Jump to content
  • Welcome!

    Register and log in easily with Twitter or Google accounts!

    Or simply create a new Huddle account. 

    Members receive fewer ads , access our dark theme, and the ability to join the discussion!

     

Coach asked about Coker!!


Doc LRB
 Share

Recommended Posts

8 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

Also, this was Bryce Young as a rookie(horrible) versus supposedly the far better version of Bryce Young.

BY at the end of 2024 didn't look like BY at the start of 2023.  There was undeniable improvement few could see coming. 

that said, Carolina in 2024 was still a very bad landing spot for a rookie WR.  We had bad QB play still in 2024.  So when bashing WRs, you still have to factor they have been setup to fail coming into the league by Carolina drafting them. 

I was a LOUD XL advocate.  But even when I was doing that I always put a disclaimer on basically every single post.  I wanted XL under the pretext we would be moving on with Bryce Young.  Leading into that draft it was always obvious XL did not pair up with BY.     I was 100% certain we would move on from BY fairly quickly and we did just that.  No one saw that rise from the dead and IMO that wasn't in the Carolina plans. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, CRA said:

BY at the end of 2024 didn't look like BY at the start of 2023.  There was undeniable improvement few could see coming. 

that said, Carolina in 2024 was still a very bad landing spot for a rookie WR.  We had bad QB play still in 2024.  So when bashing WRs, you still have to factor they have been setup to fail coming into the league by Carolina drafting them. 

I was a LOUD XL advocate.  But even when I was doing that I always put a disclaimer on basically every single post.  I wanted XL under the pretext we would be moving on with Bryce Young.  Leading into that draft it was always obvious XL did not pair up with BY.     I was 100% certain we would move on from BY fairly quickly and we did just that.  No one saw that rise from the dead and IMO that wasn't in the Carolina plans. 

Who would be a better fit for XL? Spencer Rattler? FTR, I agree their skillsets don't really match - so far. Ladd was definitely the best fit for Bryce at that pick. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, ForJimmy said:

Ladd only had one year of good college production (2022). 

The biggest difference is the McConkey was a consistent producer and XL literally never produced anything his entire career minus his 5th year. He had 32 starts in 53 career games to the 22 starts in 39 games for McConkey. 

It's never going to be a true apples to apples comparison because XL was thought to be a #1 WR and McConkey was always going to be a slot guy. 

The arguments(of which I made myself) largely came down to taking a hail mary on a project/high ceiling #1 WR versus taking an extremely high floor but higher injury risk slot WR. This obviously came with the caveat that we had an effective AT and it was somewhat of a redundant take.

I fell on the side of taking the clear football player over the guy that might one day become a football player.

  • Pie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 minutes ago, CRA said:

BY at the end of 2024 didn't look like BY at the start of 2023.  There was undeniable improvement few could see coming. 

that said, Carolina in 2024 was still a very bad landing spot for a rookie WR.  We had bad QB play still in 2024.  So when bashing WRs, you still have to factor they have been setup to fail coming into the league by Carolina drafting them. 

I was a LOUD XL advocate.  But even when I was doing that I always put a disclaimer on basically every single post.  I wanted XL under the pretext we would be moving on with Bryce Young.  Leading into that draft it was always obvious XL did not pair up with BY.     I was 100% certain we would move on from BY fairly quickly and we did just that.  No one saw that rise from the dead and IMO that wasn't in the Carolina plans. 

TBH, I don't think a better QB would fix XL. If anything, it would likely expose his flaws further, IMO.

I was heavily anti-XL because he was such an unpolished player and an older one at that. So I think the crux of this is that we fall on different sides of that aisle from the start.

The thing we should be able to agree on is that XL very much needs to improve(and a lot) or his time here is likely going to be far shorter than either of us should want.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, jtm said:

No idea why XL gets so much hate here.  Most WRs don't excel until their 3rd year unless they are a phenom and phenoms don't get drafted at the end of the 1st round.  

You really could be right. XL definitely showed an ability to hand catch contested passes at SC - for one season. May just need time to get comfortable in the NFL - hopefully. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Navy_football said:

You really could be right. XL definitely showed an ability to hand catch contested passes at SC - for one season. May just need time to get comfortable in the NFL - hopefully. 

He was raw out of college and he looked raw last year.  The talent is there and if folks don't see that then they are just looking to hate.  He needs to polish his game to remain a starter and I'm pulling for him because he is so likeable.  

  • Beer 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

TBH, I don't think a better QB would fix XL. If anything, it would likely expose his flaws further, IMO.

I was heavily anti-XL because he was such an unpolished player and an older one at that. So I think the crux of this is that we fall on different sides of that aisle from the start.

The thing we should be able to agree on is that XL very much needs to improve(and a lot) or his time here is likely going to be far shorter than either of us should want.

I think BY exposes ALL of XL's flaws. Not necessarily a BETTER QB, but a different playing style, and a different offensive scheme/playcalling/role. Maybe a young Cam type QB? Fires the ball in there when you're open. BY throws to a spot you're supposed to be, when you're supposed to be there. I just don't think that's XL's game. 

  • Pie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, jtm said:

He was raw out of college and he looked raw last year.  The talent is there and if folks don't see that then they are just looking to hate.  He needs to polish his game to remain a starter and I'm pulling for him because he is so likeable.  

The issue with this take is that he is still a very raw guy that is going to be 25 at the end of this season. That is literally the timeline where you expect a "raw" college prospect to be fully hitting their stride as an NFL WR.

This was always going to be a problem with XL. It's very much not a good sign when you are a 5 year project player. Typically those are the guys that are in the 5th round to UDFA category.

  • Pie 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Navy_football said:

I think BY exposes ALL of XL's flaws. Not necessarily a BETTER QB, but a different playing style, and a different offensive scheme/playcalling/role. Maybe a young Cam type QB? Fires the ball in there when you're open. BY throws to a spot you're supposed to be, when you're supposed to be there. I just don't think that's XL's game. 

If you can't be where you are supposed to be, when you are supposed to be there, you have a limited timeframe as an NFL WR. 

Almost any decent WR should be able to get open in the scenario of an insane athlete scrambling to allow guys time to work on a DB. 

We need him to get better across the board. He needs to not just be a freak athlete out there running around but become proficient at his craft. Guys like Devante Adams and Justin Jefferson aren't just great athletes, they are insane tacticians and masters of their craft.

If it was all about size/speed, DK Metcalf would be the GOAT.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Trying to shoehorn XL into a starting role when Coker is clearly our best option as WR2 is only going to end badly for XL. The best way forward is to let him develop at his own pace and play a specific role in the offense - deep threat, for example - rather than putting him in as the starter over clearly superior players.

Right now XL is at BEST our 4th best WR, likely our 5th best (behind TMac, Coker, Thielen and Renfrow) and may even be end up being behind Jimmy Horn by season's end.

Not Dan Morgan's best work, that pick. But trying to force it will only make things worse.

Edited by Jay Roosevelt
  • Beer 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, Navy_football said:

Who would be a better fit for XL? Spencer Rattler? FTR, I agree their skillsets don't really match - so far. Ladd was definitely the best fit for Bryce at that pick. 

I mean, when we were talking about that draft...I think most conceded XL fit the classic mold of the Canales tree and we wouldn't really start to max that pick until BY was replaced (and most assumed that was the likely outcome).  And it basically played out exactly how we thought.  Until it didn't. 

But yeah, 100%.  The day we drafted BY I started screaming for a great slot WR (which isn't slow AT) and a great rec RB.  That was the easiest way to start maxing BY's skill set.  We didn't do that.  In fact, we went out and spent a boatload on one of the worst rec RBs in the NFL in Sanders.   BY needs YAC players.  And a YAC offense.  Football doesn't have to be as hard as Carolina makes it. 

my position was always clear.  I'm cool w/ BY pending we attempted a BY offense.  I'm cool w/ Canales pending we move on from BY.  Instead we get this inbetween whatever.  The no man's land and not being all in on a direction is what I detest and that is largely my collective irritation with the org for some time.  

  • Beer 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

TBH, I don't think a better QB would fix XL. If anything, it would likely expose his flaws further, IMO.

I was heavily anti-XL because he was such an unpolished player and an older one at that. So I think the crux of this is that we fall on different sides of that aisle from the start.

The thing we should be able to agree on is that XL very much needs to improve(and a lot) or his time here is likely going to be far shorter than either of us should want.

it's not even about a better QB.  It's about fit, offensive scheme and what you are asking and expecting out of folks.  That how you get success. 

where you land matters in the NFL.  It's one of the most important aspects of success.  We all knew XL wouldn't fit a BY offense.  He fit the classic Canales one.  And we simply do not throw those balls.  And those balls are not about being a polished WR.  The ones BY throws are. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

26 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

I fell on the side of taking the clear football player over the guy that might one day become a football player.

We'd have a much higher hit rate in the draft with that line of thinking.  What's the point of hitting on a Megatron if you're the Lions?  Great teams are not built with a scratch off ticket.

Edited by PNW_PantherMan
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share


  • PMH4OWPW7JD2TDGWZKTOYL2T3E.jpg

  • Topics

  • Posts

    • https://www.espn.com/nfl/draft/bestavailable
    • https://www.pff.com/news/draft-the-best-remaining-players-ahead-of-day-3
    • Per PFF: 1. CB Jermod McCoy, Tennessee Volunteers McCoy's medical evaluations will be critical, but based on his measurables and 2024 tape, he profiles as a first-round talent with shutdown potential in press-man coverage. 2. CB Keith Abney II, Arizona State Sun Devils Abney's lack of length and top-tier athleticism may limit him to zone schemes, but his competitiveness and run-defense mentality make him a valuable rotational defensive back with starter potential. 3. CB Keionte Scott, Miami (FL) Hurricanes Scott is a tone-setter in run defense with a physical mentality. His zone coverage is adequate, but man coverage limitations may restrict his role. 4. WR Skyler Bell, Connecticut Huskies Bell looked uncoverable at times against his level of competition in his final season and, despite below-average size and athleticism, produced like a top-100 prospect as a productive slot receiver. 5. WR Bryce Lance, North Dakota State Bison Lance dominated FCS competition as a versatile “X” receiver. He moves well for his size and pairs that with reliable contested-catch production, giving him a strong case as an early Day 3 pick with the potential to develop into a contributing NFL receiver. 6. ED Joshua Josephs, Tennessee Volunteers Josephs has an appealing blend of size and explosiveness but must improve his technique and anticipation to reach his potential. 7. ED Dani Dennis-Sutton, Penn State Nittany Lions Dennis-Sutton projects best as a 3-4 defensive end with some 4-3 flexibility. His length and size are clear strengths, though his agility in space is more limited. With ascending play, he could be drafted higher than his current tape suggests. 8. DI Gracen Halton, Oklahoma Sooners Halton is an undersized, versatile defensive lineman who wins with quickness, effort and movement skills. His lack of strength can be an issue, but he fits well in multiple or movement-based fronts. 9. HB Mike Washington Jr., Arkansas Razorbacks Washington brings alluring size, straight-line speed and yards-after-contact potential as a power back, but also noticeably good vision and footwork to be a potential early-down back in a committee in a man- or gap-scheme run game. 10. WR Elijah Sarratt, Indiana Hoosiers Sarratt may profile as a below-average athlete for an NFL “X” receiver, but there is still plenty to like in his game. His strong hands, coordination and determination at the catch point — combined with his constant competitiveness — give him starter potential as an outside WR2 in offenses that value jump-ball opportunities. 11. WR Deion Burks, Oklahoma Sooners Burks' size and production do not clearly point to a future NFL contributor, but his athleticism and strength make him difficult to dismiss. He offers intriguing upside as an explosive slot receiver, though he may not fit every scheme. 12. DI Darrell Jackson Jr., Florida State Seminoles Jackson is a massive, powerful defensive tackle with imposing physical traits. When his hand usage is right, he can be dominant, but inconsistency in technique and processing limits his impact. He remains a high-upside prospect. 13. C Connor Lew, Auburn Tigers Lew is a technically sound center with excellent leverage, balance and posture. His consistent fundamentals allow him to win positioning battles, though he can struggle against top-end power due to his lighter build. His upside is high given his age and technique. 14. LB Kyle Louis, Pittsburgh Panthers Louis is an undersized linebacker who projects best as a versatile space defender. In the right role, he can be an impact nickel player thanks to his explosiveness and coverage ability. 15. S Kamari Ramsey, USC Trojans Ramsey provides versatility with the ability to play both safety spots and the slot, particularly in two-high looks. His lighter build and good — but not elite — athleticism cap his ceiling. 16. CB Chandler Rivers, Duke Blue Devils Rivers logged 3,186 defensive snaps across four seasons at Duke and allowed just one touchdown in coverage in 2025, with a sub-85.0 passer rating when targeted for the third straight year. He earned a 90.7 PFF grade in 2024 before taking a step back in 2025. Over the past three seasons, he has been flagged just four times while playing more than 70% of his snaps on the outside. 17. C Sam Hecht, Kansas State Wildcats Hecht delivered a strong 2025 campaign, earning an 80.3 PFF overall grade that ranked fourth among centers. He brings a balanced profile, ranking 10th in PFF run-blocking grade (77.7) while holding up adequately in pass protection. Across 759 snaps, he allowed just seven pressures, with zero sacks and zero quarterback hits, and committed no penalties. 18. CB Devin Moore, Florida Gators Moore is an appealing Day 2 prospect with a strong blend of length, speed and ball skills for press-man coverage, though his injury history could impact his draft position. 19. G Jalen Farmer, Kentucky Wildcats Farmer put together a solid but unspectacular 2025 season, earning a 69.8 PFF overall grade that ranked 93rd among guards. His best work came in pass protection, where his 72.4 PFF pass-blocking grade ranked 256th, while his 67.4 run-blocking grade ranked 113th. Across 818 snaps, he allowed 14 pressures, including three sacks and no quarterback hits, and committed one penalty. 20. ED LT Overton, Alabama Crimson Tide Overton fits best as a 3-4 defensive end with inside-out versatility. He can contribute in a 4-3 as a power end, but his lack of bend and stride length limits his ability to consistently threaten the edge. 21. QB Garrett Nussmeier, LSU Tigers Nussmeier brings NFL bloodlines and a polished, foundational approach to the position, traits that fuel his confidence as a vertical pocket passer. However, his average arm strength and below-average stature could create challenges for his aggressive, gunslinging style at the next level. 22. DI Rayshaun Benny, Michigan Wolverines Benny earned a 79.3 PFF grade in 2025, ranking 62nd among 887 qualifying interior defenders. He posted a 68.5 pass-rush grade (161st) and an 83.5 run-defense grade (35th). His production leaned toward run defense, with a clear disparity between phases. 23. S Genesis Smith, Arizona Wildcats Smith has intriguing size and athletic traits for a single-high role, but inconsistency with physicality and play strength limits his reliability. 24. HB Jonah Coleman, Washington Huskies Coleman may not have the flashy athleticism of a fan-favorite RB1, but his game is efficient, powerful and translatable to NFL success, specifically behind zone-blocking schemes where he can gain momentum and one-cut into rushing lanes. He also brings plus third-down reliability as a receiver and pass protector. 25. LB Keyshaun Elliott, Arizona State Sun Devils Elliott has shown flashes as a downhill player, with effectiveness as a run defender and blitzer, but his below-average frame helps explain his limitations in coverage. He earned PFF grades of 67.8 in 2024 and 67.5 in 2025, which reflect a steady but unspectacular profile. His struggles in coverage may limit his role at the next level, though he still offers some starting upside in the right situation. 26. S Zakee Wheatley, Penn State Nittany Lions Wheatley is a long, springy athlete best suited for single-high roles. His slender build can be exposed in the box, but he offers strong range and coverage ability in space. 27. CB Malik Muhammad, Texas Longhorns Muhammad is a decorated cornerback from one of the nation's best secondaries, and his size and pedigree point to starting potential at the next level, particularly in a zone-oriented scheme. He earned PFF grades of 78.5 in 2023, 71.7 in 2024 and 70.8 in 2025. His lighter frame and limited disruptiveness remain concerns and may factor into evaluations despite the overall profile. 28. TE Michael Trigg, Baylor Bears Trigg may have one of the widest ranges of outcomes in the 2026 class. At his best, his vertical athleticism and contested-catch ability suggest top-50 potential, but inconsistencies with technique and focus create volatility in his projection. 29. DI Dontay Corleone, Cincinnati Bearcats Corleone, known as “The Godfather,” was one of the most dominant run defenders in 2022, using his size and strength to control the line of scrimmage. His performance has declined in recent seasons, and his 2024 medical history adds some concern. He offers rare quickness for a nose tackle and can control blockers despite shorter arms, though his pass-rush impact remains limited. He projects as a traditional 3-4 nose tackle. 30. T Dametrious Crownover, Texas A&M Aggies Crownover stands out for his massive frame at 6-foot-7 and 319 pounds with over 35-inch arms, which should earn him a look at the next level. However, he must translate those physical traits more consistently in pass protection to reach his potential. He earned a 58.4 pass-blocking grade in 2025 and allowed two sacks, two hits and 23 hurries across 428 pass-blocking snaps. 31. ED Anthony Lucas, USC Trojans Lucas has an NFL-ready frame and good overall athleticism for his size, but he does not consistently win quickly enough to project as a full-time edge rusher. His length and strength give him versatility across the front in odd schemes. 32. LB Deontae Lawson, Alabama Crimson Tide Lawson is undersized but experienced and quick. He projects as a rotational linebacker with some starting potential. 33. DI Kaleb Proctor, Southeastern Louisiana Lions Proctor, No. 111 on PFF’s Big Board, offers an unusual profile given his size and level of competition, but his explosiveness and pass-rushing ability stand out. His 2025 production supports that evaluation, as he earned an 86.5 PFF grade and generated 39 pressures, including nine sacks, four hits and 26 hurries. His performance against LSU in particular highlights his upside and reinforces his case as a potential late-round value. 34. CB Will Lee III, Texas A&M Aggies Lee, No. 114 on PFF’s Big Board, offers an intriguing developmental profile, as his size, length and leaping ability translate to strong ball skills. He earned a 66.5 PFF grade in 2025 after a stronger 76.2 mark in 2023, and he recorded eight pass breakups in each of the past two seasons. His run defense, tackling and penalty discipline remain areas for improvement, but the physical tools and ball production point to late-round value. 35. G Billy Schrauth, Notre Dame Fighting Irish Schrauth’s career included injury setbacks, but his play on the field showed a high level of performance for Notre Dame. He earned an 82.7 pass-blocking grade and a 73.1 run-blocking grade in 2025, and he did not allow a sack or a hit while surrendering just two hurries across 213 pass-blocking snaps. His game features strong pad level, a firm anchor in pass protection and good grip strength, though balance and foot speed present some limitations. The overall profile supports projection as a starting-caliber interior lineman. 36. WR Brenen Thompson, Mississippi State Bulldogs Thompson’s elite speed and big-play ability will draw interest, but his below-average size and inconsistent contested-catch rate complicate his projection. He ran a 4.26 40-yard dash, which ranks in the 100th percentile at the position, along with a 2.53-second 20-yard split in the 93rd percentile. In 2025, he caught 57 of 87 targets for 1,054 yards and six touchdowns, averaging 2.77 yards per route run and 4.3 yards after the catch per reception
×
×
  • Create New...