Mike n Mike talk team building

[Mr. Scot]

1 minute ago, Krovvy said:

I think you misunderstand. I never even acknowledge your ad-hominem attack, or at least I tried.

Since it's all you have left though I will point out that your knowledge as a "Football Historian" has been lacking in this thread. Missing quite a few key instances of history such as how much resources Marty Hurney spent on drafting offensive lineman, as well as how much cap room the Panther's had in 2014.

Keep calling me a kid, I don't mind. Just don't get all red faced next time someone points out your fallacies, while showing you how inadequate your football knowledge is.

Not red-faced at all, kid. You don't have that kind of sway.

Bored though? Very.

[grimesgoat]

2 hours ago, TheRed said:

Are you under the assumption I'm arguing the OL is the sole factor in our woes or something? Big hint here chief, I'm not. In fact I've never said that anywhere at any point this season

But many of our issues along the way have more often than not centered around the inadequacies of our offensive line. If you want to argue that with me, you are honestly beyond reasoning with, there is wearing homer shades, and then there is just flat out self deception.

Anyway, if you think our OL wasn't "destroyed" in the season opener while the defense was able to tee off all game on our QB, particularly with blatant helmet to helmet shots in what became one of the worst beatings I've ever seen any quarterback endure, well, either you were watching a different game, or you are trying way too hard to downplay it's significance. If our OL wasn't so vastly over matched in that game, and others, it wouldn't likely have had to come down to depending on Ray Fink.. I mean, Graham Gano to kick the winning field goal.

I was only under the  assumption you thought OL was the sole factor because you said

"That OL that "went 17-2" only coincidentally got destroyed in the biggest game in the history of our franchise. Then got destroyed again months later by the same team... "

In our first game of the year OL gave up 3 sacks to probably the best pass rushing team in the NFL. Cam took a beating because their defensive players chose to dive at his head instead of going for a legit tackle.  It would be nice if Cam could hang out in the pocket for 10 seconds while our receivers tried to get a little separation, but unfortunately that's not really how football works.

Its really not that I have my homer shades on.  Maybe you could outline specifically what you would have done differently. Its only 1 offseason so it should be easy.  I assume Oher would not be on your line - who would you replace him with?  Who else is replaced on the line?  You have no money and the 31st pick.  Ready, go.

[TheRed]

15 minutes ago, grimesgoat said:

I was only under the  assumption you thought OL was the sole factor because you said

"That OL that "went 17-2" only coincidentally got destroyed in the biggest game in the history of our franchise. Then got destroyed again months later by the same team... "

In our first game of the year OL gave up 3 sacks to probably the best pass rushing team in the NFL. Cam took a beating because their defensive players chose to dive at his head instead of going for a legit tackle.  It would be nice if Cam could hang out in the pocket for 10 seconds while our receivers tried to get a little separation, but unfortunately that's not really how football works.

Its really not that I have my homer shades on.  Maybe you could outline specifically what you would have done differently. Its only 1 offseason so it should be easy.  I assume Oher would not be on your line - who would you replace him with?  Who else is replaced on the line?  You have no money and the 31st pick.  Ready, go.

Ah the old condescending, "well name every move you would have made or your opinion is invalid" response. That's new.

I'm not going to look through a complete list of every FA OL in 2016, but I can tell you the first move. Oher or no Oher, and that is removing Remmers from the equation. He has been our worst offensive lineman going all the way back to SB50.

If we can trade for a 35 year old punter, I see no excuse why we couldn't have gotten a starter to replace Remmers, and some extra depth at tackle.

It really is amazing to me how some people always have the same excuses for Gettleman, who doesn't even speak during the season, but every week we get the same threads from mouth breathers about Cam Newton, or Kelvin Benjamin, or James Bradberry, Mike Shula, Ron Rivera, or whichever player/coach the huddle decides is the next whipping boy for our struggles. But any criticism of Gettleman is met with "well what would you have done then mr. smarty pants, huh..HUH????". It's quite pathetic.

[iamhubby1]

3 hours ago, Kakarot said:

Not really trying to jump in this conversation, but I kind of wanted to address the bold. Wasn't our line in max protection a good majority of the season 2015? If that's the case, isn't that suggesting our line wasn't as great as the numbers suggested? Isn't that admitting that we knew the line needed some help, so we brought in extra men to help with protection? So, technically we knew the line wasn't that good.

Great conversation going on in here, by the way.

 

Quick answer, everyone max protects.

 

Long answer, without access to play calls, it is almost impossible to know if we max protect any more than other teams.

 

My thinking is, Panther fans see it from us, and like other things going on right now, they tend to see the worse case. We saw a lot of blitzes last year, coupled with injuries, it was just safer to max protect.

 

There is a lot that goes into when you max pro., so it really is tough to know where we stand compared to other teams. Atl. max protects a lot, but they leak their RB a lot as well. Oakland went to 6 lineman to help protect Carr. If you pressure Brady, they keep adding blockers until they slow you down.

 

Until someone can come up with the numbers to show how often every team max protects, I am going to say we don't do much more than the average team. It just seems like it to us Panther fans, because it is our team.

 

I will say this. In his first 5 years, Cam ate up the blitz. So teams backed off on them. This year the blitz worked against us, a lot. So we did probably max protect more this year than in years past. Maybe that is where this is all coming from.

 

[grimesgoat]

5 hours ago, TheRed said:

Ah the old condescending, "well name every move you would have made or your opinion is invalid" response. That's new.

I'm not going to look through a complete list of every FA OL in 2016, but I can tell you the first move. Oher or no Oher, and that is removing Remmers from the equation. He has been our worst offensive lineman going all the way back to SB50.

If we can trade for a 35 year old punter, I see no excuse why we couldn't have gotten a starter to replace Remmers, and some extra depth at tackle.

It really is amazing to me how some people always have the same excuses for Gettleman, who doesn't even speak during the season, but every week we get the same threads from mouth breathers about Cam Newton, or Kelvin Benjamin, or James Bradberry, Mike Shula, Ron Rivera, or whichever player/coach the huddle decides is the next whipping boy for our struggles. But any criticism of Gettleman is met with "well what would you have done then mr. smarty pants, huh..HUH????". It's quite pathetic.

Lol. I'll take that as a "I have no clue".

Anyone can whine.  I was genuinely hoping for an original thought. 

[Jangler]

slow simmer

lol

[TheRed]

11 hours ago, grimesgoat said:

Lol. I'll take that as a "I have no clue".

Anyone can whine.  I was genuinely hoping for an original thought. 

You're over here typing "lol" as an actual response to an in depth football discussion, but you're the foremost authority on "original thoughts"?

Here's an original thought for you, don't quote someone if you can't handle a different opinion.

[Jangler]

18 hours ago, TheRed said:

Ah the old condescending, "well name every move you would have made or your opinion is invalid" response. That's new.

I'm not going to look through a complete list of every FA OL in 2016, but I can tell you the first move. Oher or no Oher, and that is removing Remmers from the equation. He has been our worst offensive lineman going all the way back to SB50.

If we can trade for a 35 year old punter, I see no excuse why we couldn't have gotten a starter to replace Remmers, and some extra depth at tackle.

It really is amazing to me how some people always have the same excuses for Gettleman, who doesn't even speak during the season, but every week we get the same threads from mouth breathers about Cam Newton, or Kelvin Benjamin, or James Bradberry, Mike Shula, Ron Rivera, or whichever player/coach the huddle decides is the next whipping boy for our struggles. But any criticism of Gettleman is met with "well what would you have done then mr. smarty pants, huh..HUH????". It's quite pathetic.

lol you really are pathetic. Everyone was to blame for this past season. 

Now if you are looking for one person to blame?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

lol

[TheRed]

1 hour ago, Jangler said:

lol you really are pathetic. Everyone was to blame for this past season. 

Now if you are looking for one person to blame?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

lol

Ya know, I just don't think I'm going to take advice about being pathetic from some middle aged deadbeat that has been stalking some chick he's never met since she was in high school.

You don't want this battle again Jangler.

It's the weekend. You don't really wanna get clapped up this early in the day, do you?

[heel31ok]

On 1/12/2017 at 10:17 AM, Kakarot said:

They weren't discussing how to build around a superstar LB, though. They were discussing building around a superstars QB. What does the last sentence have to do with anything?

Specifically how would they do it...

[arbnranger]

Bump because I like the battles going on in here.

Good stuff, keep it going. 

@Jangler

@Krovvy

@TheRed

Called out last

 

[arbnranger]

Also @heel31ok called you out @Kakarot

[Killa Cam 69]

On 1/12/2017 at 10:14 AM, Ivan The Awesome said:

Gettleman got here in 2013. Having to get to work on the cap hell that strapped the panthers for years. He cleared it up. Getting KB, Funch, Trai, Ginn, Norwell, Remmers, Oher on a budget was all he could do. What do you expect with little to no money? The little wealth that was available can only be spread out so much. He's got money now. let's sit back and see what he does. If he doesn't do anything this off season to help Cam, then I'll definitely grab a pitch fork and march with ya'll. 

Agree 100%