ex-GM Michael Lombardi on Gettleman situation

[Jangler]

8 minutes ago, SmartyHurney said:

the panthers were back to 6-10 last year, and another top 10 pick added to this franchise.

the panthers have been out of cap hell since 2014 before he tagged Greg Hardy. tho even after the tag Dave had enough to sign an entire new WR corps and defensive backfield, which was necessary after cutting or letting walk so many players.

 

remember folks the cap increased 44 million, by over 10 million per year under dave. on the other hand during hurneys last four seasons the cap actually went down.

[Proudiddy]

I'm just very indifferent at this point.  If Hurney stays, what will change?  As I've stated ad nauseam, there was literally no difference in Hurney and Gettleman's performance when it came to meaningful results - Gettleman could not put together consecutive winning seasons, and neither could Hurney.  Yeah, Hurney destroyed the cap, but likely at JR's beckoning.  Gettleman cleaned it up, but went way too far over the line and made negotiations personal while generating a bad reputation for our organization, which wouldn't help our situation long-term either.  His extreme negotiating style also directly resulted in last season's horrible showing.  Yes, Gettleman could find talent, but he wasn't doing the front worm, our scouts were, he just made a final decision, and he made some good ones.  He also made some bad/unnecessary ones.  Same could be said for Hurney, and subjectively, I have to say, if Gettleman would've been the GM when we picked Cam and Luke, I doubt those we would have both or either.  So, credit needs to be given where credit is due, as does criticism.

But again, I refer back to the meaningful outcomes...  neither could sustain success.  So, again, ultimately, I'm unmoved.  If Hurney learned nothing and everyone's worst nightmare comes true and the same old Hurney is named the permanent GM, then what really changes?  Nothing.  It just confims that our team is poorly run and will always struggle to sustain success, no matter the GM.  So, that's the floor...  I'm looking for the ceiling.

[TheSpecialJuan]

yikes!

[NanuqoftheNorth]

34 minutes ago, Proudiddy said:

there was literally no difference in Hurney and Gettleman's performance when it came to meaningful results

Gettleman, in just 4 years, equaled the franchise's number of conference and division championships won during the previous 18 years combined.

Literally no difference in meaningful results? Yeah right. 

It is all about the championships, everything else is chaff.

[Proudiddy]

1 hour ago, NanuqoftheNorth said:

Gettleman, in just 4 years, equaled the franchise's number of conference and division championships won during the previous 18 years combined.

Literally no difference in meaningful results? Yeah right. 

It is all about the championships, everything else is chaff.

Meaningful, as in differentiating...  still couldn't win in any consecutive seasons and 0 Superbowl Championships.  And for all his "winning" it was with Hurneys core.  

Like I said, yes, it's subjective and my own opinion, but I doubt Gettleman would've even taken Cam if he had been GM during that draft.  So, again, credit where credit is due.  I'd give Gettleman more credit if he hadn't sabotaged us multiple times by cutting/releasing the best player at a position because his feelings were hurt...  can't so much blame 7-8-1 on any one thing directly, but 6-10 was without a doubt, his fault.

But, I know it's pointless to debate it because many have now made Gettleman some sort of demigod and refuse to acknowledge for all he did right, it could be argued he did just as much wrong.  We will just have to agree to disagree.

 

 

[Saca312]

"Gettleman sucks because he wasn't GM when we drafted Cam and Luke so obviously Hurney's the one for the reason we're so successful lol hur-dur."

Do people not even realize how stupid this argument is? That has nothing to do with what Gettleman can or can't do. He decided to build our roster around these two talents, and worked slowly to do so with a horrible cap situation. 

For Luke, he worked by getting him a ferocious set of DTs and front four to help him. For Cam, he worked by giving him one of the league's best interiors and working within the cap restraints to get him some quality tackles and half servicable receivers.

No GM in their right mind would come in and not try and build around a core that's already in place. But that core wouldn't work without the right players around them.

But I guess it's Gettleman's fault he didn't come in a situation where he had to literally rebuild an entire team with no core, right? And it's his fault he didn't find superstars at every position with a terrible cap, right?

Some of you guys amaze me with your stupidity.

[panther4life]

11 minutes ago, Saca312 said:

"Gettleman sucks because he wasn't GM when we drafted Cam and Luke so obviously Hurney's the one for the reason we're so successful lol hur-dur."

Do people not even realize how stupid this argument is? That has nothing to do with what Gettleman can or can't do. He decided to build our roster around these two talents, and worked slowly to do so with a horrible cap situation. 

For Luke, he worked by getting him a ferocious set of DTs and front four to help him. For Cam, he worked by giving him one of the league's best interiors and working within the cap restraints to get him some quality tackles and half servicable receivers.

No GM in their right mind would come in and not try and build around a core that's already in place. But that core wouldn't work without the right players around them.

But I guess it's Gettleman's fault he didn't come in a situation where he had to literally rebuild an entire team with no core, right? And it's his fault he didn't find superstars at every position with a terrible cap, right?

Some of you guys amaze me with your stupidity.

Only on the huddle will Gettleman go down as one of the greats at GM after taking a 15-1 team and letting them plummet to 6-10. Jerry wants a consistent winner. Thats all he and the fans are asking for. Gettleman proved uncapable of doing so. It is clearly that simple. 

[NanuqoftheNorth]

Hurney for whatever reason was incapable of building a team with any meaningful depth.

Other teams are able to plug and play, lose a  player, in comes another without hardly missing a beat.

Gettleman, was able to find players on the cheap to build greater depth than what we were used to seeing around here.

Once again, was he perfect?  No, but Gettleman's results were better than Hurney's and in less than half the time.  

So both Dave and Marty have had their turn as GM.  

At the end of the day, Dave produced more championships in 4 years than Marty did in 10.

Did Dave benefit from Marty's picks (after producing the worst team in football)?  I'd agree that he did, but I'd go on to say that Marty benefitted from Seifert's picks as well.  Dan Morgan and Steve Smith are pretty significant pieces of the puzzle and they weren't the only ones.

No matter how you look at it, if you value winning as a football fan, Marty oversaw some of the worst years in franchise history leading to his departure. I can't recall of another franchise that recycled a GM, certainly not one with such a mediocre track record as Marty Hurney's.

[pantherphan96]

Gettleman might have been doomed from the start. How do you make business decisions without stepping on the toes of players who feel entitled to huge extensions just because they had a close personal relationship with the prior GM?

The most disgusting thing about this to me was not even the thought that JR pushed out GMan, but at how quickly former players (even ones who left on good terms like Tolbert) were willing to poo on GMan after he got fired. Not that I had much respect for DWill anyway, but it was disappointing to see Smith, Norman and Benwikere pile on. Especially because Norman's agent was more to blame for his departure than GMan.

[frash.exe]

11 minutes ago, pantherphan96 said:

Gettleman might have been doomed from the start. How do you make business decisions without stepping on the toes of players who feel entitled to huge extensions just because they had a close personal relationship with the prior GM?

The most disgusting thing about this to me was not even the thought that JR pushed out GMan, but at how quickly former players (even ones who left on good terms like Tolbert) were willing to poo on GMan after he got fired. Not that I had much respect for DWill anyway, but it was disappointing to see Smith, Norman and Benwikere pile on. Especially because Norman's agent was more to blame for his departure than GMan.

idk i guess it's because tolbert wanted gettleman to like caress his shoulder and ask mike to grow old with him that day he took him in the office to talk about his performance. i guess they've forgotten what profession they work in. maybe they should work for buzzfeed if they want their workplace to be a safe space.

as far as deangelo goes, he's probably still pissy that new expectations that gettleman brought with him cut into his totino's pizza roll eating/wwe 2k15 playing time.

[SmartyHurney]

11 minutes ago, NanuqoftheNorth said:

Hurney for whatever reason was incapable of building a team with any meaningful depth.

Other teams are able to plug and play, lose a  player, in comes another without hardly missing a beat.

Gettleman, was able to find players on the cheap to build greater depth than what we were used to seeing around here.

Once again, was he perfect?  No, but Gettleman's results were better than Hurney's and in less than half the time.  

So both Dave and Marty have had their turn as GM.  

At the end of the day, Dave produced more championships in 4 years than Marty did in 10.

Did Dave benefit from Marty's picks (after producing the worst team in football)?  I'd agree that he did, but I'd go on to say that Marty benefitted from Seifert's picks as well.  Dan Morgan and Steve Smith are pretty significant pieces of the puzzle and they weren't the only ones.

No matter how you look at it, if you value winning as a football fan, Marty oversaw some of the worst years in franchise history leading to his departure. I can't recall of another franchise that recycled a GM, certainly not one with such a mediocre track record as Marty Hurney's.

That's sort of bullshit considering Gettleman decimated the Panthers wide receiver corps, and defensive back field twice. And has left question marks on the offensive line ever year he was with the Panthers. He also at one point destroyed the punt return/kick return specialists and had players like Brenton Berson attempting to field punts and failing. And god only knows what the tight end group would look like without Olsen, absolute garbage depth there as well.

He was good at stacking the defensive line interior, and linebackers. Where else has he created depth? The only other place I can think would be the runningbacks, but really he's just maintained depth. 

Dave also traded away too many draft picks to develop depth. The Panthers have had to least amount of drafted players since he's taken over. Yeah, he signed lots of guys in free agency, most who weren't on the team the next season, but he had too because of having the fewest draft picks in the league, and deciding to destroy a position group of his choosing after every winning season.

[Snake]

Trust me they better hope they win this year because it's going to snow ball after that. Rivera will not be able to say a word to players and it will ultimately get him canned. We will be back in cap hell and players will once again be laughing as we go 6_10 every year while sitting on fat contracts while the fans suffer. 

[SmartyHurney]

3 minutes ago, Snake said:

Trust me they better hope they win this year because it's going to snow ball after that. Rivera will not be able to say a word to players and it will ultimately get him canned. We will be back in cap hell and players will once again be laughing as we go 6_10 every year while sitting on fat contracts while the fans suffer. 

lol panthers went 6-10 last year with 20 million in the rainy day fund

[Cpt slay a ho]

If dg was so good he'd still have a job, it's a couple guys he rubbed wrong and they happened to be some of the best players at there position and in panthers history, he got by doing it for long enough, his drafting and finding talent in undrafted fa's was his best attribute besides cap navigation. The over hyping needs to die.

 

 

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