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Breer talks about Gase (and Tannehill; oh, and Darnold)

Mr. Scot

By Mr. Scot,
in Carolina Panthers

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hepcat Grand Master

hepcat

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Hardest part of Darnold's development will be erasing all the garbage Gase tried to teach him. More than just having bad fundamentals, Gase's offense routinely called for plays that were not designed to beat the defense they were facing. At the very least I hope Joe Brady's offense can put Darnold in more winning situations.

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GoobyPls Veteran

GoobyPls

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2 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

Yeah, like that Brees guy. What did he ever win?

Same with that guy the Packers picked up that had a funny last name. Brett something...

Ah yes the the outliers, about time you brought up those two guys. Let’s play a game, I’ll name a castoff QB that didn’t workout out, then you name one. I’ll go first and give you four right off the bat, Rosen, Paxton Lynch, Bortles, Ej Manuel. 
 

i will make it easier for you, you give me  one name I’ll give you two.

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Mr. Scot Grand Master

Mr. Scot

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7 minutes ago, GoobyPls said:

No I’m advocating for us to draft a rookie QB in the first round, you know like the overwhelming majority of SB winning teams  have done. Your the one that wants the Gruden approach with Darnold.

Again the Browns are better team than us, also the majority of those guys were t drafted by them, so keep fueling my argument 

You do realize (and given who I'm talking to I know that's assuming a lot) that Darnold is only 23, right?

And I realize that Albert Breer's analysis doesn't carry as much weight as a tweet from last year, but still...

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Mr. Scot Grand Master

Mr. Scot

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1 minute ago, GoobyPls said:

Ah yes the the outliers, about time you brought up those two guys. Let’s play a game, I’ll name a castoff QB that didn’t workout out, then you name one. I’ll go first and give you four right off the bat, Rosen, Paxton Lynch, Bortles, Ej Manuel. 

i will make it easier for you, you give me  one name I’ll give you two.

See, this is why it's fun debating with you. Given time, you typically own yourself.

All those guys you just listed as castoffs, guess what they were before that? 

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GoobyPls

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2 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

You do realize (and given who I'm talking to I know that's assuming a lot) that Darnold is only 23, right?

And I realize that Albert Brrer's analysis doesn't carry as much weight as a tweet from last year, but still...

Is his age supposed to erase 3 years of horrible tape?

Rosen was 21 when the cards got rid of him, Paxton Lynch was 23, Bridegwater 24 do I keep going?

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SCO96 Veteran

SCO96

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25 minutes ago, GoobyPls said:

And teams that sign castoff end up in nfl purgatory with 5-11 record lingering around being irrelevant never finding a true franchise QB

You can't judge a QB by his inability to win at his 1st NFL destination. The following championship QBs all won at later destinations after being cut/released or traded early in their career:

John Unitas, Len Dawson, Jim Plunkett, Doug Williams, Steve Young, Brett Favre, Brad Johnson, Trent Dilfer,  Kurt Warner.

Five of those guys are in the Hall of Fame. You can make an argument that Jim Plunkett should be. 

QB's don't win Super Bowls. Teams do. All of the above entered the league in less than optimal circumstances. After being given an opportunity with better organizations/teams they were able to excel.

Sam Darnold came out of college and joined a franchise that hasn't been to a Super Bowl in 5 decades. Let's see how he does in a new environment before we label him an unsuccessful castoff. 

 

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GoobyPls

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Just now, Mr. Scot said:

Ah, but praytell how did they come into the league? 🤔

Getting drafted, is that supposed to help your argument? Lmao

 

Thats how it works, you draft a QB give him a couple of years if it doesn’t workout you move on and try again.
 

And with how easy the transition from college to the pros today today’s game is, rookies QBs should be given less time. We just saw a rookie QB throw for 35 TD last year, and another rookie pass for 3 straight games of 300 yards

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GoobyPls

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5 minutes ago, SCO96 said:

You can't judge a QB by his inability to win at his 1st NFL destination. The following championship QBs all won at the later destinations after being cut/released or traded early in their career:

John Unitas, Len Dawson, Jim Plunkett, Doug Williams, Steve Young, Brad Johnson, Trent Dilfer,  Kurt Warner.

QB's don't win Super Bowls. Teams do. All of the above entered the league in less than optimal circumstances. After being given an opportunity with better organizations/teams they were able to excel.

Sam Darnold came out of college and joined a franchise that hasn't been to a Super Bowl in 5 decades. Let's see how he does in a new environment before we label him an unsuccessful castoff. 

 

In today’s nfl you can, you names guys who played 50 years ago. And for every guy you named I can name two SB winners who were drafted by the team they won with. And it’s not just SB it’s league mvps, all pro players pro bowls.

So were Mark Sanchez and Geno Smith, matter of fact Geno had a worse team. Baker was drafted by historically the worst team in nfl history he went on to break rookie records.

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Mr. Scot Grand Master

Mr. Scot

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Just now, GoobyPls said:

Getting drafted, is that supposed to help your argument? Lmao

Thats how it works, you draft a QB give him a couple of years if it doesn’t workout you move on and try again.

And with how easy the transition from college to the pros today today’s game is, rookies QBs should be given less time. We just saw a rookie QB throw for 35 TD last year, and another rookie pass for 3 straight games of 300 yards

Following up the suggestion that a first round pick was the only way to go by naming nearly half a dozen first round busts certainly didn't help yours 😄

Neither did appealing to recent Super Bowl history as evidence for first round picks do much when you consider that the vast majority of Super Bowls over the last several years have been won by a sixth round pick who was stuck behind a first-round pick for the first few years of his career; that same guy who this past year would have fit your definition of a castoff. Also the same dude who lost the Super Bowl just a few years back to another "castoff".

The reality is there's no single path to Super Bowl victory. Plenty of teams have won it with guys that didn't succeed in their first spot.

 

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SCO96

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1 minute ago, GoobyPls said:

In today’s nfl you can, you names guys who played 50 years ago. And for every guy you named I can name two SB winners who were drafted by the team they won with. And it’s not just SB it’s league mvps, all pro players pro bowls.

So were Mark Sanchez and Geno Smith, matter of fact Geno had a worse team. Baker was drafted by historically the worst team in nfl history he went on to break rookie records.

Most QB's who win SB's do so with the teams that drafted them. No one disputes that. I just gave you examples of 10 guys who did win with teams that didn't draft them. It doesn't matter when they played. They were reclamation projects that excelled when put in more favorable circumstances. 

Too many people feel like we had to get a franchise QB out of the 2021 draft. QB's come out of college every year. If any rookie QB is to succeed they need solid teams around them. That's hard to accomplish when you have to trade away multiple first round selections and other high draft choices for one player (who isn't lock to succeed in the first place). 

If we nail this draft this team should be a lot better in 2021. which helps Darnold. I hope he does well here. If he doesn't pan out, whoever we draft down the road, acquire via FA, or trade, is going to join a much better team than the one Rhule inherited in 2020 and be in a position to flourish.

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