Not Necessarily Panthers Related but....

[kungfoodude]

5 hours ago, Jon Snow said:

What I've taken from this is that the expectations for a 1st round qb is probably higher than it should be because in reality your are most likely to end up with someone that has the expectations of a 2nd round pick. 

Well, almost 50% of the QB's meet my criteria in that sample size(1994-2018). That's a good hit rate.

[kungfoodude]

2 hours ago, Basbear said:

Teams reach for QBs, in the past they did, but now more than ever. Many guys drafted in the 1st, would be 2nd round, even 3rd round guys. Just if you want one, you got to either suck, reach, or trade up for the chosen ones. 

 

I get QB is the most important thing, just I just don't believe its the only way. Panthers are a prime example, they have sacrificed many players in order to draft a maybe QB. Just build the team and I swear free agent QBs will call YOU.....Even rookies would be like " I want to play for Carolina, that defense and running game is too good". 

You can still find QBs in other ways besides the 1st round. 

Many times if you want a 2nd overall QB, just wait 4 years and he will be happy to sign for a low level QB contract. During those four years, build the roster with the best draft picks in each round. Stop making excuses about failures in the mid rounds, hire the right staff is the key. 

That's the other way of building, for sure. Build a team and they will come. Now, this is largely a "backside of career" model. Elite QB's are almost never available in their prime.

[Khaki Lackey]

11 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

That's the other way of building, for sure. Build a team and they will come. Now, this is largely a "backside of career" model. Elite QB's are almost never available in their prime.

Not necessarily. QB’s looking like busts in garbage organizations and looking decent in well run organizations is becoming way more common that it used to be

[kungfoodude]

1 hour ago, Khaki Lackey said:

Not necessarily. QB’s looking like busts in garbage organizations and looking decent in well run organizations is becoming way more common that it used to be

Those aren't elite QB's. Those are reclaimation projects, most of which have failed. 

Those should be available most offseasons given recent history.

[PNW_PantherMan]

12 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

Those aren't elite QB's. Those are reclaimation projects, most of which have failed. 

Those should be available most offseasons given recent history.

Even more reason to bring one in on a 1 year deal in the offseason.  Pretty low risk move

[kungfoodude]

8 hours ago, PNW_PantherMan said:

Even more reason to bring one in on a 1 year deal in the offseason.  Pretty low risk move

Yes but that is different from the "build it and they will come" model that @Basbear was talking about. 

That's just standard dumpster diving. We have had all of our non-Bryce starting QB's from that pile since Cam was shown the door.

It's been a total of two starts by QB's drafted by the Panthers from 2019-2022 without including Cam 2.0. Technically Cam 2.0 was also dumpster diving.

[L-TownCat]

On 10/27/2025 at 6:40 PM, kungfoodude said:

That's hard to quantify and I think a little unfair since most of these QB's end up with dumpster fire franchises.

What would be the way you would include that? Win percentage? Total wins? 

How do you account for guys that just end up on shitty teams(Stafford pre-Rams, for example)?

Not against it, I just don't know how to do that and be fair across all those tiers.

Post season appearances.

[kungfoodude]

35 minutes ago, L-TownCat said:

Post season appearances.

So how would you tier that?

[L-TownCat]

Just now, kungfoodude said:

So how would you tier that?

I’ve been thinking about it since I said it.  1st rounders would be expected to make multiple psa’s.  But you’re right, after that there are no real expectations as it’s a shot in the dark for QBs that aren’t drafted in the 1st.

Add to that, it’s kind of an inverse effect.  The later the QB is drafted, the better the team (potentially) they go to.  So you could actually set the bar higher in this category for QBs drafted in the later rounds?

[kungfoodude]

2 minutes ago, L-TownCat said:

I’ve been thinking about it since I said it.  1st rounders would be expected to make multiple psa’s.  But you’re right, after that there are no real expectations as it’s a shot in the dark for QBs that aren’t drafted in the 1st.

Add to that, it’s kind of an inverse effect.  The later the QB is drafted, the better the team (potentially) they go to.  So you could actually set the bar higher in this category for QBs drafted in the later rounds?

You would need to filter for postseason STARTS, actually. It's why I eliminated all Super Bowl criteria. Backups get rings too.

If you come up with a workable tier system, post it and I will try the 1st rounders as a test to see the results.