Training Camp for 7/29/2024

[strato]

I’d just as soon have kept PJ as what they did.

Edited July 30, 2024 by strato

[ForJimmy]

1 hour ago, strato said:

Chunk plays are 20 plus. 

About deep balls. If I am at the 20 facing the end zone. I’m in the Red Zone. Throwing to the goal line makes it a deep ball? 

So 20 is deep. And 40 is deep. And 50 is deep.  It doesn’t really synch up to my way of looking at things. 20 has to be medium to me.  

 

A deep pass is usually at least 20 yards according to PFF. I mean you are getting into a quarter of the entire field past that. This isn’t including YAC obviously. 

A deep pass by PFF standards is any pass that is targeted and travels at least 20 yards in the air, past the line of scrimmage.

https://www.pff.com/news/pro-pff-signature-statistics-a-glossary#:~:text=A deep pass by PFF,past the line of scrimmage.

[strato]

I would never use that standard. Don’t care what they say. PFF, pfff..  This is sort of like what is left or right of center politically, the goal posts shift according to the goals of the person setting the boundary lines. 

I really can’t agree to this 20 yard standard because it completely devalues a true deep ball. 40 inthe air, or in PJ’s case, was it 63? It was crazy. Ansd it wouyld only rate ‘the same as a 20 yard throw. That just doesn’t work for me and it has absolutely nothing to do with Bryce Young. Really, it doesn’t. Which, I get that a Young fan would be fine calling 20 yards downfield ‘deep’ but I don’t think the world would make that a standard just for him. So I am not saying that is the reason.

I think ‘chunk plays’ serves to fill the gap and reward thew 20 yard type of stuff.

Edited July 30, 2024 by strato

[strato]

oops

Edited July 30, 2024 by strato

[Jackie Lee]

9 minutes ago, strato said:

I would never use that standard. Don’t care what they say. PFF, pfff..  This is sort of like what is left or right of center politically, the goal posts shift according to the goals of the person setting the boundary lines. 

I really can’t agree to this 20 yard standard because it completely devalues a true deep ball. Which, I get that a Young fan would be fine calling 20 yards downfield ‘deep’. 

According to PFF Brock Purdy was the best deep ball thrower last season. 

 

[ForJimmy]

7 minutes ago, strato said:

I would never use that standard. Don’t care what they say. PFF, pfff..  This is sort of like what is left or right of center politically, the goal posts shift according to the goals of the person setting the boundary lines. 

I really can’t agree to this 20 yard standard because it completely devalues a true deep ball. Which, I get that a Young fan would be fine calling 20 yards downfield ‘deep’. 

NFL typically considers anything 20 plus in the air past the LOS a deep pass. You have to think these QBs are 5 plus yards behind the LOS on most plays so the ball is typically traveling over a quarter of the field in the air before any YAC happens. Here is the NFL trying to quantify it

https://www.nfl.com/news/next-gen-stats-top-10-nfl-deep-passers-of-2022-geno-smith-tua-tagovailoa-excel-a

One a side note people talking about Young’s 55 yard pass making Johnson slow down need to realize some HOF QBs max out in the 60s and that’s without accuracy/timing. 

In the 20 minute mark they do a deep throw challenge with the QBs trying to keep their passes in bound and they have running starts. Manning was 69 and 65 maxed out. Expecting these 50 yards passes like it’s something normal is a bit extreme (I know you weren’t the one doing it).

[strato]

7 minutes ago, ForJimmy said:

NFL typically considers anything 20 plus in the air past the LOS a deep pass. You have to think these QBs are 5 plus yards behind the LOS on most plays so the ball is typically traveling over a quarter of the field in the air before any YAC happens. Here is the NFL trying to quantify it

https://www.nfl.com/news/next-gen-stats-top-10-nfl-deep-passers-of-2022-geno-smith-tua-tagovailoa-excel-a

One a side note people talking about Young’s 55 yard pass making Johnson slow down need to realize some HOF QBs max out in the 60s and that’s without accuracy/timing. 

In the 20 minute mark they do a deep throw challenge with the QBs trying to keep their passes in bound and they have running starts. Manning was 69 and 65 maxed out. Expecting these 50 yards passes like it’s something normal is a bit extreme (I know you weren’t the one doing it).

Yeah okay. I need better than lumping a 20 yard throw in with a 50 yard dime. For instance.

There is a difference, okay? It can be rather large.

NFL, PFF, DGAF, ESPN, none of them ask me but they should because they have it wrong. 

Edited July 30, 2024 by strato

[strato]

10 minutes ago, Jackie Lee said:

According to PFF Brock Purdy was the best deep ball thrower last season. 

 

Did you see that thing about his injury rehab actually strengthening his arm?

[ForJimmy]

1 minute ago, strato said:

Yeah okay. I need better than lumping a 20 yard throw in with a 50 yard dime.

There is a difference, okay? It can be rather large.

NFL, PFF, DGAF, ESPN, none of them ask me but they should because they have it wrong. 

Lol I get it. I think a 50 dime is just a freaking highlight play. It’s like it’s own thing. I mean that’s launching the ball half of the field on the money. 

[ClawOn]

Incredible content from @Icegefollowed by pages of "Bryce sucks" posts. Too bad really.  Anyway, thanks @Icege

[strato]

5 minutes ago, ForJimmy said:

Lol I get it. I think a 50 dime is just a freaking highlight play. It’s like it’s own thing. I mean that’s launching the ball half of the field on the money. 

And there are people who can do that. Like one of 5 or something. And at 40 the odds are better. 

I am not asking for that but at the same time don’t want to settle for that ‘20 yards is a deep ball’ thing.  

good night

Edited July 30, 2024 by strato

[ForJimmy]

1 minute ago, strato said:

And there are people who can do that. Like one of 5 or something. And at 40 the odds are better. 

I am not asking for that but at the same time don’t want to settle for that 20 yards is a deep ball. 

The time needed, scheme needed, and WR needed for a 50 yard pass to be a normal thing is pretty rare. I think sometimes they just launch it up and the elite WR like Hill track it down. It’s an amazing thing no doubt but definitely not a typical deep ball. Think of a deep pass as a 3 pointer and a 50 yard pass as a Curry/Lillard logo 3 pointer. 

[Jackie Lee]

16 minutes ago, ClawOn said:

Incredible content from @Icegefollowed by pages of "Bryce sucks" posts. Too bad really.  Anyway, thanks @Icege

Hey most people wait til practice is over so the first 5 pages are clean. Every message board thread eventually turns to poo one way or another, it's by design

[PappyMay]

Sign me up for 20yard passes all day. I’m just trying to see those chains move.  If we can hit 1 of those a quarter this year it will be a vast improvement to what we saw last.