Bear Hands

That's the Fray, not Ed Sheeran

Panthers minicamp thread about...the Titans and Will Levis. Nice.

Gotta say, I really liked what I heard in DJJ's interview today. Both him and Mingo seem like really hard-nosed/tough but smart & students of the game type guys. Maybe he's got some goods to provide. https://www.panthers.com/video/dj-johnson-i-m-here-to-keep-improving

I’m somewhat going out on a limb but I just think Tremble has made an impact nearly every time we ask him to grab the ball. Even if he’s not TE1 in a big capacity for the offense, I think he’s a perfect guy to have here and could very well grow into an all-around type. Especially being a TE, they notoriously take time to develop. He’s basically a rookie with experience. A mid-3rd rounder at that. He’s a guy I’m willing to back even though it seems many are lukewarm on him. He had a fantastic route and TD against TB near the close of the year. He just seems to make stuff happen.

Well, agree to disagree. I know what I'm trying to say but to each their own if your don't share optimism about either. All good. He will remain at most TE2. And in that capacity, likely top out at a Trey Burton type level. But I think he can elevate a bit more past a Burton type.

I'm really not. I'm also not saying he's going to have some superstar year either. There's simply some nice reasons to be optimistic about him. He's still going to have a high percentage plays with blocking assignments. I'm also specifically explaining how he's more of a blocking TE role that has the capacity to become a strong receiving threat. Never once extrapolated for a full season or said TE1s don't block. I'm simply stretching out his two seasons in context for modest hype, not saying he's coming up on some 800/7TD year.

One thing is for sure, I really hope Bryce start off hot and we take care of NO week 2 on national TV. Dalton knows that defense and can no doubt get him primed for that game.

Let's also not forget Tremble's first 3 touches as a Panther: -30 yard reception to set up a TD -A Goal Line Trickery Rushing TD -A Receiving TD He makes plus+ plays when he's given the ball.

Thanks. I just think these are two Rhule-era picks in particular that cannot be written off. Others can, see: Yetur. Tremble was a high selection for a TE and they take time unless they're an aberration. Add in that he can block & catch just fine, and is now seasoned, I think he has a HUGE opportunity with us not drafting one from this class. Fitterer even called him out specifically in a post-draft presser that they were fine not drafting a TE due to the confidence they have in Tremble. I like to hear that, especially considering we have a new coaching staff in house and that determination no doubt came through their assessment as well as Scott's.

As we start to get excited about this rookie class and recent acquisitions, I wanted to shed a light on these two. Why? Well it's because they've essentially been redshirting (for lack of better term) as early-entry juniors & in a position where they needed time to ease in. Not to mention, the coaching & QBs sucked. And what is wild: Being early-entries (that are already young for their class) they are both only 22 years old; younger than the average draft age in both 2022 (24.11) and 2023. I'll get to TMJ, who has had some healthy discussion already this offseason. But First off let's talk Tommy Tremble (3rd Rounder) #83 Overall 2021 If he came out this year, he would've been: 6th fastest, 3rd best vert, 6th best broad, 2nd best 10 yard split (crazy burst for a "blocking" TE). Tests VERY similarly to Brenton Strange who was just drafted Round 2, 61 overall. Now, our "awful" TE group the last few years has made people either dismiss or just kind of push aside Tremble. When in reality, he's honestly done rather well when thrown the ball & brought in to block. Being so young, his grades as a TE won't be perfect, but they are on the plus side, he's proving to be a willing and tough blocker, athletic and has got great quickness to get open early for a TE. A little history to not forget: Tremble played alongside both Michael Mayer & Cole Kmet for ND at different parts of his career. That program knows TEs and he never had the chance to really be a major target. At 22, he's 2 years younger than Kmet and only 11 months older than Michael Mayer. The dude is 6'4 250, the Kittle H-Back mold (they're similarly sized/framed, with Tremble a tad more athletic-type), has consistently graded favorably in pass protection when called upon. Not to mention, has managed to make plays in a TE2 role with 3 TDs & 5+ 20 yard receptions on 31 targets last season. So, athletic, a gritty/willing blocker, has proven solid receiving skills and capable of making splash plays. And is going into his 3rd year--which is really the big one for TEs. They are notorious for not coming out of the gates swinging. They take time. Now, I'm not expecting some monster year, Hurst is our starter, but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't still excited about Tremble. Not looking for some superstar, but I think what he's capable of really making strides this year and is being far overlooked. For context: A single season snaps average for a starting TE is around 950-1,000 snaps. Tremble has just over 1,000 in his career, only 550 non-blocking. His majority snaps have come in 2 TE sets as an extra run blocker. So! in that roughly half-season's worth of snaps, he has 39 rec, 354 yards and 5 total TDs. And that was from 60 overall targets (from our awful QB room), & 19 of those receptions were 1st downs. I know Ian Thomas is this sore, and we've had guys like Manhertz hogging snaps that we can't look past, but I'd caution in lumping Tremble into this perceived awful TE room we've had. He's had time to adjust to the NFL in one of the positions that's known to have the toughest adjustment curves. I'm still very optimistic about him and honestly, I think he'd have gone between Strange and Kraft in this draft. Terrace Marshall Jr Our QB play, coaching and offensive schemes did him no help. 6'3 200, Averaged 104 ypg for LSU in 2020, with Burrow, JJ, or Chase no longer in house. And with them, was able to take in 13 TDs in the most decorated offense in NCAA history. In comp to this years draft: 4.38 40 (t-4th fastest), 39.5 vert (T-5th), 19 bench (5th) This past year, the QB rating when targeting TMJ?: 102.3 In 1,069 career snaps, has only had 635 on passing downs, at best as a WR2 (mainly WR3 behind Robbie in 21'), in 3+ WR sets. He's managed 45 rec, 628 yards, 1 TD coming from PJ Walker, Sam Darnold, Baker Mayfield, Jacob Eason, & Cam Newton's corpse. Honestly, he just hasn't been given the environment to prove the type of player he can be. He was ranked a fringe 1st/high 2nd by many for a reason, and just like Tremble, I'm staying optimistic. Don't look past these two. 2023 could prove to be big for them. We're getting all hopeful about other young guys, who will have a curve to adjust to. These 2 are now caught up to the speed of the NFL, with little tread, and the same age as Mingo. Let's go

Yeeeppp, between the length/catch radius these guys have and speed, Bryce has a really awesome platoon. I can see how people on the outside looking in may look at it as a JAG type group, but it is set up really well for Bryce. Not to mention, Mingo, TMJ and Thielen can all flex between the outside and slot. Chark strictly outside. Thielen knows how to get open even at his age. He's not outrunning guys anymore/isn't his 20s self, but he's a perfect vet to have. The rest, it's all super promising with some caveats: Chark-Injury Bug: He could play his way into a multi-year contract if he gets over the injuries. And it's not impossible, there's a lot of examples of guys who had early career bugs they shook out into 7+ year careers. Not to mention he's already a proven top-30 WR in the league when healthy. TMJ-Playing Time/Young: TMJ is 2 years younger than a lot of guys that were just drafted. He was young for his school year and was a true-Junior declare. He's essentially redshirted 2 years and ready to show if he's the fringe 1st rounder TD machine he was sold as. Mingo-As Unproven Rookie: We just have to wait and see with him, but I have a really good feeling with him over so moany past prospect. Why I'm more sold on him than others is his stories about how much of a student of the game he is. That shows commitment to the profession and a guy that wants to win. Shenault-Gadget or true WR?: One thing is for sure, he can be a playmaker and play every spot at WR. Another fringe 1st type eval taken in the 2nd. We have 4 of these types from their respective draft classes. I think he's an asset to keep. He's perfect to get the ball quickly to and let him run w/it. Then you have Shi & Byrd to battle out for the shifty guy you quickly get open.

Don’t forget Chark and TMJ are both sub 4.4 guys. Faster than Shi.

Depth signing in May. Already have like 9 OL so it’s not like this means much.

NFL.com had him as a 3rd-4th rd projection. TDN a 4th. Brugler a 4th/5th. Bottom line is we landed someone that we targeted and wanted via trade-up--that combined with being a perceived reach makes it a bit unique. Being that specific, targeted trade-up to 80 using 93 and 132 is simply what makes people irk. If we waited and he was there at 93, I think it would be bit more digestible. But, I mean, considering it was just #132 used, at that point in the draft, odds become so slim. Why not just use 132 to land a guy you want rather than wait for the best available guy that falls to 93? Sure, it was a bit reach-y & it will be mildly annoying if he's a mid-round miss, but we've had plenty of those and should be used to them. Although Brady C. is working out so we should wait and see. My 2 cents is that they clearly weighed the EDGE need more than BPA after picking Mingo, which made this a need-based pick given other positional talent available. Our guys clearly had him in mind over Diaby, McGuire, KJ, etc. at EDGE, so I don't think what we did is too detrimental or anything. The big, calculated move in this draft was taking Mingo which greatly impacted our need v. BPA scale. It tells me we didn't have many trade takers at 39 and went with our #1 offensive weapon available. I have to think MicDonald IV & Derick Hall were two we really wanted on defense. Awesome length, high upside, good Burns compliments. The run-D capable EDGE was the huge need, and as great of an EDGE class this was, the ones strong in run defense were much more limited/and went early. Those two had the traits Fitt kept describing at edge defender. Once both were gone, that changed our strategy completely. We did not have guys like BJ, Tuli, Foskey, White rated highly enough to consider over Mingo or worthy of that 39 selection. Changed the whole direction of the draft. EDGE is a highly valuable spot in our new defense and I can't imagine we're set banking on a competition between DJJ and YGM. Evero's old pal in Leonard Floyd makes too much sense in my opinion.

Wasn't planning to say much bc this is a silly thread--but we managed to land the #1 pick in the draft (a new franchise QB) & our WR group is in a fine spot with Thielen/Chark/Mingo/TMJ/Shenault/Shi/Byrd. And then pick wise, we're just missing a 1st next year and a 2nd the following. We did what we needed to do while still positioning ourselves to compete and not tear anything apart. Taking more Ls required tearing more apart than simply shipping away DJ in a deal. Our GM comes from the always compete Seattle mindset. Tanking was never happening under Fitterer/Morgan management. No use in getting all bent about it if you accepted it wasn't happening and just enjoy Sundays for what they are in late fall.

He's at the least, a person in more ways than one (Name and general existence)

Bumping this because Person predicted 4 of our 5 draft choices correctly. Young, Mingo, Zavala & DJ Johnson. Even if not in near their actual slots, that's pretty impressive.

Oh my lord...

I really hope the AFC pummels a team like the Titans or Raiders into a pulp so that teams like the Commies and Bucs lose out on their rather obvious quest for Caleb or Drake.

This is one of those minor yet really important things. Seems simple enough but we haven't had a Center-QB combo that could effectively communicate and call out protections and make solid presnap judgements since 2018. You saw the boost when Bozeman replaced Elflein, and he helped our lackluster QBs make some good calls. But now having both a QB and Center capable of effectively making presnap reads is huge. Bozeman & Young being here and developing a report is awesome. Haven't had that since Cam-Kalil. It was one of Cam's more underrated traits IMO.

Man, if we hit here, the entire conference is up for grabs to compete w/Philly. Let's f*cking go!

So when he transferred from the prep school in Pasadena to Mater Dei, his morning commute became a MONSTER. I get why he said traffic.

Also didn't realize he grew up in Pasadena. For those wanting some really good reads on his background: https://210prepsports.com/2021/12/13/alabama-quarterback-bryce-young-becomes-first-pasadena-athlete-to-win-heisman-trophy/ https://people.com/sports/bryce-young-everything-to-know/

Yeah he was raised well. Very excited to see what he can do. May have found someone VERY special.

I like the production on this. Good stuff with the new franchise man. Ricky & Morty fan. Likes Nobu, big sushi fan. J Cole. Seems like a cool dude.