Panthers in talks w/Josh Norman about extension

[TylerVagyler]

4 years, 32 mil? That's not happening. That'd put him in the top 8 in money for CBs. 

 

EDIT: That's based on 2014 CB salaries. In 2015, he'd be in the top 12-13 range. Maybe more appropriate but still seems like too much for him. I think we'll see something closer to 4 years, 24 mil.

[teeray]

It lowers his salary and total cap hit for that year and converts the salary to more signing bonus which is prorated over the life of the contract. So it does back load that salary amount into guaranteed funds which must be paid which is back loading guaranteed salary. That amount is dead cap money if we cut him. But why would we restructure unless he was performing well at which point we are not wanting to cut him. If you are restructuring to lower his cap hit because his salary and already prorated signing bonus is too high and you can't cut him because the already guaranteed amount would convert to dead cap money, the problem is the guaranteed amount not the salary. You want the majority of what you are paying in non guaranteed funds so you can cut a player without a big consequence.

I am not a capologist but isn't back loading and then constantly restructuring our players the main culprit is having 20+ million in dead money this year?

I feel like restructuring constantly is short sighted. It helps the immediate season but cripples the future.

Again I don't get into the weeds of how all this poo works, that is just how it seems to me

[AU-panther]

It lowers his salary and total cap hit for that year and converts the salary to more signing bonus which is prorated over the life of the contract. So it does back load that salary amount into guaranteed funds which must be paid which is back loading guaranteed salary. That amount is dead cap money if we cut him. But why would we restructure unless he was performing well at which point we are not wanting to cut him. If you are restructuring to lower his cap hit because his salary and already prorated signing bonus is too high and you can't cut him because the already guaranteed amount would convert to dead cap money, the problem is the guaranteed amount not the salary. You want the majority of what you are paying in non guaranteed funds so you can cut a player without a big consequence.

 

Restructuring doesn't change a players future salary, it changes their future cap hit.  That salary is converted to a signing bonus and paid out then.

 

Example:

 

Player A:

2015:       Salary - $10,000,000      Prorated Bonus $5,000,000     Cap Hit:   $15,000,000

2016:       Salary - $10,000,000      Prorated Bonus $5,000,000     Cap Hit:   $15,000,000

 

Player A after restructure:

2015        Salary - $1,000,000        Prorated Bonus $9,500,000     Cap Hit:    $10,500,000

2016        Salary - $10,000,000      Prorated Bonus $9,500,000     Cap Hit     $19,500,000

 

As you can see the players future salary doesn't change during a restructure, his cap hit does.

 

Either way I think we are arguing over verbiage.  My point was, that while I agree with you that the guaranteed salary is an important part of any contract, to say guaranteed salary is the "only" thing that matters is a bit of an overstatement.

 

For example Olsen's cap hit this past year was $7.8m, of which $5.2 was non guaranteed salary.  That salary counted towards our available cap, so it does matter.  If we would have paid him more we would have had less cap space.

http://overthecap.com/player/greg-olsen/1164

[Mol3m4n]

Shutting down Josh Gordon, Mike Evans, and Julio Jones twice to end the year makes up for A LOT of past negatives. Just sayin....

You mean Manziel/Hoyer, Josh McCown and a rookie, and a gimpy Julio?

I love Josh, but I need to see more before I give him over 5/yr.

[Pox 08]

You mean Manziel/Hoyer, Josh McCown and a rookie, and a gimpy Julio?

I love Josh, but I need to see more before I give him over 5/yr.

 

I thought JJ didn't suffer his big injury until after he played the Panthers the first time...  it was during the last few minutes of the Packers game.

 

and the game before  his 2nd match-up with the Panthers,  he unloaded over 100 yards against the Saints.

 

[Kakarot]

Now is the time to lock up any of the young talent they plan on keeping. Lock him up

[Pox 08]

Those of you thinking north of $6 mil are out of your fugging minds.

 

He may turn out to be great, but we all thought Melvin White was the best thing since sliced bread last offseason. He still has a lot to prove and plays behind an exceptional front 7. Maybe 4-5 a year is reasonable.

 

 

 

Not me.   I looked at White the same as I looked at Cason at the start of this past season.   He made some decent splash plays,  but his overall game looked to be lacking. 

 

[Everfrost]

4 year Extend

$22,400,000

avg. $5,600,000 per year 

fully guaranteed $11,800,000

 

And that's high balling but i could see it

[Mol3m4n]

I thought JJ didn't suffer his big injury until after he played the Panthers the first time... it was during the last few minutes of the Packers game.

and the game before his 2nd match-up with the Panthers, he unloaded over 100 yards against the Saints.

The Saints.

[cgarsmoker]

You mean Manziel/Hoyer, Josh McCown and a rookie, and a gimpy Julio?

I love Josh, but I need to see more before I give him over 5/yr.

I'll concede Gordon wasn't playing great before we played Cleveland but you might want to check the stats before you call Julio Jones gimpy. He was dealing with an injury, that is true....the same injury that he had when he torched the Packers and Saint two games prior. Evans had a good season and was putting up good numbers all year with McCown, yet Josh kept him in check.

I'm not saying Josh should get Reavis or Patrick Peterson money but the kid did exactly what we asked him to do. I'm not one to think you have success by default of the other guy but that's just my opinion.

[Mol3m4n]

I'll concede Gordon wasn't playing great before we played Cleveland but you might want to check the stats before you call Julio Jones gimpy. He was dealing with an injury, that is true....the same injury that he had when he torched the Packers and Saint two games prior. Evans had a good season and was putting up good numbers all year with McCown, yet Josh kept him in check.

I'm not saying Josh should get Reavis or Patrick Peterson money but the kid did exactly what we asked him to do. I'm not one to think you have success by default of the other guy but that's just my opinion.

I'm just saying I need to see more. Sure those are some big names, but there are also some big circumstances around those names.

[Pox 08]

The Saints.

 

That really doesn't address the first match-up.

[Mol3m4n]

That really doesn't address the first match-up.

Maybe it doesn't. I'm not saying Josh didn't have good games.

[Pimpdaddy]

...This is were Hurney would go full  retard...Gman understands Normans worth..Norman needs to understand his worth...