Jump to content
  • Welcome!

    Register and log in easily with Twitter or Google accounts!

    Or simply create a new Huddle account. 

    Members receive fewer ads , access our dark theme, and the ability to join the discussion!

     

Did we win yesterday or what??


panthers55

Recommended Posts

the thing is, i don't think there's anyone unaware that we're playing uninspired football, yet everyone feels the need to jump up and down and point it out.

It's like if you were visiting a loved one at the hospital trying to be positive but staying realistic and you had a bunch of yahoos screaming "but you don't understand!!! The cancer is advanced!!!! She doesn't have more than a 10% chance to see the end of the month!!!!"

exactly!!!!!!!!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Herein lies the major issue...

A lot of us KNOW what this team is capable of talent-wise...

Yet week in and week out, we go out and lay an egg, even if it's a sloppy win...

That is the frustrating thing about this team and organization as a whole.. The refusal to see the obvious because of pride in past success...

I completely agree with you on this. But your last line is what I feel is the most revieling to both sides of this issue. You are also refusing to see the obvious, a win, because of pride in past success.

Like always, the truth is found somewhere in the middle.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I completely agree with you on this. But your last line is what I feel is the most revieling to both sides of this issue. You are also refusing to see the obvious, a win, because of pride in past success.

Like always, the truth is found somewhere in the middle.

Don't get me wrong... I am pleased with the win... But the way I look at it is that it's just a wrong number calling as you're being strapped into the electric chair... You get a brief repreive, but your fate is inevitable...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Herein lies the major issue...

A lot of us KNOW what this team is capable of talent-wise...

Yet week in and week out, we go out and lay an egg, even if it's a sloppy win...

That is the frustrating thing about this team and organization as a whole.. The refusal to see the obvious because of pride in past success...

Everyone sees it including Fox. And if anyone thinks he isn't doing everything he can to fix it, they are crazy.

What Fox is simply tired of is all the negativity and constant complaining even when we win. No one is resting on their laurels but so far when one aspect does well another suffers. We haven't been able to get all aspects of the team working at the same time. And Fox knows like anyone does, saying anything to the media just feeds the frenzy and will be used against you at a later date. I wouldn't even speak to the media unless I had to and I expect he feels the same way.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Don't get me wrong... I am pleased with the win... But the way I look at it is that it's just a wrong number calling as you're being strapped into the electric chair... You get a brief repreive, but your fate is inevitable...

At this point we aren't even on death's row let alone the chair. Way too soon to be saying anything. With the exception of one ill-advised throw and a break down in coverage yesterday, things went fairly decent. Certainly nothing to throw in the towel yet.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Don't get me wrong... I am pleased with the win... But the way I look at it is that it's just a wrong number calling as you're being strapped into the electric chair... You get a brief repreive, but your fate is inevitable...

Great analogy!

I also think for many, including myself, we still want to look at the negatives more than the positives because we want Fox, Delhomme and Hurney gone. If we don't find something to complain about it feels like we are supporting them in our celebration of the win.

I think the frustration on this board and among fans in general has reached at point that they would rather see the Panthers loss so Fox is gaurenteed to be fired than to see them win and Fox possibly get a repreive from the governer only to see the season still get electricuted.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

At this point we aren't even on death's row let alone the chair. Way too soon to be saying anything. With the exception of one ill-advised throw and a break down in coverage yesterday, things went fairly decent. Certainly nothing to throw in the towel yet.

John, you should be discussing what to do about Jake and not posting here...

:)

Seriously though... As long as Jake remains the starter, and nothing is done to improve what is wrong with our team INTERNALLY, then we won't be doing any better than 6-10 or 7-9 this season...

Not facing that reality is doing nothing but harm to your fan-dom...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree with Panther55. Also, I can't for the life of me understand why people are expecting blowout wins. It hardly ever happens no matter how much better we are than the other team. I mean really, how many teams in the last 5 years have we blown out? Our style doesn't cater to those types of wins.

I recommend everyone TIVO the games and then watch them again after the emotion has died down. The passing game is more than Jake throwing the ball.

Lets look at them:

1. Jake missing some reads, poor accuracy and locking on to receivers.

2. No separation by the receivers on passing routes. Mushin is getting press covered all day because no one worries about him beating them deep.

3. Poor play calling. We need to scrap some tendencies in certain situations and run some altered routes.

4. Poor pass protection. Our line blocked slightly better than last week, but look at Tom Brady's pocket and look at Jake's pocket.

5. No speed at receiver position. Other than SS and maybe rosario there are no mismatches on the field. That leads to shifted coverages.

I think it's a total team failure in the passing game and hopefully we can work it out.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yup, despite our best efforts we won - we beat the Bucs who are the "Washington Generals" of the NFL right now.

During the course of our "glorious" victory yesterday, we spotted them 14 points and had to become totally one-dimensional to hide our QB so we could beat them. If we were playing a decent opponent the way we played the Bucs yesterday, I feel fairly confident we would have lost.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Everyone sees it including Fox. And if anyone thinks he isn't doing everything he can to fix it, they are crazy.

What Fox is simply tired of is all the negativity and constant complaining even when we win. No one is resting on their laurels but so far when one aspect does well another suffers. We haven't been able to get all aspects of the team working at the same time. And Fox knows like anyone does, saying anything to the media just feeds the frenzy and will be used against you at a later date. I wouldn't even speak to the media unless I had to and I expect he feels the same way.

i really don't think they are doing everything they can do to win. they are doing everything they want to and hoping that it will eventually work. i honestly don't believe that the playcalling and/or jake is going to put this team over the top. i'm not sure what it is but there is ssomething very wrong with the passing game. opposing players have been saying for weeks that they know what the team is going to be doing, that it is predictable. fans have been noticing this. now moose is starting to notice something and say something about it. this was in one of reed's columns from yesterday...
After the game he tried to shed some light on the problem, saying opponents seem to be getting tipped off to the Panthers passing plays.

And, obviously when a defense knows a pass is coming, it’s easier to defend.

“From what I’ve been seeing defenses are dropping a lot more guys into coverage and, I don’t know if it’s based on our formations, or the quarterback’s drop or what kind of keys they’re getting, but the safeties have typically been reading and then trying to drop back into coverage and reading pass,” Muhammad said.

“Something is giving them a pass key and they are just double-teaming the pass. It doesn’t always start off like Cover 2, but it winds up in Cover 2 or some sort of man with Cover 2, that kind of thing.”

That’s a problem good coaches will figure out eventually.

link

that last sentence is the kicker. people have been saying that for a good while but still they have their tells.

is it jake or the playcalling? i think both are creatures of habit. they make a change or find something that works and then they keep doing it over and over and over thinking that since it worked once or twice that they can keep doing it every game.

whatever the problem is, they need to fix it.

my hope is not that they can just beat the easy teams...my hope is that they become dominant. i don't care who is throwing the ball or coaching the team...i just want to win. if they can't get the job done, get someone who can.

right now they aren't going to get it done with the liabilities that they have. they are improving but there is a whole lot more that they need to fix before they can be deemed respectable.

i just want them better and overlooking the bad stuff....i just can't do it.

i like that they re-established the run yesterday. i like that the defense looked much better and that hollis thomas is on the scene, that hayden was inactive, and that peppers is really kicking it in high gear. i want to see it against a good offense but right now i'm just happy that the redskins and bucs didn't make the defense look bad.

we still had to forge a comeback because of that pick6 and the return for a touchdown. we still have huge problems on special teams and in the passing game.

i want those problems fixed. i want the panthers to be the best and to be competitive against the falcons and the saints. i don't want those dogs to have their day. the panthers, the way they have played this year, aren't going to be able to stop the falcons and saints and aren't going to be getting into the playoffs.

i'm pissed that this team isn't better. i'm pissed that this team has put themselves in some bad situations and that it took them this long to even see what the problems are.

i don't think that they will do what needs to be done if that means switching out the QB or firing crossman and getting someone her who knows something about special teams. i don't think that fox has the guts to do it.

he used to but now he's just hoping that what he has done in the past will work. he is timid. that won't win games anymore. i hope he proves me wrong. i just have very little faith that he will.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.


  • PMH4OWPW7JD2TDGWZKTOYL2T3E.jpg

  • Topics

  • Posts

    • If we miss out on Freeling or Lomu, I don't think we take a serious stab at LT this draft. We might take a RT that they think could project to the other side in the mid rounds, but overall, it's a bandage and won't fix the issue if Ickey doesn't return to form form the injury I've mocked it over and and over, it's these two guys or we should pass on LT altogether.   It's a great draft if you need a RT, super deep, but starting caliber LTs are very thin this year.
    • Greetings Huddlers.  Here is my annual analysis of the offense pre-draft in my attempt to predict and understand moves made draft weekend, which is upon us!  I analyze my views on each position and might suggest why I think the Panthers will do what they will do.  This is not my opinion (but there is some bias in it) but more of an educated guess based on the little we know. Quarterback: Gonna start with a conspiracy theory—probably nothing to discuss. It seems that we are going with Bryce, but there was a somewhat interesting statement made about Bryce’s contract.  Morgan (I believe) stated that they would look into Bryce’s contract after the draft.  That probably means that he is busy, but I found it interesting that Draft Kings shows the Panthers as the sixth, “most likely” team to draft Ty Simpson, based on betting lines.  Acquiring Kenny Pickett and moving Andy Dalton to Philly creates another dynamic that could signal some draft day (or post-draft day) drama.  Hurts situation in Philly might have necessitated the Dalton move (again, nothing much more than speculation), but the Panthers taking a younger, former first rounder (I know) could possibly signal a QB competition–depending on what we do draft day.  It seems to me that they are hoping to bring in a UDFA, based on visits.  This is not to say that Bryce is stagnant.  He has improved, and with weapons and a fortress in front of him, he could be better.  I never understood how a QB of his ilk would not have a stud receiving TE and a stud Z WR–he has had neither. Heck, if you cover TMAC like you should with man under and S over the top, you can play zone vs. whoever is playing Z (XL).  So maybe they know something we do not; based on TV coverage, it is hard to see what Bryce sees–how open are his receivers?  They know their jobs are riding on Bryce. In my view, the contract should not be fully guaranteed–the devil will be in the details.    Running Back:  The Panthers were right to let Dowdle walk.  Two RBs on expensive contracts with Brooks possibly emerging as a third option is fiscally irresponsible.   In my view, you make you RBs better with better OL play.  Yes, there are players like CMC etc, but Dowdle peaked here, in terms of historical data that shows RBs peak and start rapidly declining between ages 27 and 28.  Chuba is 26, fwiw, and a tremendous locker room leader. I get it. With Brooks, Etienne, and Dillon behind him, we have a pretty full RB room.  This suggests that they feel good about Brooks.   Tight End:  Personally, I think this draft has some potential at the TE position, and I am not sure that the Panthers will address both Z WR and TE–but I feel they will address one of them.  In my view, I would focus on the Z and give TE another year.  Reason?  Evans showed some promise and will enter year 2.  Sanders has been a bit of a disappointment, but he has potential as well (year 3).  Tremble has been tremendous as a blocker and is actually catching a few passes.  Sadiq would be nice, and there are some solid TE options in this draft, but I am afraid we’d be getting more of the same.  If you draft players on day 3, like all of our TEs, it seems that you need to develop them before casting them aside.   Center:  We are probably more respectable at the C position for 2026 than people realize.  Fortner is basically the equivalent of Cade Mays at a third of the price.  They are about the same age (27 and 26).  Luke Fortner is an center for the Carolina Panthers who earned a 66.5 overall PFF grade in the 2025 season, 18th among 40 qualified centers. He played 678 offensive snaps on the season. Fortner’s  PFF pass-blocking grade of 72.5 ranked 7th among 40 qualified centers in 2025. His run-blocking grade of 65.3 ranked 19th at the position.          Compare that to Mays, who was 24th among 40 qualified centers. He played 726 offensive snaps on the season.  His PFF pass-blocking grade of 69.4 ranked 13th among 40 qualified centers. His run-blocking grade of 58.5 ranked 33rd at the position.  Fortner is actually an upgrade, based on these numbers. To me, the mystery here is Nick Samac, who was originally drafted by the Ravens. The Panthers protected his roster spot last season, something I thought was interesting.  Word on the street is that they like him, but how much?  Samac is a great run blocker for a 24-year old; his issues are in pass protection.  We want to focus on the run, but with a dwarf at QB, we need the middle of the OL to hold up.  If Samac learns to widen his base and get good leverage, we could have a starting-caliber center on our hands at some point.  Is Samac why we let Mays walk?  Is Samac the reason Fortner only got a one-year deal?   Maybe, just maybe, Center is not a huge need.  I think we draft one, but maybe not as soon as you might think.     Guard:  Hunt and Lewis are solid—and expensive–and knocking on the door of 30.  Hunt was injured for most of 2025, but Lewis was very solid.  Lewis: His PFF pass-blocking grade of 79.7 ranked 3rd among 81 qualified offensive guards. His run-blocking grade of 73.1 ranked 14th at the position. Contractually, there is not much we can do if we wanted to move on.  Hunt will count $24m against the cap; Lewis about $17m.  However, in 2027, when both are turning 31, we could save $19m (of $24m) on Hunt’s deal if we cut him post June 1 and $13m of Lewis’ deal if we cut him at any time.  At the same time, Bryce’s big money will kick in, making these moves nearly inevitable. Do not be surprised to see us draft a G this year.  Zavala sucked when he played, and you can expect two 30-year old guards to get banged up. Saahdiq is probably their top reserve guard, and he has been a bust since being drafted in round 4 by Washington.  We need someone for depth in 2026 and possibly to start in 2027.   Tackle:  Ekwonu in 2025: earned a 69.9 overall PFF grade in the 2025 season, 36th among 89 qualified offensive tackles. He played 942 offensive snaps on the season.  He was below average as a pass blocker in 2025 and above average as a run blocker.  (Sure sounds like a Guard BEFORE the injury).He allowed 40 total pressures in pass protection. That total included 5 sacks and 6 hits allowed to opposing pass rushers. He was flagged for 7 penalties over the course of the season.  These numbers are far from elite. However, since he needs the better part of a year to recover–and since we might need 2 guards in 2027, why not give him an incentive-laden GUARD contract and move him to his natural position?  I think I do that, realizing that he can play outside in a pinch (see Wharton, Travelle).  So when I consider Ickey’s return, considering his contract etc. I do not see a return to OT–guard is his position now.   Walker, in my view, was the steal of free agency for the Panthers.  No, he is not an all-star, but he can play at a level I will call “average” for the LT position. In 2025 for the Packers, he earned a 64.6 overall PFF grade, 52nd among 89 qualified offensive tackles (slightly below average). He played 986 offensive snaps on the season.His PFF pass-blocking grade of 70.0 ranked 42nd among 89 qualified offensive tackles (average). His run-blocking grade of 55.4 ranked 71st at the position (well below average). He allowed 34 total pressures in pass protection. That total included 5 sacks and 1 hits allowed to opposing pass rushers. He was flagged for 9 penalties over the course of the season (very similar to Icky–better in pass pro, much worse in run blocking).  Moton: Our best offensive lineman by far. Moton earned a 80.5 overall PFF grade in the 2025 season, 15th among 89 qualified offensive tackles (above average). He played 901 offensive snaps on the season. His PFF pass-blocking grade of 76.5 ranked 21st among 89 qualified offensive tackles. His run-blocking grade of 81.9 ranked 12th at the position (Moton is elite). He allowed 22 total pressures in pass protection. That total included 3 sacks and 4 hits allowed to opposing pass rushers. He was flagged for 5 penalties over the course of the season.  Moton and trainers have been monitoring a “Chronic” knee condition (common in older OL). Moton feels that he can keep playing.  In my view, he can be cut after 2026 (post june 1) and the team would save $19m of his contract at age 33.  Depending how he plays and holds up in 2026, that is a real possibility.   Stone Forsythe: Sounds like a comic book detective.   Wide Receiver:   The Panthers are met with 105 position players in some way (from visits to pro day/combine meetings etc) 2026 Panthers Draft Visits Tracker”There are six potential first round picks on the list–four of them are wide receivers—KC Concepcion, Omar Cooper Jr., Denzel Boston, and Jordan Tyson (personal workout). Concepcion is from Charlotte, so the Panthers almost had to host him for a visit. It’d be an interesting allocation of resources to use three straight first-round picks on wide receivers, especially when an undrafted free agent has already usurped one of those first-round picks. The visits from projected Day 2 players are all over the map. Again, multiple wide receivers appear.  Of the 105 position players the Panthers met with, 15 were Wide Receivers.  They are doing their homework at Wide receiver.   Tetairoa McMillan earned a 78.7 overall PFF grade in the 2025 season, 21st among 81 qualified wide receivers. His PFF receiving grade of 78.7 ranked 23rd among 81 qualified wide receivers (well above average). He hauled in 70 receptions on 120 targets for 1,014 receiving yards and 7 touchdowns. McMillan averaged 14.5 yards per reception on the season.  He generated 271 yards after the catch, demonstrating his ability to create with the ball in his hands. He was charged with 7 drops on the year (clean that up, TMac). His average depth of target was 12.3 yards, reflecting his role in the passing attack.  TMac is a strong X WR.  Jalen Coker: Before the last 7 games of 2025 (beginning Nov 16, 2025), Coker had 66 yards on 7 catches.  After that date, Coker exploded during the final 8 games (including the playoff game) for 462 yards in 35 catches. We need him healthy but he is a stud folks.  The best hands on the team–I would go as far as to say Ricky Proehl hands.  Yep.   Xavier Legette earned a 52.6 overall PFF grade in the 2025 season, 79th among 81 qualified wide receivers (rock bottom). His PFF receiving grade of 54.7 ranked 78th among 81 qualified wide receivers.(still on the bottom) He hauled in 35 receptions on 59 targets for 363 receiving yards and 3 touchdowns. Legette averaged 10.4 yards per reception on the season.  He generated 74 yards after the catch, demonstrating his ability to create with the ball in his hands. He was charged with 1 drop (improvement). His average depth of target was 11.0 yards, reflecting his role in the passing attack.  His contract is not steep (under $4m) and it is fully guaranteed. Financially, it makes no sense to cut him based on the fact that we knew he was raw when we drafted him. The improvement in drops suggests that he is coachable, but his comments during pressers give me anxiety about his mental state. Let him compete. John Metchie III:  Maybe he needed another season with another team–a reunification with Bryce?  Not sure two drowning swimmers can pull each other back into the boat. At any rate, it is worth a shot. Low Risk, high reward?   John Metchie III is a wide receiver for the Carolina Panthers who earned a 57.6 overall PFF grade in the 2025 season, 74th among 81 qualified wide receivers. His PFF receiving grade of 58.7 ranked 73rd among 81 qualified wide receivers.He hauled in 33 receptions on 48 targets for 274 receiving yards and 2 touchdowns. Metchie III averaged 8.3 yards per reception on the season.  He generated 144 yards after the catch, demonstrating his ability to create with the ball in his hands. He was charged with 4 drops on the year. His average depth of target was 5.5 yards, reflecting his role in the passing attack. Jimmy Horn:  They really do not throw it downfield to Horn much—just a reverse, screen guy.  I think there could be more.  He caught 11 passes of 13 targets (1 drop) in 2025 for 120 yards.  In comparison, fwiw, Steve Smith caught 10 passes (20 targets) for 154 yards during his rookie season.  Give him some time. Brycen Tremayne: Tremayne is one of those UDFAs that you root for.  A big (6’4” 212) WR with football intelligence (Stanford), Tremayne quietly had 160 yards in 2025 (14 catches/17 targets).  Not a super star, but an active special team player who can make plays on offense.   Overview:  If I am the Panthers, I forget about Ickey and Moton beyond 2026 as tackles. I pencil in Ickey at Guard and hope that he heals. Having said that, it is quite possible that our entire OL is different by 2027.  Hunt and Lewis will be 31 and their contracts will be ending (cuttable).  Our current starting center (Fortner) will be a free agent.  Our current starting LT will be a free agent.  Yikes. To make matters worse, Bryce’s expected contract (hard to say this) will make free agency an unlikely source for talent.  We need to start building the next room now. Does that mean first rounders?  Of course not.  Most of the guys in the first round this year would not have been last year–so grab kids that are risers “but not there yet.”  This draft is good at the bottom for OL talent–just not great at the top.  Take a few days 2-3.  Not ideal, but you can’t force it.  I think we kept Tremayne (WR) as a key backup, but he is a good fourth WR who can move inside and create mismatches, much like a pass-catching TE–so I do not expect TE in this draft unless we dive in early–Sadiq.  Developing your young talent is a better risk, imo.  Sanders has not scratched his potential and Evans showed some signs.  Tremble is getting better. If they think XL is about to turn the corner as the Z WR, they might go TE, but XL is, according to PFF, one of the worst WRs in the league.  Coker? On an opposite trajectory.  We need a Z WR more than we need a TE, so if we focus on needs on defense (S, LB, DE) and the offense (WR, OL) I am not seeing the luxury of adding a TE to play before our developmental players can reach their potential.  We really have no established depth at WR behind TMac and Coker, so expect a Z in the draft–early. I think they are going with Chuba, Brooks, Eteinne, and Dillon for now at RB.  QB?  It sure looks as though the are going to grab a UDFA to be the emergency QB.  One will fall out of the draft that has the potential to stick in the NFL–which is why we brought them in for visits–we want that team to be us.  I think this is the best evidence that we are “all in” on Bryce.   Predictions:   Round 1:  WR: I still think this is the biggest possibility for round 1 if you go by position.  A rare talent from Oregon (TE or S) could be the pick if the WRs don’t fall, and the same can be said for OL or DL.  This draft is very challenging, but the tea leaves say WR is an area they researched heavily.  By the way, they LOVE Texas Tech LB Rodriquez.  Met with him 3 times.  Do not be surprised…he is my darkhorse.   The betting lines, however, provide some interesting perspectives,and the player’s expected availability is factored in, so take with a grain of salt:   (Panther Wire) For those of you who want an OT (I am not going to cry if we land a Proctor, for example–I totally get it), Morgan said this (in relation to Canales’ comments at the league meeting about the first rounder being an immediate starter):  “"I understand what Coach is saying in terms of—obviously, you want your first-round pick to be able to come in and contribute immediately. So, yeah, I'm kinda with him on that," Morgan stated when asked of Canales' comments. "You want your first-round pick to play, but there's different scenarios to where maybe it takes a guy a little longer to develop, and he may not contribute right away. With some of the picks at different positions, it may take a little longer for those guys to develop, for sure." That could apply to CB or OT, in my opinion.   Round 2: This will probably be defense if they draft WR in round 1, but if they do not, expect the WR in round 2.  I do not see a WR after round 2 helping much–it would be better to go with the TE if that is the case.  I am of the mindset that XL will not emerge to reach his potential, a major indicator of my thinking on this. This will be a LB--they want Rodriguez but the will draft Hill or Golday if WR is taken in round 1. Round 3:  I see DL, S, and TE in my crystal football.  However, my night visions show us taking a TE--Max Klare from Ohio State. I see DE as perhaps our biggest need--but not many share my view--we never replaced Robinson. (This is tough to do) Day 3:  Expect OL OL and maybe DL. Our OL is in its last season together.  A total overhaul is ahead. Keep an eye on Jude Bowry and Austin Barber.  Mark my words!!   So that is it for the offense.  I hope you enjoyed this–by doing this, it helps me understand the currents and the nuances of the draft–I enjoy it more–so this is for me, shared with you.  I will take a look at D and try to share by Tuesday. If you appreciate this, see the link pinned in Huddle and help out if you can- Newborn Twin Granddaughters 
    • That I will agree with. Their dad is a clown show and a half. 🤦‍♂️
×
×
  • Create New...