The Case for(or Against) Drafting/Signing a TE

[PleaseCutStewart]

With the many needs we have on defense, I'm against TE unless some brock bowers freak talent is there to draft 

[kungfoodude]

4 minutes ago, PleaseCutStewart said:

With the many needs we have on defense, I'm against TE unless some brock bowers freak talent is there to draft 

The Oregon TE is probably the best candidate.

I rather doubt he will be available at our pick.

[PleaseCutStewart]

4 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

The Oregon TE is probably the best candidate.

I rather doubt he will be available at our pick.

I don't think he is anywhere close to Bowers talent. Then again, Bowers is one of the best TEs ever to come out in the draft.

Haven't looked at the TEs in this class, but I say just roll with what we got for next year. Get the defense fixed between edge rusher, edge setter DE, linebacker, and cover specialist free safety 

[kungfoodude]

1 minute ago, PleaseCutStewart said:

I don't think he is anywhere close to Bowers talent. Then again, Bowers is one of the best TEs ever to come out in the draft.

Haven't looked at the TEs in this class, but I say just roll with what we got for next year. Get the defense fixed between edge rusher, edge setter DE, linebacker, and cover specialist free safety 

Oregon TE is probably a better blocker on day 1 than Bowers was. Possibly a better athlete(TBD).

But, we have seen those types not flourish before.

[PleaseCutStewart]

4 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

Oregon TE is probably a better blocker on day 1 than Bowers was. Possibly a better athlete(TBD).

But, we have seen those types not flourish before.

I'm always worried about Oregon skill position players because of the gimmicky offenses they run.

I haven't watched much of Oregon this year, but I honestly can't think of any Oregon TEs they have been successful in the NFL. All I know is that we had some mediocre at best ones on our team like Ed Dickson and Dante Rosario in the 2000s...

[kungfoodude]

7 minutes ago, PleaseCutStewart said:

I'm always worried about Oregon skill position players because of the gimmicky offenses they run.

I haven't watched much of Oregon this year, but I honestly can't think of any Oregon TEs they have been successful in the NFL. All I know is that we had some mediocre at best ones on our team like Ed Dickson and Dante Rosario in the 2000s...

Lol. I mean 95+% of college offenses are gimmicky. 

[Mr. Scot]

3 hours ago, kungfoodude said:

Lol. I mean 95+% of college offenses are gimmicky. 

Anymore? Yeah, pretty much

[strato]

I’d give it another year for Sanders and Evans, I don’t much care what you do with Tremble’s spot. Let him have another year or maybe replace him. Haven’t looked at his contract so that may be the determining factor. 

[frankw]

24 minutes ago, strato said:

I’d give it another year for Sanders and Evans, I don’t much care what you do with Tremble’s spot. Let him have another year or maybe replace him. Haven’t looked at his contract so that may be the determining factor. 

Evans is still in his first year so the learning process is still in full swing. Tremble and Evans should have a firmer grasp to say the least. But as critical as we can be of the group and the ridiculous inconsistency we should keep coming back to Canales. Where is the development? As I said in another thread he needs to relinquish playcalling duties and focus on the the moving parts of the team as a whole. His stubborn resistance to this is going to end with him getting fired. Just my opinion.

[strato]

3 minutes ago, frankw said:

Evans is still in his first year so the learning process is still in full swing. Tremble and Evans should have a firmer grasp to say the least. But as critical as we can be of the group and the ridiculous inconsistency we should keep coming back to Canales. Where is the development? As I said in another thread he needs to relinquish playcalling duties and focus on the the moving parts of the team as a whole. His stubborn resistance to this is going to end with him getting fired. Just my opinion.

I think the, or A big rub there is Idzik and what do you do with him? Canales will not want to be disloyal I don’t think, and if Canales doesn’t call plays well someone has to and it seems like that would mean new OC.
 

Which is another damned can of worms. That only makes sense to me, or it make way more sense, if we change QBs. You don’t change the system  and spend that time in almost certain regression with this barely capable QB. 
 

I was never hot on Canales and there are some negatives no doubt but I think at this point you keep stuff intact.  I would get him a QB to work with that isn’t some unicorn. 

 

[frankw]

7 minutes ago, strato said:

I think the, or A big rub there is Idzik and what do you do with him? Canales will not want to be disloyal I don’t think, and if Canales doesn’t call plays well someone has to and it seems like that would mean new OC.
 

Which is another damned can of worms. That only makes sense to me, or it make way more sense, if we change QBs. You don’t change the system  and spend that time in almost certain regression with this barely capable QB. 
 

I was never hot on Canales and there are some negatives no doubt but I think at this point you keep stuff intact.  I would get him a QB to work with that isn’t some unicorn. 

 

Idzik at this point is an afterthought and should be regarded as such going forward.

In terms of Canales as playcaller there's just nothing I've seen to suggest that he is or will ever get to the caliber of a Sean McVay or Andy Reid where you say to yourself this guy should always be calling plays. The only coaches he's truly outcoached in top to bottom blowouts are guys like Raheem Morris and Antonio Pierce. Not impressed.

There's nothing wrong with having a capable OC and many teams in the league operate this way just fine.

We'll see how it all shakes out though.

[raleigh-panther]

23 hours ago, kungfoodude said:

In general, Dave Canales tends to target his TE's the least frequently of any position group(WR/RB/TE) during his three years of running an NFL offense. 

However, if you notice this percentage has crept up over time. 2025 is the first year that TE has eclipsed RB in target percentage.

Production has also gone up in 2025. This is a percentage of total output in each category.

Canales has always used a very TE heavy offense. In fact, on average his offensive formations are 2 or 3 TE sets roughly 80% of all offensive formations.

So, the question may be, with this uptick in total TE output, could an elite or top tier TE make a significant impact? I believe there is some evidence this may be the case. Here are a look at TE snaps and Cade Otten specifically. These are the snap percentages for all rostered TE's in every Dave Canales offense.

The bolded cell is Cade Otten's whopping 96.46% of total snap counts in the single year he was in the Dave Canales offense in Tampa. This was overwhelmingly his career high. His production was higher with less utilization in 2024, however. 

 

In conclusion, while I don't anticipate ever seeing a top 5 producing/Pro Bowl caliber TE performance in a Dave Canales offense, there does appear to be some evidence that an actual upgrade in our TE room would actually lead to increasing overall offensive efficiency. I think Otten's utilization rate does indicate that the splitting of time between our relatively even TE group would cede significant snaps if a far superior option were available. I believe this is an area we could(and should have this past offseason/draft) made a more concerted effort to get a dynamic TE threat, after the apparent failure that J. Sanders appears to have been.

 

Woukd be a great addition You know the issues

from my prespective, 2 things the Panthers must do

1. Edge or pass rushers

or 2 oline

or 3 oline

or as Andy Reid says, when in doubt, draft a lineman

it is time   That oline is troubling plus a small person at QB 

they  

1. Can do a lot better than mayes at center,

2. and lewis has had injuries all season.
3. Moton should not have  been resigned long term,

4. corbett is a shadow and will probably be released 

5 and Christianson coming off Achilles  

6 and the kicker, would be Ickey’s contract if they decide to keep him

INMO rookie and contracts will be needed to offset all that 

[kungfoodude]

1 hour ago, strato said:

I’d give it another year for Sanders and Evans, I don’t much care what you do with Tremble’s spot. Let him have another year or maybe replace him. Haven’t looked at his contract so that may be the determining factor. 

Tremble is leaps and bounds better than Sanders. At this point, there is really no reason to have him even playing significant time. Just put him on special teams/3rd TE and hope he eventually develops. If it doesn't happen by the end of his contract, let him walk.

[strato]

12 minutes ago, frankw said:

Idzik at this point is an afterthought and should be regarded as such going forward.

In terms of Canales as playcaller there's just nothing I've seen to suggest that he is or will ever get to the caliber of a Sean McVay or Andy Reid where you say to yourself this guy should always be calling plays. The only coaches he's truly outcoached in top to bottom blowouts are guys like Raheem Morris and Antonio Pierce. Not impressed.

There's nothing wrong with having a capable OC and many teams in the league operate this way just fine.

We'll see how it all shakes out though.

I understand that a capable OC is desirable but I also understand, or think I might, the dynamics with the staff and maybe I’m wrong but I do not see Canales firing his offensive right hand guy without significant pressure from Morgan or Tepper to do so. 
So that, in addition to Canales stating pretty definitively, that he was keeping play calling.  
 

I don’t know what you do in that circumstance. It would need to be important enough to you to make it worth firing Canales to get your OC play caller. 
 

To that, if Canales not being good so far at play calling (and we only have the one year in TB to factor with what we have see here), is accepted as a given, it is only fair and honest to consider what an impediment having to construct and administer an offense around Bryce Young’s game would be to an OC. I would say it is a big complication, big surprise there. 

You won’t know about Canales 100% until you remove Bryce from the equation and get him a clean slate to create from - without the Bryce restrictions. 
And yeah you will likely end up without a top notch high flying offense. But it still *could* be much better than it is now. In the right hands. 
So that is potentially what we’re looking at.

I suppose we could keep Bryce and bring in a college style coach and design a Bryce rollout offense or something and see if that helped. I am not in favor of that, probably the last thing I would want. 

We could do nothing, which I am not in favor of. We could fire Canales and keep Bryce (my least preferred option). We could get rid of both, which I would begrudgingly accept but would lament the interruption of the continuity that a 3rd year would provide. 
You could get rid of Bryce and get a couple of new QB prospects in here, vets, drafts, whatever… that would be my choice. 

I am afraid I know how it’s gonna go. All I can really say about that is, there has not been a single time in three years that I looked at the upcoming game and felt like we were gonna win because we have Bryce Young playing QB. Because of what he could do with the ball in his hands. Not once. Sure there have been a handful of games that he was part of the reason we won, a couple he was a big part, but not enough times to feel like that is my expectation. At best, it is cross your fingers and hope for good Bryce.