Dan Morgan on the Rich Eisen show

[SmokinwithWilly]

12 minutes ago, CanadianCat said:

I think BY could throw for 10,000 yards this season and half this board would say that we shouldnt resign him because he was terrible his rookie year. 

Play him on his 5th year. See if he starts/repeats the success. If he does, great, no problem with an extension. Just no Daniel Jones 1 hit wonder contract please. 

[frankw]

3 hours ago, Jon Snow said:

Tepper does not dictate who the teams qb will be, he never did. Fitterer sold him on Young in 2022. Everyone in the building went along with it as Fitterer was supposed to know what he was doing. He's no longer he because he didn't. Dan is getting the same leeway until he proves he doesn't.

There's no conspiracy to keep Young the qb here. The only thing that's going on is the are making sure they do not kick Young to the curb too soon like they did with Darnold and Mayfield. 

Yeah I'm calling shenanigans on this. I get why people want this to be true but the truth is plainly right in front of us.

Scott Fitterer was a god awful GM but at the end of the day the same guy that hired him gave Matt Rhule generational wealth because his wife made some tasty meatballs.

The whole trade up to #1 reeked of David Tepper's desperation and his need to be in the headlines. He had mentioned that he spoke to Bryce months before the draft and directly intimated that he would like Bryce to be a Panther.

And who was it that held a press conference where he did virtually 98% of the talking after firing Reich?

I legitimately don't understand how one can come to a conclusion that the entire Bryce Young debacle was all Scott Fitterer. I mean one would have had to have recently had a stroke or some kind of brain injury to even begin to rationalize such. Not trying to be a dick but cmon....

If it was all Scott Fitterer then why did we spend two straight years after 2023 making absolutely no effort to bring in any competition in the QB room? Andy Dalton? Jack Plummer?

And furthermore at the end of the day Dan Morgan is the GM because no other serious candidates were interested in the job. And why is that exactly? Hmmmmmm. And if Fitterer was the architect of the trade up and selection of Bryce Young and the Tepper's were just a couple of poor schlubs taken for a ride does hiring Scott Fitterer's right hand man and best friend sound like a well laid plan?

None of this is even mentioning the fact that the 2024 draft was basically like Scott Fitterer never left.

Yet people still aren't getting it?

This place is always amusing. That's what keeps bringing me back.

Edited 2 hours ago by frankw

[CanadianCat]

The decision of BY is not a one sided deal. 

- Offering BY 25M a year and say "thats what you deserve". Is not an option. He wont sign it. 
- Cutting him only means we have to find another QB in the draft and there is no chance we even get an upgrade to him. 
 

There are only like 3 elite QB's in the league the rest need support. GM's need to determine if a QB is 'good enough' to then build around him. I think BY proved hes on that verge at the end of last year. He needs to prove he can be more than that this year. 

But a lot of teams have won with middle of the pack QB's... and if he can become a "middle of the pack QB" thats 24 years old... hes gonna get a big contract. 

[mrcompletely11]

Just now, CanadianCat said:

The decision of BY is not a one sided deal. 

- Offering BY 25M a year and say "thats what you deserve". Is not an option. He wont sign it. 
- Cutting him only means we have to find another QB in the draft and there is no chance we even get an upgrade to him. 

But a lot of teams have won with middle of the pack QB's... and if he can become a "middle of the pack QB" thats 24 years old... hes gonna get a big contract. 

A) so what would you do in your first 2 scenarios?  You want to pay him market rate?

 

B)No man, "a lot" of teams have not won with middle of the pack qb's.   Well I guess it depends on your definition of "A Lot" but for the most part you need an elite qb at some point in the playoffs because the margins are simply too tight to rely on "Middle of the pack"

[frankw]

8 minutes ago, CanadianCat said:

But a lot of teams have won with middle of the pack QB's... and if he can become a "middle of the pack QB" thats 24 years old... hes gonna get a big contract. 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/stats/player/_/table/passing/sort/yardsPerPassAttempt/dir/desc

Bryce Young was an eyelash above Spencer Rattler in yards per pass attempt.

That's not middle of the pack sir. That's not even poverty. That's you need a new QB.

Edited 1 hour ago by frankw

[CanadianCat]

Just now, frankw said:

https://www.espn.com/nfl/stats/player/_/table/passing/sort/yardsPerPassAttempt/dir/desc

Bryce Young was an eyelash above Spencer Rattler in yards per pass attempt.

That's not middle of the pack sir. That's not even poverty. That's you need a new QB.

 

Im not making the case that last year BY was middle of the pack. Im saying that if he becomes that this year - he will likely get the bag. 

18 minutes ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

Play him on his 5th year. See if he starts/repeats the success. If he does, great, no problem with an extension. Just no Daniel Jones 1 hit wonder contract please. 

This would be my choice as well.. I just dont think this is a realistic scenario. Hell, I would make him play that out than tag him 2x if needed. 

But I think that situation is only realistic in Madden. 

[frankw]

Just now, CanadianCat said:

Im not making the case that last year BY was middle of the pack. Im saying that if he becomes that this year - he will likely get the bag.

He doesn't have the physical tools to make a jump to the 15th best QB in the league. I don't like it either but the situation is the situation.

Furthermore for us to navigate the upcoming schedule of opponents for 2026 which right now looks pretty tough we will need a really stout run game. Last year our season was kaput without Rico Dowdle going on a tear. It certainly wasn't our QB that did the heavy lifting. We had the division in front of us and he got swept and outplayed by a 2nd round rookie.

[CanadianCat]

6 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

A) so what would you do in your first 2 scenarios?  You want to pay him market rate?

 

B)No man, "a lot" of teams have not won with middle of the pack qb's.   Well I guess it depends on your definition of "A Lot" but for the most part you need an elite qb at some point in the playoffs because the margins are simply too tight to rely on "Middle of the pack"

A) Im saying I dont think there is a choice - its market rate or bust. 

B) I mean how many elite QB's are there in the league? If you dont have one, is the team philosophy to cut and try again? If so, how long of a leash do you give the guy?

We had Baker and Darnold in the building and both are currently better than BY. But we cut them to find someone better, and here we are again, thinking we can find someone better. I dont know man, maybe Im just tired, but at some point good enough is good enough and you need to build around that. 

Im not saying BY is 'good enough' but thats what this year is for - but good enough also comes with a massive contract. 

[SmokinwithWilly]

2 minutes ago, CanadianCat said:

Im not making the case that last year BY was middle of the pack. Im saying that if he becomes that this year - he will likely get the bag. 

This would be my choice as well.. I just dont think this is a realistic scenario. Hell, I would make him play that out than tag him 2x if needed. 

But I think that situation is only realistic in Madden. 

I'm actually not against Bryce. Under Tepper our QB play has been erratic and what can you do for me now. I am not a fan at all of that approach to the QB position.

I get we're trying to give Bryce every opportunity to be a success. I don't like not pursuing a 2nd option in the meantime until Bryce does/doesn't prove he's a franchise QB. 

Until you have your franchise QB you have nothing. Keep looking within reasonable means. It can only help the team. 

[CanadianCat]

2 minutes ago, frankw said:

He doesn't have the physical tools to make a jump to the 15th best QB in the league. I don't like it either but the situation is the situation.

Furthermore for us to navigate the upcoming schedule of opponents for 2026 which right now looks pretty tough we will need a really stout run game. Last year our season was kaput without Rico Dowdle going on a tear. It certainly wasn't our QB that did the heavy lifting. We had the division in front of us and he got swept and outplayed by a 2nd round rookie.

I cannot disagree. I mean I would like to hope that Morgan is going to wait until the end of the year before offering an extension, because I think you are right. This SHOULD be the put up or shut up year. 

If BY can win the division again against this schedule Im happy for him to get paid. If hes just 'ok'... then its a tough call. 

[mrcompletely11]

1 minute ago, CanadianCat said:

A) Im saying I dont think there is a choice - its market rate or bust. 

B) I mean how many elite QB's are there in the league? If you dont have one, is the team philosophy to cut and try again? If so, how long of a leash do you give the guy?

We had Baker and Darnold in the building and both are currently better than BY. But we cut them to find someone better, and here we are again, thinking we can find someone better. I dont know man, maybe Im just tired, but at some point good enough is good enough and you need to build around that. 

Im not saying BY is 'good enough' but thats what this year is for - but good enough also comes with a massive contract. 

He is getting this year I think most of us are just debating (hoping against) that the team doesnt do something stupid like extend him before the season starts.   Which is why I have always said the 5th year option is stupid.  He either becomes a top 10 qb or we let him walk.   

 

I would say there are probably 10 elite qbs in this league that could win a SB

[SmokinwithWilly]

2 minutes ago, CanadianCat said:

A) Im saying I dont think there is a choice - its market rate or bust. 

B) I mean how many elite QB's are there in the league? If you dont have one, is the team philosophy to cut and try again? If so, how long of a leash do you give the guy?

We had Baker and Darnold in the building and both are currently better than BY. But we cut them to find someone better, and here we are again, thinking we can find someone better. I dont know man, maybe Im just tired, but at some point good enough is good enough and you need to build around that. 

Im not saying BY is 'good enough' but thats what this year is for - but good enough also comes with a massive contract. 

You get the guy you think can be your guy and continue to develop a 1B. Until you're sure, keep swinging at guys with potential. 

[frankw]

2 minutes ago, CanadianCat said:

I cannot disagree. I mean I would like to hope that Morgan is going to wait until the end of the year before offering an extension, because I think you are right. This SHOULD be the put up or shut up year. 

If BY can win the division again against this schedule Im happy for him to get paid. If hes just 'ok'... then its a tough call. 

In terms of what it will take in my view for Bryce to be worthy of an extension making him one of the highest paid QB's in the league.

I will quote Bill Parcells

"He better walk on water".

The 2026 Panthers will need to consistently win because of Bryce Young not in spite of him. Just being decent is off the menu.

[CanadianCat]

2 minutes ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

I'm actually not against Bryce. Under Tepper our QB play has been erratic and what can you do for me now. I am not a fan at all of that approach to the QB position.

I get we're trying to give Bryce every opportunity to be a success. I don't like not pursuing a 2nd option in the meantime until Bryce does/doesn't prove he's a franchise QB. 

Until you have your franchise QB you have nothing. Keep looking within reasonable means. It can only help the team. 

I mean I suppose there are a few theories of what to do at that position. I read somewhere that you should draft a QB every year.. just to see if you have the next guy. 

Initially I really liked our approach of bringing in high upside guys, like Teddy, Sam and Baker. And at the time I was more than willing to toss them aside for the next guy - cause the position is too important. But this also has shown me that sometimes you need more time to develop and now looking at those guys on others teams is painful