Carolina O vs. Rex's 3-4

[Dash Global]

That same ball control has us averaging 23 points a game which is slightly above last year when we supposedly had a great offense.  And while we don't have as many big passing plays we have fewer interceptions, lead the league in 80 yard drives and in time of possession.  Frankly I will take that over the hit and miss big play offense of last year.

 

 

And if Cam isn't getting the ball out in 2-3 seconds it is still lack of player execution.  I am sure that Shula told him to get the ball out quickly and not hold it.

 

Supposedly had a great offense?!? A great offense is top 5-10 in PPG / YPG. I am pretty sure that we were not close to that. Dont listen to the homers online. 

 

Everyone knows we have a ball control / establish the run / eat the clock offense. No one is gonna be scared of such an offense. 

 

You can take that offense and lose to the likes of Manning, Brees, and Brady every year. Bottom line is if we dont have a top 10 offense then we are not where we need to be on that side of the ball. Period. 

 

We need to be elite on BOTH sides of the ball. 

 

So you must think Cam is mentally retarded if he cant follow instructions and play calling ie throw the ball in 2-3 seconds BEFORE the WR breaks? You cant say its because the WR didnt get seperation as short quick passing game is built on throwing the ball before the WR makes his breaks / cuts. Cam should be throwing into windows where the WR should / will be not where he is. Thus if the WR doesnt do his job the ball would simply be an incompletion or int. That was not what was happening. We were calling the same plays we called all year. None of that is even mentioning Cam taking off running after 3 seconds which he wasnt doing. 

 

Id much rather lose TRYING the right thing. At that point we have done all we can do. Coaches and players. 

[CRA]

He is the problem. As an OC you need to be able to game plan for pressure and a weak OL. ie Practice all week on short routes and getting the ball out in 2-3 seconds.

I dont want to hear about the WR not getting seperation. Until I see Cam throwing the ball BEFORE the WR breaks consistently then I will throw up the hands and say nothing else can be done.

So to recap, Cam needs to

1) Get the ball out sooner 2-3 seconds

2) Throw before the WR breaks

You can't scheme around all holes....not consistently

Talent driven league.

Shula has a weak cast around Cam. Teams can exploit that at times and that doesn't make Shula the problem. Shula is doing a great job playing complimentary football

And to throw super quick.....you need talent that can get open quick. Those also can be high risk throws. QBs generally hate the quick slant bc they are throwing often into the unknown

[CRA]

Supposedly had a great offense?!? A great offense is top 5-10 in PPG / YPG. I am pretty sure that we were not close to that. Dont listen to the homers online.

Everyone knows we have a ball control / establish the run / eat the clock offense. No one is gonna be scared of such an offense.

You can take that offense and lose to the likes of Manning, Brees, and Brady every year. Bottom line is if we dont have a top 10 offense then we are not where we need to be on that side of the ball. Period.

We need to be elite on BOTH sides of the ball.

So you must think Cam is mentally retarded if he cant follow instructions and play calling ie throw the ball in 2-3 seconds BEFORE the WR breaks? You cant say its because the WR didnt get seperation as short quick passing game is built on throwing the ball before the WR makes his breaks / cuts. Cam should be throwing into windows where the WR should / will be not where he is. Thus if the WR doesnt do his job the ball would simply be an incompletion or int. That was not what was happening. We were calling the same plays we called all year. None of that is even mentioning Cam taking off running after 3 seconds which he wasnt doing.

Id much rather lose TRYING the right thing. At that point we have done all we can do. Coaches and players.

About having a scary team.....not just an offense. Can't build a super squad in today salary cap.

Saints have had some record setting offenses before and been middle of the road

[Dash Global]

Some of you really undersell the value coaching and scheme has on football. This isnt basketball. 

 

Ive seen plenty of times a new coach or coordinator come in and take the same under preforming players from a year ago and make them into a new vastly improved unit simply due to scheme and play calling. 

 

Regardless I would rather lose trying the right way than lose playing the same style that is not working. You adjust. If the players cant execute the adjustments so be it. 

 

The bottom line was Shula was not calling specifically designed short routes in the NO game. He was using the same plays / style we used all year.That and him not making Cam take off after 3 seconds.  

 

 

[beastson]

Have we abandoned having D.Will as a check down? I remember in the beginning of our winning streak we started doing it, but I don't recall our RB's doing it lately 

[panthers55]

Supposedly had a great offense?!? A great offense is top 5-10 in PPG / YPG. I am pretty sure that we were not close to that. Dont listen to the homers online. 

 

Everyone knows we have a ball control / establish the run / eat the clock offense. No one is gonna be scared of such an offense. 

 

You can take that offense and lose to the likes of Manning, Brees, and Brady every year. Bottom line is if we dont have a top 10 offense then we are not where we need to be on that side of the ball. Period. 

 

We need to be elite on BOTH sides of the ball. 

 

So you must think Cam is mentally retarded if he cant follow instructions and play calling ie throw the ball in 2-3 seconds BEFORE the WR breaks? You cant say its because the WR didnt get seperation as short quick passing game is built on throwing the ball before the WR makes his breaks / cuts. Cam should be throwing into windows where the WR should / will be not where he is. Thus if the WR doesnt do his job the ball would simply be an incompletion or int. That was not what was happening. We were calling the same plays we called all year. None of that is even mentioning Cam taking off running after 3 seconds which he wasnt doing. 

 

Id much rather lose TRYING the right thing. At that point we have done all we can do. Coaches and players. 

First of all if you look at the superbowl winners it is the team with the best defense not the best offense that wins.  HOw many  times has Manning's top 10 offense won a Superbowl?  How about the Giants when they beat Brady who was undefeated and quarterbacked an offensive juggernaut.  It was defense that won not offense.

 

As for the rest, players know what they are supposed to do and intelligence has little to why it doesn't happen.  It is about player matchups which is all about talent and effort.  Many of those plays we run are actually due to player input most notably Cam. The problems we have on offense are due to a  poor  O-line and average receivers.  No amount of game planning can hide that. 

[beastson]

Btw, 3 straight weeks against a 3-4?????? Come Saints game and playoffs time we better be super ready

[panthers55]

Some of you really undersell the value coaching and scheme has on football. This isnt basketball. 

 

Ive seen plenty of times a new coach or coordinator come in and take the same under preforming players from a year ago and make them into a new vastly improved unit simply due to scheme and play calling. 

 

Regardless I would rather lose trying the right way than lose playing the same style that is not working. You adjust. If the players cant execute the adjustments so be it. 

 

The bottom line was Shula was not calling specifically designed short routes in the NO game. He was using the same plays / style we used all year.That and him not making Cam take off after 3 seconds.  

And you are looking for a scapegoat and always go to Shula and Rivera to find one.  This isn't about having new coaches come in with a different plan or scheme.  This is about a team that has killed everyone at home beating up on us and our players not playing well.

 

When Cam comes up to the line he has options to change the play, use a hot read, dump the ball to the back or throw to the short receiver or wait for a receiver to clear further down the route tree.

 

Of  course you call similar plays to what you used all year. That is what you have practiced and refined over the course of the season.  You basically get 3 days to install your offense in the regular season.  Hardy time to install all kinds of different plays.  Our average yards per pass this year is 5 yards. How exactly do you get that without mostly short passes.

[Cpt slay a ho]

Have we abandoned having D.Will as a check down? I remember in the beginning of our winning streak we started doing it, but I don't recall our RB's doing it lately 

 

i still think it was there, either cam got sacked or the ball got thrown other places, i think stew got hurt on the checkdown for 16 yards

 

 

 

Sidenote: I Don't know how shula gets the blame, it's poor execution period

[Dash Global]

And you are looking for a scapegoat and always go to Shula and Rivera to find one.  This isn't about having new coaches come in with a different plan or scheme.  This is about a team that has killed everyone at home beating up on us and our players not playing well.

 

When Cam comes up to the line he has options to change the play, use a hot read, dump the ball to the back or throw to the short receiver or wait for a receiver to clear further down the route tree.

 

Of  course you call similar plays to what you used all year. That is what you have practiced and refined over the course of the season.  You basically get 3 days to install your offense in the regular season.  Hardy time to install all kinds of different plays.  Our average yards per pass this year is 5 yards. How exactly do you get that without mostly short passes.

 

"or throw to the short receiver"

 

Thats the problem, we need more than 1 short receiver. We need multiple short receivers, 1 deep, to go along with a check down to the RB. 

 

1 short route will not cut it, which if I had to guess is the most we ran on any one play the other night. 

 

I want to see Cam getting that ball out in 3 seconds like Manning, Brady, and Brees do. If not take off running. 

 

This is rocket science. 

[B.BERSIN]

Geno...enough to win the game.

[thefuzz]

It helps to have receivers that can bail you out every now and again.

Our #1 receiver right now is like 5'9. Steve in his younger days could go up and get it, not anymore though.

Getting Cam a taller target or two who are 6'4+ would do wonders for him.

 

Agreed.

 

I was begging to get V Jax in here, but instead we decided to reward another average RB a huge contract.

 

Hurney can Burn.

[Chimera]

"or throw to the short receiver"

Thats the problem, we need more than 1 short receiver. We need multiple short receivers, 1 deep, to go along with a check down to the RB.

1 short route will not cut it, which if I had to guess is the most we ran on any one play the other night.

I want to see Cam getting that ball out in 3 seconds like Manning, Brady, and Brees do. If not take off running.

This is rocket science.

get rid of the ball, by throwing to whom?

Or do you want Cam to be Jimmy Clausen and throw 2/3rds of his passes to the sideline? If You were satisfied by what you saw in 2010, so be it.

When you say "get rid of the ball," maybe you should also post a picture of the field and point out the open receiver.

[Ace_Aladdin]

I think AZ and NO....provide reasonable comparisons to how our team has dealt when faced with the task we will see Sunday.  I know several people have commented Shula can't move the ball against the 3-4.  But, I think those games boil down to one simple thing.

 

Redzone failures.  Not much more.

 

@ AZ 4 - dropped TD, settle for FG

@ AZ 15 - dropped wide open 4th down

@ AZ 11 - interception

 

Game got out of hand late in the 4th.  The INT was a great play but the rest wasn't great defense.....in fact it was often bad defense and we shot ourselves in the foot.  Yet looking back we spin it as shutdown D.

 

@ NO 20 - take a sack, FG

@ NO 6 - incomplete, FG

 

This game was different than AZ.....NO actually scored big points (lots in the 2nd quarter) and for the first time really all year we got forced away from Panther football.

 

So I don't think the 3-4 is the issue....bad redzone days.  I don't think we have a bad one Sunday.  I don't think it is what opponents did as much as just poor play on our part.

 

I think we put up big points in Charlotte b/c offense should get some aid as well for more opportunities.  Rex Ryan doesn't have a Drew Brees to put up points and alter this game (and ultimately what his D will face) so he can talk to his bro as much as he wants.

 

Score TD's and stop playing conservative......We are a far better offense when we attack the defense especially in 3rd & 4th dn........always seems to build the confidence of O and gets it in groove.

 

Idk why we don't run it more in the redzone, we had far more success than passing it.