Do we HAVE to take Newton?

[MHS831]

Not that I disagree with your point, MHS, but the highlight videos of him passing in that Dolphins article that was circulated a few weeks ago were pretty good. Showed good accuracy (for the most part), great arm, good throwing on the run, most everything positive you COULD see in a video you could see in those.

Again, I agree that he should ONLY be the pick if an exorbitant amount of research is put into him and they FULLY feel he is likely to live up to his potential.

I think he is a super talent. However, he was inconsistent. Watch the Oregon game. I read a statement that said, "Take the runs out of the highlight films. See what you have left. One read if that, throw it. Not a lot of complexity. Again, if we were picking 8th or 12th, I would be on the bandwagon, but a developmental guy with red flags all over the place? The risk is as substantial as his upside.

[Bj-Monster23]

Because have you seen the QBs in the draft this year? They aren't very good and to draft one just because we need a QB when in normal years they are bottom of round 1 or top of round 2 guys at best is silly. We could draft a better overall player on either offense or defense to make an impact sooner.

Remove Clausen and Davidson from the offense and add Chud and it's immediately better, probably at least up to #20. If you get some guys healthy again that were injured last year, you can expect to move up a little from there. So with the same exact roster but some "starters" moved around and one added impact player on either offense or defense, I expect the whole team to be better and the offense to be much improved.

If you choose to add a "better" QB through FA or trade, it could improve the offense even more, depending on what you really think of the guys we have now.

You take Green, PP, or MD at this point and the team gets an immediate improvement. You take a QB and nothing changes.

I don't know how to stress enough that just because you need a QB you don't take one if they aren't good enough.

If you wanted to buy a 3D TV for 5K and you went to Best Buy with 5k and they said "Well we are all out of 3D TV's but we have this used 19 inch from 1998 and it will still cost you 5k" you don't say "fug well I do need a TV so I guess I will take it" you get the fug outta there and try and buy a nicer couch or some poo with your money, not some pooty TV

I have to agree with you some point in your article..But us not having at QB want make our offense improve.And going out into free agency we can only get and older decent person.Or an all star bench rider who never got to play " Billy Volek ".The only things these guys can give is leadership and the responseability to teach Clausen ,Cam or Gabbert the QB ropes.

I mean we have the first pick in the draft, this is our chance to get a pretty decent QB in Cam or Gabbert. The reason i say decent is because they arent ready to be great yet.Next year we can probably have the 6 or 7 or 8 pick and Andrew luck or Barkleyjust went rite before us. And not again we just missed out on another QB. All im saying is i hope the FO make the right decision because we cant afford a slip up even though we have nothing to lose, because our franchise is down anyway.

Buffalo Bills 2.0

[MHS831]

I didn't even notice this the first time, I'm gonna have to say I disagree with this statement big time. With an offense that doesn't give the ball back to the other team after 3 plays, our defense is easily the best in the NFCS even with the DTs we had last year. DT is our defense's only weak spot. I'm gonna go out on a limb and assume that was a brain fart and you typed defense when you meant offense...

No brain fart. I agree with the offensive woes, but we all probably agree that we desperately need 2 DTs, a CB, and possibly a DE. On offense, we just need to mature--and possibly a QB in the draft. I even think RG is covered, but I could be wrong. While our defense and punting teams were on the field way more than the offense, we did well. I agree. We have good rotational depth DTs, but RIvera is about being the best on D. I don't see our offense being the best regardess of who we draft. But a stud CB and a stud DT in the draft and free agency, we are a force on that side of the ball.

In other words, we need a stellar defense to carry the offense through what will be a 2-year maturation process. I see your point, I just think to address the offense based on last season and make fixes is premature. Schwartz came on strong at the end, Lafell and Gettis as well. I have seen too many rookie QBs struggle (Unitas/Pittsbugh, Favre/Atlanta, Elway/Denver, etc.) to give up on Clausen. When a veteran can come in until you find the franchise, I just don't see forcing a QB on the team you are not 100% excited about. I see it as a recipe for disaster. So, instead of throwing out the cake before it was finished baking, I suggest making a good defense great.

[panthers55]

A lot of people speculated about how you could possibly pick up Sam Bradford number 1 when you had a sure thing in Suh sitting there for the taking. After all Bradford got hurt the last 2 times he played and was coming off shoulder surgery. Why in the world would you do that?

Because the world of football evolves around the franchise quarterback. Find one and you are set for the next 10 years. Fail to find one and you will struggle to win consistently in this league no matter how good the defense or special teams. Even teams like Pittsburgh failed to win a Superbowl recently until Big Ben came along.

Where are all the guys who said Bradford was a stretch at number 1 now??

Is Newton a huge risk? That is ridiculous. He is a risk as are all players who have never played in the NFL. Is a quarterback more risky than a defensive linemen? Absolutely. But on the other hand how many teams can attribute their Super Bowl victory to a defensive linemen. Or frankly anybody but a quarterback most of the time.

The merits pro and con regarding Newton have been debated ad nauseum and will continue to be debated until the draft so repeating them here makes little sense. What I will do is present the idea that if he turns out to be Vince Young without the psychological problems I would be very happy. While most folks see him as a cut above Vince Young skill wise, even if that is all he was, here are the results. Vince Young is a 2 time pro-bowler who appears to be mentally fragile. His downfall is not physical or even the abiility to see the field, make good reads, or understand defenses. In his five years in the league he has the follwing stats: 58% completions, YPA- 6.8, TDs-54, (42 passing, 12 rushing), Ints 42, rating 76. If you look at 2010 (8 starts)they were 60% completion, 8.0 YPA, 10 Tds versus 3 Ints and a rating of 98.

So why is he on the way out of Tennesse? He is a head case.

How does this relate to Newton? Instead of worrying about the progressions and reads and footwork the main focus of the Panthers needs to be his maturity, his intangibles, his psychological toughness and willingness to embrace the public scrutiny. If his work ethic is strong and his leadership abilities clear he avoids the pitfalls that caused Young so many issues. If he passes these tests he is reallly not a big risk. Particularly if the team is willing to bring him along and make sure he is ready before he starts in the league.

[MHS831]

I have to agree with you some point in your article..But us not having at QB want make our offense improve.And going out into free agency we can only get and older decent person.Or an all star bench rider who never got to play " Billy Volek ".The only things these guys can give is leadership and the responseability to teach Clausen ,Cam or Gabbert the QB ropes.

I mean we have the first pick in the draft, this is our chance to get a pretty decent QB in Cam or Gabbert. The reason i say decent is because they arent ready to be great yet.Next year we can probably have the 6 or 7 or 8 pick and Andrew luck or Barkleyjust went rite before us. And not again we just missed out on another QB. All im saying is i hope the FO make the right decision because we cant afford a slip up even though we have nothing to lose, because our franchise is down anyway.

Buffalo Bills 2.0

Would not drafting a "decent" qb first overall possibly assure us that we are likely to become the Bills 2.0? Rivera knows defense. The best players in the draft are defensive players. The QB situation is less certain; opinions are all over the place, which suggests risk. If we traded down and took Peterson in the first and DT Paea or Austin in the second, our defense just become a force. Now find a QB. We have cap room and trade bait. Drafting a rookie QB is like trading the pick away because we will not see results this season.

[Bj-Monster23]

No brain fart. I agree with the offensive woes, but we all probably agree that we desperately need 2 DTs, a CB, and possibly a DE. On offense, we just need to mature--and possibly a QB in the draft. I even think RG is covered, but I could be wrong. While our defense and punting teams were on the field way more than the offense, we did well. I agree. We have good rotational depth DTs, but RIvera is about being the best on D. I don't see our offense being the best regardess of who we draft. But a stud CB and a stud DT in the draft and free agency, we are a force on that side of the ball.

In other words, we need a stellar defense to carry the offense through what will be a 2-year maturation process. I see your point, I just think to address the offense based on last season and make fixes is premature. Schwartz came on strong at the end, Lafell and Gettis as well. I have seen too many rookie QBs struggle (Unitas/Pittsbugh, Favre/Atlanta, Elway/Denver, etc.) to give up on Clausen. When a veteran can come in until you find the franchise, I just don't see forcing a QB on the team you are not 100% excited about. I see it as a recipe for disaster. So, instead of throwing out the cake before it was finished baking, I suggest making a good defense great.

Okay I understand that...

[teeray]

A lot of people speculated about how you could possibly pick up Sam Bradford number 1 when you had a sure thing in Suh sitting there for the taking. After all Bradford got hurt the last 2 times he played and was coming off shoulder surgery. Why in the world would you do that?

Because the world of football evolves around the franchise quarterback. Find one and you are set for the next 10 years. Fail to find one and you will struggle to win consistently in this league no matter how good the defense or special teams. Even teams like Pittsburgh failed to win a Superbowl recently until Big Ben came along.

Where are all the guys who said Bradford was a stretch at number 1 now??

Is Newton a huge risk? That is ridiculous. He is a risk as are all players who have never played in the NFL. Is a quarterback more risky than a defensive linemen? Absolutely. But on the other hand how many teams can attribute their Super Bowl victory to a defensive linemen. Or frankly anybody but a quarterback most of the time.

The merits pro and con regarding Newton have been debated ad nauseum and will continue to be debated until the draft so repeating them here makes little sense. What I will do is present the idea that if he turns out to be Vince Young without the psychological problems I would be very happy. While most folks see him as a cut above Vince Young skill wise, even if that is all he was, here are the results. Vince Young is a 2 time pro-bowler who appears to be mentally fragile. His downfall is not physical or even the abiility to see the field, make good reads, or understand defenses. In his five years in the league he has the follwing stats: 58% completions, YPA- 6.8, TDs-54, (42 passing, 12 rushing), Ints 42, rating 76. If you look at 2010 (8 starts)they were 60% completion, 8.0 YPA, 10 Tds versus 3 Ints and a rating of 98.

So why is he on the way out of Tennesse? He is a head case.

How does this relate to Newton? Instead of worrying about the progressions and reads and footwork the main focus of the Panthers needs to be his maturity, his intangibles, his psychological toughness and willingness to embrace the public scrutiny. If his work ethic is strong and his leadership abilities clear he avoids the pitfalls that caused Young so many issues. If he passes these tests he is reallly not a big risk. Particularly if the team is willing to bring him along and make sure he is ready before he starts in the league.

:iagree:

[teeray]

Would not drafting a "decent" qb first overall possibly assure us that we are likely to become the Bills 2.0? Rivera knows defense. The best players in the draft are defensive players. The QB situation is less certain; opinions are all over the place, which suggests risk. If we traded down and took Peterson in the first and DT Paea or Austin in the second, our defense just become a force. Now find a QB. We have cap room and trade bait. Drafting a rookie QB is like trading the pick away because we will not see results this season.

The Buffalo Bills have literally NEVER used their first pick in the draft on a QB. They have used a couple of second picks in the 1st round (hope that makes sense) on some QB's that have failed.

It will be a more accurate comparison to the Bills if we continue to pass on QB's to make "safe" plays.

[panthers55]

Would not drafting a "decent" qb first overall possibly assure us that we are likely to become the Bills 2.0? Rivera knows defense. The best players in the draft are defensive players. The QB situation is less certain; opinions are all over the place, which suggests risk. If we traded down and took Peterson in the first and DT Paea or Austin in the second, our defense just become a force. Now find a QB. We have cap room and trade bait. Drafting a rookie QB is like trading the pick away because we will not see results this season.

How many Superbowls did Pittsburgh win in the last 20 years until they drafted Big Ben in the first round?? Yeah none.

You can make the playoffs without a great quarterback but you can't win the Superbowl anymore. The rules favor the offense too much. Sure you can find an exception here and there but the rule applies.

[Udogg]

Why it is easy to fall for the Cam hype.

His strengths are televised, so we see the 6' 5", 250 lb, 4.59 40 athlete with the million dollar smile and championship ring on TV. We do not see his huge character flaws, greed, lack of football knowledge, humility, or desire to improve. To see these things from home, you have to read between the lines. I see a person who was humbled by the reality of the combine, a man who has ridden the big wave and is the most celbrated surfer on the beach.

The same superior skills that make people want him are the reasons we should not. He has been able to get by on his God-given ability; it has never failed him. When it comes to using his brain and discipline, he will struggle because he never had to.

The opposite of Cam is his rival Tide QB, McElroy, who scored a nearly perfect Wonderlic Test. He has very limited athleticism, but has as many national championships. Nobody is expecting him to be drafted before the fifth round or so. Which trait is more directly linked to success in the NFL? You can't see brians on TV.

Ideally, you need a qb who is smart, rather athletic but not to a point where his athleticism has overriden his brain to get him out of tough spots. More coach and less athlete is usually the key to success. So salivate over Newton if you want, but he is not from the mold of successful NFL QBs; he is from the mold of the best college QBs.

Why do you continually insist that Newton is not smart and has no football knowledge?

[MHS831]

A lot of people speculated about how you could possibly pick up Sam Bradford number 1 when you had a sure thing in Suh sitting there for the taking. After all Bradford got hurt the last 2 times he played and was coming off shoulder surgery. Why in the world would you do that? There are no Bradfords in this draft. I am sure they checked his medical history, but it is a red flag (one) that had to be considered. Newton has several..

Because the world of football evolves around the franchise quarterback. Find one and you are set for the next 10 years. Fail to find one and you will struggle to win consistently in this league no matter how good the defense or special teams. Even teams like Pittsburgh failed to win a Superbowl recently until Big Ben came along. Drafting a developmental QB first overall is not finding one. It is trying to create one. First overall picks should be franchise QBs ready to play. Even then they take their lumps first year.

Where are all the guys who said Bradford was a stretch at number 1 now??

Bradford is not a pro bowler yet. The Texans tried drafting a franchise QB first overall and the pick was criticized. Where are those critics? They now start a third rounder who was developed slowly.

Is Newton a huge risk? That is ridiculous. He is a risk as are all players who have never played in the NFL. This statement ignores a lot of things that concern people that are not characteristic of all NFL players. Is a quarterback more risky than a defensive linemen? Absolutely. But on the other hand how many teams can attribute their Suuper Bowl victory to a defensive linemen. The Ravens Or frankly anybody but a quarterback most of the time. It is a team game. True, the best teams have the best QBs most of the time, but drafting a project with red flags makes a risky proposition riskier. His talent level is not near where you are suggesting we take him. If we could trade down to where his talent level is, we could get a mid first rounder, a second rounder, an third rounder and a first rounder next season. That would do more to build a franchise than taking a gamble and reaching at the same time. People interested in drafting a QB this year are not drafting first overall. If he is worth it, they can trade with us. Desperate people make bad decisions. They lower their standards. Sure we need a franchise QB, but why overpay to have a chance at creating one?

How does this relate to Newton? Instead of worrying about the progressions and reads and footwork the main focus of the Panthers needs to be his maturity, his intangibles, his psychological toughness and willingness to embrace the public scrutiny. Really? I am pretty sure the National Football Conference is more important than the press conference. If his work ethic is strong and his leadership abilities clear he avoids the pitfalls that caused Young so many issues. If he passes these tests he is reallly not a big risk. Particularly if the team is willing to bring him along and make sure he is ready before he starts in the league.

I see some of your points and I want to drink the Kool-Aid too. I just see the first pick as a golden opportunity and am not ready to put that chip on Newton, Gabbert. If I want a developmental QB with a strong arm and excellent mobility, I will take the smarter QB with no character concerns in the second round-Kaepernick. He has the same tools but has not been hyped. Not that I think he is the answer either. I am in favor of trading down to get a second rounder. Peterson in the first, DT in the second. Bring in a veteran (we have cap room) and be patient. After drafting 3 QBs last year, I think a new coaching staff needs to analyze what they have first before venturing out and making their first decision a mistake. Newton's success is a coin toss, which is why so many people argue about him. If we take him, I hope you were right. To me, being right is the least important thing. If I put my mortgage in the pot playing poker and won, I would not ridicule the person who advised against it.

[panthers55]

Why do you continually insist that Newton is not smart and has no football knowledge?

SInce nothing has come out to suggest that and his personal coach has said the opposite it sounds like a preconceived notion. Reports that he struggles with chalk talks were refuted by others which said he was very quick and knowledgeable about where the ball should go and the read progressions.

Bias is when you have strongly held ideas which persist in spite of facts to the contrary. He has a strong bias against Newton that hasn't changed despite evidence to the contrary. So you have to take everything he says about Newton with a grain of salt.

[MHS831]

The Buffalo Bills have literally NEVER used their first pick in the draft on a QB. They have used a couple of second picks in the 1st round (hope that makes sense) on some QB's that have failed.

It will be a more accurate comparison to the Bills if we continue to pass on QB's to make "safe" plays.

So picking QBs second overall is safe?

Humor me for a minute: When I looked to buy my first home, I found one my wife liked. It needed a roof, gutters, and siding, but she loved the yard and the deck and the floorplan. The price was a bit higher than comparables in the area that were not in need of repair. My wife was all about visions of cookouts and children in the backyard froclicking around. I was about business and I was not going to reach because my wife was having emotional hallucinations. I told the agent that I was not paying top dollar for something I will have to fix to get it where I want it to be. I don't care what the neighbors have. They dropped the price of the house about 20% and we bought it. Never had that cookout before selling it.

I am glad I could share that story.

[riddel]

dascreen!