7th round pick, NFL minimum salary PK Harrison Butker

[tiger7_88]

5 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

When it was Gettleman and Rivera, we had the most consistent success of any period In team history.

Hurney and Rivera can't even manage a 500 record.

In other words, during the Gettleman/Rivera years, the balance of influence on personnel probably tilted to the GM side.

Whereas, during the Hurney/Rivera years, the balance likely tips to the HC.

Ergo, the results that you mention above.

[tiger7_88]

3 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

Nobody other than acknowledged dumbass Jerry Richardson was even willing to hire Marty Hurney as a scout, much less a GM, after he was fired. Thankfully, Richardson is gone.

Gonna mildly disagree with you here.

David Tepper bought a team with dumbasses at both the HC and GM positions.

He has chosen to keep both of them for 2 seasons now.

Richardson hired Hurney and Rivera, but David Tepper, having declined the opportunity to move on from the Hurney/Rivera barrel of monkeys, owns the responsibility of that decision lock, stock, and barrel now.

[Mr. Scot]

I have little doubt that Rivera and Hurney disagree on personnel evaluations sometimes.

Who wins most of those arguments? If I had to guess, I'd say Rivera. But that's not the point.

The point is that it doesn't really matter who wins because neither of them is actually very good at that part of the job.

So bottom line: No matter who wins the argument, we lose.

[Mr. Scot]

3 minutes ago, tiger7_88 said:

Gonna mildly disagree with you here.

David Tepper bought a team with dumbasses at both the HC and GM positions.

He has chosen to keep both of them for 2 seasons now.

Richardson hired Hurney and Rivera, but David Tepper, having declined the opportunity to move on from the Hurney/Rivera barrel of monkeys, owns the responsibility of that decision lock, stock, and barrel now.

Fair point, sadly.

I can imagine some of Tepper's friends from around the league telling him, "No Dave, you should keep those guys in place. They're great!" while trying really hard to keep from snickering.

[Cpt slay a ho]

Yep cutting a 7th round kicker was the kill shot to this team, never quite recovered as a team since then,with Harrison on the team cam would have never injured his shoulder, our defense would have been top 5, and we’d never go on a 7 game losing streak.....some of you just letting your blind rage block all logic. Now hurney is the offensive coordinator in charge of subbing in Cj anderson for cmc.....I can’t lol

[Kevin Greene]

17 minutes ago, Hammerin'Cam1 said:

Every regimen makes mistake my friend. So when, if, Tepper has to blow it up the next people in charge will surely fug up at times, too, guaranteed.

But whatever GM Tepper might choose...... Fug I can't believe he hasn't done this yet. Won't be Jerry Richardson's cronie who was fired in disgrace and then brought back when Gettleman was fired as no one with any credibility wanted to work for the old sexist, racist Jerry Richardson. This is the Panthers legacy, Tepper needs to break this tie to Richardson, I don't know why he can't see this.

[MasterAwesome]

You don’t draft a kicker in the 7th round, watch him stink it up in training camp, and then proceed to hand him the starting job lol. What is wrong with you people?

If Kendrick Norton (our 7th round DT) proceeds to miraculous become the top DT in the game at Miami, are y’all gonna complain about how Carolina’s FO is a bunch of losers and how they should’ve cut Kawann Short and started Norton from the beginning? Actually, yes...I believe you would.

[Cpt slay a ho]

Guys are so beside themselves that hurney hasn’t done something to massively fug up the team that they have resorted to nitpicking the smallest of errors. Get em some rope and let him hang himself if he has truly learned nothing from his first stint 

[AU-panther]

On ‎1‎/‎21‎/‎2019 at 10:42 AM, Mr. Scot said:

That's actually kind of what I was getting at.

The synergy between them clearly worked better.

Maybe my question was worded poorly.  Not really asking who works together better or has the most influence but which GM do you think RR has the most influence over.

Pure speculation but I almost feel like RR can get his "way" with Hurney more.

[Mr. Scot]

Just now, AU-panther said:

Maybe my question was worded poorly.  Not really asking who works together better or has the most influence but which GM do you think RR has the most influence over.

Pure speculation but I almost feel like RR can get his "way" with Hurney more.

I agree.

[tiger7_88]

20 hours ago, Cpt slay a ho said:

Yep cutting a 7th round kicker was the kill shot to this team, never quite recovered as a team since then,with Harrison on the team cam would have never injured his shoulder, our defense would have been top 5, and we’d never go on a 7 game losing streak.....some of you just letting your blind rage block all logic. Now hurney is the offensive coordinator in charge of subbing in Cj anderson for cmc.....I can’t lol

Yeah you perfectly encapsulated exactly what I was trying to say, Doctor Strawman. 

[tiger7_88]

Here’s the thing about the 2017 pre-season... Rivera, Hurney, and all of Gods children knew what the Panthers had in Graham Gano in all of his glorious inconsistency.

What Rivera and Hurney didn’t know (yet) was what they had in Butker.  So what should you do? Well, a sane person with two things, one familiar and one unfamiliar, in trying to make a decision between the two, would use the unfamiliar AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE IN SITUATIONS AS REALISTIC AS POSSIBLE in order to gain greater insight into the “unfamiliar”.

So what does Rivera do? Does he try this new rookie kicker as much as he can in as realistic of situations as possible?

HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

If you thought the answer was “yes” then you don’t know ol’ Mo-Ron very well.

Which kicker got to kick more XP’s in the 2017 pre-season games? The “familiar” Gano did, kicking and making 5 XPs to “unfamiliar” Butkers 4 for 4.

Which kicker got to kick more FG’s in the 2017 pre-season games? The “familiar” Gano did, attempting 5 FGs and making only 3, whereas “unfamiliar” Butker attempted only 2 (and made both).

”Bu... bu... bu... PRACTICE, MAN!”

lol

[MasterAwesome]

9 minutes ago, tiger7_88 said:

Here’s the thing about the 2017 pre-season... Rivera, Hurney, and all of Gods children knew what the Panthers had in Graham Gano in all of his glorious inconsistency.

What Rivera and Hurney didn’t know (yet) was what they had in Butker.  So what should you do? Well, a sane person with two things, one familiar and one unfamiliar, in trying to make a decision between the two, would use the unfamiliar AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE IN SITUATIONS AS REALISTIC AS POSSIBLE in order to gain greater insight into the “unfamiliar”.

So what does Rivera do? Does he try this new rookie kicker as much as he can in as realistic of situations as possible?

HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

If you thought the answer was “yes” then you don’t know ol’ Mo-Ron very well.

Which kicker got to kick more XP’s in the 2017 pre-season games? The “familiar” Gano did, kicking and making 5 XPs to “unfamiliar” Butkers 4 for 4.

Which kicker got to kick more FG’s in the 2017 pre-season games? The “familiar” Gano did, attempting 5 FGs and making only 3, whereas “unfamiliar” Butker attempted only 2 (and made both).

”Bu... bu... bu... PRACTICE, MAN!”

lol

Way to move the goal posts lol. From arguing “they’re idiots for keeping Gano and cutting Butker” to “they’re idiots for not playing Butker more in the preseason”. If you are arguing the latter, then I actually agree with you and I’ve said that since the beginning...BUT given the actual circumstances (i.e. what limited exposure they did have to Butker’s performance), it would’ve been extremely reckless and potentially a disastrous move to cut Gano and hitch their wagon to Butker. You ever heard of Roberto Aguayo? 

You’d also be blaming a different person for each scenario. Bottom line: Ron is in charge of dictating playing time, and Hurney is responsible for the roster...despite whatever you want to speculate about their “unofficial” collaborative efforts in each. These are their primary duties for which they are responsible for...as in, any criticisms about roster moves should be directed towards Hurney and any criticisms about playing time should be directed towards Rivera.

[tiger7_88]

1 minute ago, MasterAwesome said:

Way to move the goal posts lol. From arguing “they’re idiots for keeping Gano and cutting Butker” to “they’re idiots for not playing Butker more in the preseason”. If you are arguing the latter, then I actually agree with you and I’ve said that since the beginning...BUT given the actual circumstances (i.e. what limited exposure they did have to Butker’s performance), it would’ve been extremely reckless and potentially a disastrous move to cut Gano and hitch their wagon to Butker. You ever heard of Roberto Aguayo? 

You’d also be blaming a different person for each scenario. Bottom line: Ron is in charge of dictating playing time, and Hurney is responsible for the roster...despite whatever you want to speculate about their “unofficial” collaborative efforts in each. These are their primary duties for which they are responsible for...as in, any criticisms about roster moves should be directed towards Hurney and any criticisms about playing time should be directed towards Rivera.

Your basic philosophy above is a Ron Rivera mantra... the utter and unquestioning fear of CHANGE.

NOTHING about Butker is similar to the Aguayo situation (one was a 2nd round pick, one was a 7th).

NOTHING about how Butker practiced or how he played in the pre-season pointed to "Aguayo".

He was drafted for a reason, to save the team millions of dollars that was being spent on a kicker that could be used at other positions (with important players contracts winding down).

The entire question came down to keep an overpaid kicker of questionable consistency or take a risk on a rookie with a strong leg.  Give that rookie about 90% of the chances in preseason games against actual hostile competition and see what he can do.  If can only make about 60% of his preseason kicks, then you have no reason to trust him.

Oh, wait... that was GANO's fg percentage in the 2017 pre-season.  My bad.  GIVE THAT MAN ANOTHER RAISE!