Decertification

[TheRealDeal]

Net income= the total amount of money brought in to an organization throughout a fiscal year.

Profit= Net Income minus Expenses

It's entirely possible to have an increase in net income, yet show a loss (or a decrease in profit from the previous year) because your expenses rose faster than your net income.

So they have Net Income of 5.4mil and Profit of 9.8 mil so does that mean their expenses were negative?

;)

[Evil Hurney]

Nice find. And yes it does say the packers were making money. However, it also shows that that the trend was going towards them losing money in the future.

Owners look at this and say, we need to redo this or we are going to be losing money.

Players look at this and say, you haven't lost money yet so why do things need to change.

[Marguide]

You do realize that article says their net income rose from the previous year right?

And they have a 130mil nest egg

Not taking sides just saying.

Net income is the absolute bottom line and includes things like investment gains and losses, taxes, shareholder dividends, etc. This often includes one-time, non-recurring gains or losses.

Operating profit is the indicator of what the business is producing from its normal, continuing operations.

[Captain Obvious]

I didn't want to do this...but I'm gonna break out the law books on ya now....

Cost of Labor Contracts Section clearly states under item

2. Increased financial disclosure. The employer will have to make a claim of inability to pay or financial hardship. although the company's financial information normally need not be disclosed in collective bargaining, when the employer puts profitability or financial condition in contention, the financial data MUST BE provided to substantiate the position.

Union is not anymore, so collective bargaining is out. The section does not denote the amount of financial data to show inability to pay or hardship they have to provide. The NFL did provide data and the union refused it. They will give the courts that same info. The union effectively destroyed themselves. Anti trust has been fought and won by owners before.

[Mr. Scot]

Hate to say but our best chance now for a resolution is for congress/senators to get involved.

Those are words nobody ever likes to hear :(

[Captain Obvious]

Well. If I had a CBA and the "boss" told me there was a wage freeze, I would indeed tell him to open the books, because I'm entitled by LAW to see that my "boss" is suffer financial hardship.

You guys can go to the library and look up contract law and find all this out for yourselves, rather than argue with my Labor Relations and Collective Bargaining law text....it's up to you.

Obama froze my pay for the next two years. However food and gas prices keep going up. I can't tell him to open the books now can I. And we have a CBA with our union. explain please.

[The NFL Shield At Midfield]

Obama froze my pay for the next two years. However food and gas prices keep going up. I can't tell him to open the books now can I. And we have a CBA with our union. explain please.

Oh my God a unionized public employee. Stay away from the Tinderbox bro.

[Seamonk]

After reading all the pages for this thread... there's 2 things that can be concluded

1. the "facts" seems to be very one sided.

2. Wrong

[Proudiddy]

It's a staple Internet Forum tactic. Happens every day around here.

P.S. Try and stay out of the Tinderbox. It would be more accurate to call it the Strawmanbox.

Yeah, I've noticed. Someone should tell Zod that the Tinderbox is leaking, lol.

A strawman made it to my sig, lol.

LOL....you don't get it.....the guy was making fun of you.....LOL!

Nope. I wasn't.

[ThPantherFan]

If I have a business, it's my business. If I hire an employee to exchange their service for my pay I expect to get what I paid for and if not, I will let him go and get another. If I contract for services (NFL Player) I expect the contract to be upheld for the compensation. If the contractor doesn't provide what I asked for I owe them nothing and will get another. We get the lawyers involved too much.

[riddel]

Obama froze my pay for the next two years. However food and gas prices keep going up. I can't tell him to open the books now can I. And we have a CBA with our union. explain please.

If your union is claiming economic hardship as the reason for the wage freeze and they are in the midst of a labor negotiation (CBA), then yes you can go to your union rep and ask them to request the substantiating proof that shows the company is losing money. My guess is your company is losing money and there is no reason for proof to be provided, but if you feel like they are lying and the union is in the midst of a CBA negotiation, then sure, ask for the financials.

2. Financial information of company. When an employer claims financial inability to meet a union wage demand, the financial information of the employer's company becomes relevant. The Supreme Court held that if such a claim by the employer is important enough to be made at the table, it requres some proof of its accuracy. Refusal to grant wage increases because the employer claims it could not stay competitive or would lose the profit margin was held by the board to invoke financial inability. Therefore, financial data become relevant. In the absense of such a claim, an employer may see nondisclosure of financial information as a reaffirmation of management prerogative and by the employees as an obstacle to effective bargaining.

If the NFL didn't want to disclose the details of their financial loses, then they shouldn't have claimed financial hardship. Period.

[Happy Panther]

And do you honestly think $20 million a year is too much? Let's put the cards on the table. Individual players can make more than $20 million a year, but the organization cannot?

The players aren't investing in capital expenditures like new stadiums, they are not sharing the losses if a club has an unprofitable year, etc.

The average revenue per team is about $282 million. A $20 million profit is about 7%. Do you find that excessive?

What level would profit have to drop to for you to feel that its appropriate to ask for concessions? Zero?

You are ignoring the appreciation on the asset. While Jerry Richardson's return on assets in any given year might be low, he has an asset that has grown from $200M to $1B.

In other words his $200M investment has grown on average around $50M per year as well as produced a revenue stream around $20M per year.

Seems pretty damn good to me

[Happy Panther]

Nice find. And yes it does say the packers were making money. However, it also shows that that the trend was going towards them losing money in the future.

Owners look at this and say, we need to redo this or we are going to be losing money.

Players look at this and say, you haven't lost money yet so why do things need to change.

The owners opted out of the current CBA three years ago before any downward trends in operating income

[riddel]

If I have a business, it's my business. If I hire an employee to exchange their service for my pay I expect to get what I paid for and if not, I will let him go and get another. If I contract for services (NFL Player) I expect the contract to be upheld for the compensation. If the contractor doesn't provide what I asked for I owe them nothing and will get another. We get the lawyers involved too much.

Have you ever dealt with a project where the Davis Bacon Act applies, if so you may have an idea what contracting (NFL Player) services means. They are protected by the union. If you don't like what they are doing, then you had better build a case against them and make sure you have "just cause" before you fire them. When dealing with Davis Bacon Act projects you quickly realize that the federal government hold the power when dealing with these contractors. You have to dot your I's and cross your T's or you may find yourself in a world of federal pain.