BrianS

Based on what evidence is he "not bad at all" as a QB coach? As a QB coach he's worked with Jay Fiedler, David Garrard and Cam Newton. He never fixed Cam's mechanical issues, despite being the guy with the best opportunity to do so. The other two guys were the definition of JAG's. Mike Shula is a name. That's all.

Believe it or not, if the Saints get in it's going to be on their defense. They currently have the #4 scoring defense in the league. Their failures this year are 100% on the offensive side of the ball. If they had a typical Saints offense this year, they'd probably be favorites to win it all.

Not sure if I agree regarding Chuba. I hear this a lot and I just shake my head. Now, I do agree that Chuba will never be a bruiser of a runner. If that's what we want, no, he won't be that. But we could easily look at him the day we drafted him and see that he wasn't that guy. With runners you need to take the line into consideration. We know ours is bad. The question is, how bad and how much does it affect our perception of our runners. I can answer it, at least partially. Chuba averages 1.6 yards before contact, and overall averages 3.46 yards per carry. This is, as expected, on the low end. Now, let's say that Chuba was running behind the Minnesota line. Dalvin Cook went over 1000 yards this year. They were good, not exceptional, but good. Cook averages 2.6 yards before contact and 4.6 yards per carry overall. Do you see where this is going? If Chuba got 2.6 yards before contact, he'd be averaging 4.4 yards per carry and we'd be looking at him in a completely different way. Maybe not as a high end back, but probably as a VERY serviceable runner with the ability to break one if the blocking actually, you know, blocks sometimes. The other thing about Chuba is that he does have that big play in him. If we had a line that could block and allow him to make that cut farther down field, he'd probably break a few for us. I'm not saying he's CMC or Joe Mixon or Jonathan Taylor. But he's not what we often make him out to be. The difference between the pass game and the run game is that in the pass game the QB can go to a hot read and get the ball out quickly if the line can't hold up. Well, a good QB can anyway, no comment on Darnold. But in the run game, you are completely dependent upon your line to make the play work. If they don't block it right, the play is generally going to be bad.

In isolation, it does not. Saying that we give up very low yards is all well and good. But it's not the story. If your defense is allowing 60 yards a game, but giving up 30+ points, how is that relevant? As I showed . . . somewhere in this thread . . . our defense has definite signs of life. The problem is that they are put in awful positions. Some of that bleeds into yards allowed. It's sickening how many times we give our opponents the ball with less than 60 yards of field left to our goal line. The stat is here, somewhere, but our defense is faced with the worst field position of any defense in the league. However, that can make "yards allowed" look good, when in fact it isn't. Our defense doesn't give up as much yardage, because there isn't as much to give. Rhule clearly hasn't learned to value field position. The result of field position is forcing the opposing offense to run more plays in order to get in scoring position. It's more chances for your defense to make a play, or for the opposing offense to make a mistake. Yards allowed means nothing in isolation. It can reinforce or undermine the value of other stats, but in and of itself yards allowed isn't terribly relevant. In the case of the Panthers, yards allowed, along with other stats, shows that there is a problem with other facets of the team. We give up very low yardage per drive, very low yards per play. But yet we're 19th in scoring defense. And that's the stat that actually matters. Don't believe it? No problem, here you go with more stats. This year, 11 playoff teams are locked in right now. Of those 11 teams, exactly ZERO of them rank below us in points allowed per game. Of the top 15 defenses in football, do you know how many have been eliminated? TWO. There are seven teams still on the bubble. How many of them have worse scoring defense than us, do you think? Only three. Of those three, only one control their own destiny. Scoring defense is the stat that matters. Yards are only helpful in identifying strengths and weaknesses.

Patriots - Bucs.

Tampa Bay, Philadelphia, Seattle, Denver . . . pretty much every team not named New England?

YES! If it wasn't luck, then top 10 QB's would always be All-Pros, right? Jameis Winston threw for 40 TD's and 10 INT's his freshman year at Florida State. He was the number one overall draft pick. Here's a little bit from a pre-draft evaluation: Yea, all those things people thought they knew about him as a QB? Nope, they knew nothing. Marcus Mariota played three years of college football, threw 105 TD's to 14 INT's. Where is he now? If you somehow stumbled across the QB crystal ball, you will shortly be very, very rich. Otherwise, yea, finding a franchise QB is just a best guess and a lot of luck.

This is what it will take to get the message across. Vote with your dollars. The concern is that PSL holders are just kinda stuck. They made that big investment, and walking away from it is hard. Buy your tickets or you lose your investment. So glad I wasn't one of those who did it.

No coach worth having wants a one year gig, which is basically what any coach Rhule hires is looking at. Would you want to come here as a coordinator knowing that the HC is already on the hot seat? This is one of the reasons I think that bringing Rhule back is a mistake. We have (correctly) identified an issue with the team regarding the woeful performance of our offense and there are a significant number of independent issues there. Fixing it in one offseason is likely to require more assets than we have available, both in draft capital and cap space. Knowing that it is unlikely to be corrected completely for next year . . . what then? Rhule is done here. I just don't see how it's fixable. His ability to evaluate talent is questionable. His game management is bottom of the barrel. His leverage to improve his staff is non-existent. It's just completely incomprehensible why we seem determined to keep him. Rhule becoming the guy who builds the Panthers into a winning organization seems like such a long shot you couldn't even get odds on it from the shadiest bookie in the country. Bottom line: There are no external candidates who will improve us and be willing come. We're going to promote Nixon, be terrible again next year despite heavy investment. We'll then fire Rhule having wasted another season. It's blatantly obvious.

Short answer: Yes, they are. Long answer:

Let me just understand a minute . . . the only sources calling Robinson a legit safety are Rhule and Snow? I mean, those guys are great evaluators of talent, yea? Come on man. Robinson seems like a good dude, yes. But calling him legit based on the evaluations of guys who have serious credibility issues in that area isn't exactly quality reporting. Disclaimer: I don't know if Robinson is legit or not. Like BC, we haven't seen enough. Just saying I'm not going to take Matt Rhule's word for it.

Bienemy will be another in a long list of Andy Reid tree failures. The only Reid disciples who have made a mark in the league are defensive guys. It's understandable, as you said, Reid is the offensive genius. If you're doing defense under Reid, you're probably the one doing the job. If you're on the offensive side, you're just a coffee carrier to King Andy. Leftwich is in the same boat. Not only is Arians the offensive mind, you're giving him props when he's got the GOAT at QB. It's Adam Gase all over again. What you're looking for is someone like a Nathaniel Hackett or Brian Callahan. Guys who are actually doing the job and have done so with something less than super talent at every position.

I can answer this with stats. I chose to look at other teams coaches who appeared in the SB - not necessarily won it - since that game can go either way. The paste isn't pretty, but the format is: Team: Record prior to coach taking over => season records until SB => What year did they appear. That's 26 coach / team combinations who have appears in SB's since 2000. Of them, only the Shanahan 49ers stumbled the first two years before getting to the big dance in the third. Even that one came down to one simple factor: Jimmy G could not stay healthy. The first season Jimmy G played a full year, they went to the dance. There is no room for a Rhule apologist agenda. The odds that Rhule is "the guy" are so abysmally low that you just can't afford to risk it.

I'm sure you could be more wrong, but I'm not sure how. This Panthers team is one who is being clearly and consistently out-coached. There is no other way to look at it. Coaches win games in the second half, in the fourth quarter. When adjustments need to be made, when hard calls have to happen. Our team has been completely out-classed in the second half of every game. Every game! And it's not really all that close! We play well with our opponents until they see our gameplan, then their coaches do coaching things and give their players the edge to take the game away. Matt Rhule has assembled "his roster" There are only 12 guys left from the Rivera rosters. If the players aren't getting it done, it's Rhule's fault. If the coaches aren't getting it done, it's Rhule's fault. He is to blame, end of story. The only question should be what is the trajectory. Are we getting better toward the end of the year or worse? I would argue we have poor results, we have negative trajectory. That should lead to a regime change. It's really very simple.

It's just another sign of a dysfunctional organization. The concept of trading CMC isn't terrible, except that it is. Every team in the NFL can look back and see that the dude has played 10 games in the last 32. That's a HUGE hit to any trade value he might have. No one is going to give us anything remotely resembling value for him. If the Panthers think the guy can be healthy, there is literally ZERO reason to trade him. The only reason they would consider it is because they DON'T have that belief. Every other team can figure that out. It's just dumb, dysfunctional Panthers again if the report is true.

You're wrong. When you look at the different combinations, the common denominator for success is the QB. If you have a bad QB, it doesn't matter at all how good your line is. Hello New Orleans Saints. If you have a good QB and a bad line, it comes down to coaching and scheme. Hello Cincinnati Bengals. For clarity, I'm not implying either of those scenarios fit the Panthers. I'm also not implying that a good OLine is irrelevant. But when you talk about truly changing the trajectory of a team, only a good QB can do that with any regularity. This is why it just baffles the mind why we seem to be completely opposed to the idea of taking a swing at one. Yes, 100%, we're going to miss. QB's even in the first round are 50/50 chances. But you aren't winning the lottery unless you buy a ticket, and we seem completely unwilling to do so.

People who try to write off our defense as "living on the first three games" really need to take a harder look. Here, let me help. This is a defensive stat sorted by average starting field position. Basically, we put our defense in a worse situation than any other team. Whether that is because of poor offense, poor special teams or poor coaching decisions, our defense gets put in the worst starting position of any defense. However, when you look at yards surrendered per drive and plays surrendered per drive, our defense is the best in the league - still. And when you look at points surrendered per drive, we're in the top half: Bottom line is that our defense has signs of life. They actually seem to play pretty well until the entire team folds in the 2nd half. It's not three games that did this. But when you're saddled with an offense as bad as ours, with coaches who can't adjust in a league as competitive as the NFL you just can't expect miracles.

The problem with keeping Rhule now is actually rather simple to express: It's very clear that if he happens to be the coach next year, he's on a one year contract. Given that, what experienced NFL coach worth a cracked nickle is going to sign up for that? Given that, what free agents with any sort of ambition will come here? Keeping Matt Rhule at this point is handicapping yourself. We're bad enough that we don't need extra weight to carry climbing out.

It's like the entire staff has no idea what they are doing or saying . . . oh wait . . .

I get it man, I really do. It makes me nervous too. However, evaluate Pickett yourself. I want to hate him, but he's actually a pretty decent prospect.

Losing ground inside also makes it harder for your tackles to do their job. How many times have you seen opposing tackles this year just ride Burns upfield past the QB because we weren't getting enough push inside? OFTEN. OLine is very much a team deal. You need to be reasonably stout in the middle and reasonably athletic at tackle. I could even argue that being stout in the middle is even more important. Shortest route to the QB and all that.

While I understand why people see Pickett as a flash in the pan, and it may be a valid argument, you also have to consider that the same thing could be said of Joe Burrow or Mac Jones. Evaluate each QB "as is". I haven't watched much of Pickett, and just because of the Rhule links I want to hate him . . . but I can't. He has good anticipation, he can progess across the whole field, he keeps his eyes downfield under pressure, has good functional (though not exceptional) arm strength. He's a decent prospect. I'd feel better if we drafted him after getting rid of Rhule.

Absolutely incorrect. Joe Burrow was sacked 51 times this year, yet managed to complete 70% of his passes (34 TD / 14 INT) and help the BENGALS win the division at 10-6 (minimum) and likely 11-6 given they have the Browns this weekend who are without their starting QB. Tennessee QB's have been sacked 46 times this year. They are 11-5, likely to be 12-5, winning their division for the second year in a row. I agree that in general having a good OLine is quite important. But a good QB can cover up a lot of sins. A good OC can do the same with his gameplan and calls. Unfortunately, we have none of the three, and thus a huge problem.

We aren't trading back. There are too many factors working against us. First is the draft itself. This isn't a "trade up" draft. There just aren't a huge number of prospects worthy of trading up for. Honestly, who? The QB class is nothing like last year, and once you get past QB, are you really going to trade up for anyone more than a spot or three? Second is Fitts himself. He's on record as valuing picks in the top 15 far more than later. Basically he believes that the true impact players are picked in those first 15ish spots. If you want him to trade out of there, you're going to have to give him MORE than just straight value. I'm sure there are scenarios where we'd trade back, the problem is that they aren't realistic. Good teams are picking further back, but they didn't get good by making bad draft day decisions. Bad teams are picking where we are already.

Disclaimer: I don't know if BC is "the answer" at LT. That blame falls squarely on Rhule. However, I still see people saying "We can move him to LG". No. BC isn't a mauler. He's just not. If there is a hole in his game, it's power. The last thing you want at G is a guy whose main concern is his strength at the point of attack. This is why it was so important that we figure out what he is this year. There just aren't options with this guy. Rhule wants everyone to be "flexible", and he projects that onto guys where it doesn't make sense. BC is one of those. The guy is a tackle. Maybe he's a backup tackle. Maybe a swing tackle. But the guy is a tackle, arm length be damned. Unfortunately, here we are with one game to go and we've only really seen 2.5 games of him. Promising games, but not consistently convincing. Would he be more convincing if Rhule hadn't spent the last six months trying to round peg / square hole him? Maybe, I dunno.