankaton's updated projections: Moore is #29 under the banner.

Canales needs to put on his big boy pants again and probably bench Bryce at some point this season. I gave him credit for that last season and it worked, but he's going to lose the locker room again if he keeps trotting BY9 out there. I don't think anyone in the building or the fans can really take this anymore, it'll cost him his job. I think Canales has a ton of issues that mostly come down to getting this HC role too early in his career. But I want some continuity and I want to see him with a different QB, one that's actually NFL starter level.

you mean stuff like this hinders an offense? https://x.com/TheTacRedneck/status/1972485267727798348

Y'all realize he'd have to sell two sports franchises to leave Charlotte right

Gotta hope the Ravens are dumb enough to let Harbaugh go and we go all in with him

From a fan perspective? Yeah. From the Canales/Morgan perspective? You gotta still be employed by then. I'm not sure Bryce/Dalton/Hooker gets that done. Tepper wants offense. If you bring in a vet who puts up yards and points but buries you with turnovers you've at least demonstrated that you can make your offense work with an NFL caliber QB. This current embarrassment of a poo show probably leads to another full on reset with the talent pool of people willing to come work for Tepper shrinking increasingly smaller. I mean, someone is always going to sign up for that payday but I think we're to the point that our wish lists have to start where everyone else's ends because anyone with other options is choosing the other option. That's why the thought of another reset just isn't very exciting to me. It's the front office/coaching staff equivalent of having to build a roster out of UDFAs and off the couch FAs. It's almost certainly gonna be a disaster.

Obviously too soon to tell on some of DM's draft picks. There's a lot to be excited about IMO with young guys (All draft picks this year outside of Etienne), and last year's is a mixed bag. 1 and 2 look like busts which he needs to own, but Chau, JT if he can stay healthy, and trading for Mike Jack were all good business in last year's draft. Trevin is the wildcard. Been hot garbage, but improvement. Doesn't help when the Huddle identified better players in a lot of the spots, though. Free Agency I think has been decent. I think he's filled what holes he can while not being crazy. I think the defensive players we signed this offseason were again good business, but I'm also worried Evero may ruin them. As for Canales, the locker room at least seems to believe and is still saying the right things. Patience is obviously running thin, and I don't love a lot of Canales, but until there's mutiny I just think he gets another year and likely another QB to prove it. One part of me is on team blow it up again. But another part is stuck on just being patient and letting it play out. Unless we get a Tomlin/Vrabel proven coach, another GM and Coach combo just feels exhausting at this point. A good QB covers a lot of ills, but so does a good coach. Chicken or the egg, and frankly I don't have confidence in Tepper to hire another coach anyway.

Yeah it permeates everything, everyone’s consciousness. Defense too. Maybe ST are somewhat immune but the players on those units participate in the other phases. It is a motivation killer to know that you have probably lost before you ever step in the ring.

They might as well. They spent a lick on them and they're ass so give him a shot in real action. It'll at least get them press coverage for a minute which I honestly think was the primary driver of that pick to begin with.

Nope. Draft a 2026 QB in the top 10.

I would....but it looks like browns gonna turn to him soon anyway like a lot of people expected.