Marty Hurney Apparently Lied About Fletcher Cox

[ClarkCam]

So... Cox came?

[scratchy1]

If they pick Cox, then they are admitting that Rivera and Hurney blew it with McClain last year. You don't draft a guy at the 65th pick in the draft and then redraft another the next year unless you have a situation like we did with Clausen. Even then Newton was the number 1 pick in the draft and had huge upside. Cox really doesn't. Now if we had a chance to draft a Suh which is the DT version of Newton, then you do it in a heartbeat. I can't see where Cox provides so much more than a guy we can get in the second round. It we want pass rush both Ingram and Coples bring more to the table by far. At least with Williams and Stewart they waiting 2 years.

Cox had 5 sacks last year and 4 of those were in 2 games. (South Carolina and Kentucky) and 1 against Wake Forest. The other 9 games he had none. Add that he had a total of 3 quarterback hurries and you see a guy who pressured or got to the quarterback a total of 8 times in 12 games. Hardly the terrific pass rusher people are making him out to be.

Funny that Coples had 7.5 sacks and he is considered lazy and unmotivated but Cox has 5 and he has a high motor and never quits.

When you look at all our choices you get the sense that there is not that much to choose from really. Ingram brings the most to the table and by many accounts will be gone when we pick at 9.

****************

Cox is a run stopper with the ability to penetrate. He can hold the point of attack well for his size, move laterally, and get into the backfield. He's a good tackler. He's not a defensive end like Coples (who did spend one year at tackle at UNC, out of necessity). You shouldn't look at sacks.

I would not see picking Cox as an admission that we whiffed on Fua or McClain. It's more an admission that we failed to address the position prior to 2011. You need 4 guys who can play DT. Neither Fua nor McClain would have been starters in optimal circumstances (maybe McClain opposite Edwards, in which case McClain likely would have been much more effective).

In our case, the reality is that the defense is on the field more than we would like. That's probably going to be the case---hopefully, decreasingly---for one or two more years. The coaches know that. You don't fix that problem in one season, even two, particularly when you have such crummy luck with injuries. The front 4 are going to need guys who can spot them. We don't just need 4 defensive tackles--we REALLY need 4 defensive tackles. And instead of drawing the 4th guy from the hodgepodge on the year-end roster, we're much better off drawing him from the top of the draft, in which case he becomes the 1st or 2nd guy.

I'm not saying Cox is the pick---I don't know, and we all know things are very fluid right up until the clock runs out. But given what Ron is trying to do, the pick makes good sense.

[panthers55]

It's cool that you don't like Cox as our top pick and all, but at least support it with factual information. C'mon man, I don't know where you pulled this statistic from, but I counted 30 QB pressures in just 3 games I looked at.. the guy probably had 80 QB pressures on the year.

I pulled it from this site which tracks these things:

http://www.cfbstats....se/gamelog.html

So you found 30 and in the last 3 games they said he had 1. Maybe we need to go back to your thread where you diagnosed every play. Your credibility just took a huge hit.

[panthers55]

Panther55 ..i should've said instead of dt maybe de. I guess it all depends on the type defense we will run. We still have Edwards and Mclain/Fua and Keiser. All are still looking to make an impact on the team. Hogan is our #2, is it good to have one more with falcons and bucs doubling down on their recievers? I think so. I look at our first two picks as starting def picks. But i have no insider knowledge or "sources", strictly opinion.

I said that we should go defense for every pick this year so I am definitely on board with that. Or at least defense with the first, 2nd, and fourth. After that I really don't care.....Go BPA regardless of position.

If we are going to go DT, I at least want someone who play multiple positions. Otherwise I would rather have an edge rusher like Ingram or Coples even with his issues......

[koolkatluke]

I pulled it from the this site which tracks these things:

http://www.cfbstats....se/gamelog.html

So you found 30 and in the last 3 games they said he had 1. Maybe we need to go back to your thread where you diagnosed every play. Your credibility just took a huge hit.

I saw more then 8 as well. They also has him down for 2 sacks in the USC game he had 3.

.21 is a pressure

2.23 is a sack

2.43 is a sack

3.04 is a pressure

3.23 is a sack

3.37 is a Pressure

4.11 is a pressure with a hit

You can check me if you like.

[CarolinaPanthers8789]

Why are people comparing Cox to guys like Coples and Ingram?

Yes, Cox did play defensive end a little bit throughout the year for Mississippi State but he was primarily a defensive tackle so arguing sack counts in an inconclusive way of comparing Cox to Coples, Cox to Ingram, and Cox to etc... (so on and so forth).

Also, if you have watched Fletcher play or seen a scouting report him you would know that he is primarily a run-stopper but has flashed some ability to rush the passer.

He would be a really solid pick from anywhere between number nine to number thirteen.

[CarolinaPanthers8789]

I pulled it from this site which tracks these things:

http://www.cfbstats....se/gamelog.html

So you found 30 and in the last 3 games they said he had 1. Maybe we need to go back to your thread where you diagnosed every play. Your credibility just took a huge hit.

I have dealt with cfb stats since 2005 and their tracking of anything except tackles, interceptions, forced fumbles, and other common stats aren't exactly 100% accurate.

You can look at quarterback pressures for top guys like Coples, Ingram etc... you can even look back at Suh's quarterback pressure stat from the year he was taken and tell that the quarterback pressure stat isn't accurate.

[Kuech the Sneak]

1.Cox

2.Kendricks

4.Irvin

Championship

[panthers55]

****************

Cox is a run stopper with the ability to penetrate. He can hold the point of attack well for his size, move laterally, and get into the backfield. He's a good tackler. He's not a defensive end like Coples (who did spend one year at tackle at UNC, out of necessity). You shouldn't look at sacks.

I would not see picking Cox as an admission that we whiffed on Fua or McClain. It's more an admission that we failed to address the position prior to 2011. You need 4 guys who can play DT. Neither Fua nor McClain would have been starters in optimal circumstances (maybe McClain opposite Edwards, in which case McClain likely would have been much more effective).

In our case, the reality is that the defense is on the field more than we would like. That's probably going to be the case---hopefully, decreasingly---for one or two more years. The coaches know that. You don't fix that problem in one season, even two, particularly when you have such crummy luck with injuries. The front 4 are going to need guys who can spot them. We don't just need 4 defensive tackles--we REALLY need 4 defensive tackles. And instead of drawing the 4th guy from the hodgepodge on the year-end roster, we're much better off drawing him from the top of the draft, in which case he becomes the 1st or 2nd guy.

I'm not saying Cox is the pick---I don't know, and we all know things are very fluid right up until the clock runs out. But given what Ron is trying to do, the pick makes good sense.

He is not a run stuffer at all. He is able to penetrate the line and make tackles for a loss on occasion and is good pursuing the ball. A run stuffer can clog the line and take on double teams which he doesn't do very well. He doesn't hold the point of attack against double teams well at all against the run as he doesn't use his leverage well. He has a bull rush but doesn't shed blockers that well but again can get around the block and is a good tackler.

Cox isn't a bad choice if you don't like McClain but if we want a pass rusher, Cox is not going to be that effective in the NFL for at least a year or two. He used his strength and speed to make plays and he isn't going to be stronger or faster than the guards and tackles in the NFL. He will have to learn better moves and technique to play well at the next level.

[panthers55]

I saw more then 8 as well. They also has him down for 2 sacks in the USC game he had 3.

.21 is a pressure

2.23 is a sack

2.43 is a sack

3.04 is a pressure

3.23 is a sack

3.37 is a Pressure

4.11 is a pressure with a hit

You can check me if you like.

SO we should watch your youtube highlights more than the official source for college stats.

Sites can makes some mistakes or miscount as quarterback hurries are subjective but when your numbers are way more than the official ones, you need to look at yourself not them. Remember that if the quarterback is running it isn't a sack but a tackle for a loss. And just because you are close to the ball it isn't a quarterback hurry. To qualify the pass has to be incomplete and the reason was the pressure you were applying.

[davos]

Its a video of the game dude...not some fake footage

I guess you simply may view it differently...that's totally cool

A lot of animosity about Cox...it tends to drive conflict :)

[YoungPanthers89]

One thing you cant knock cox on is his motor, guy is relentless.

[koolkatluke]

SO we should watch your youtube highlights more than the official source for college stats.

Are you serious?????

Did you not read this.

I have dealt with cfb stats since 2005 and their tracking of anything except tackles, interceptions, forced fumbles, and other common stats aren't exactly 100% accurate.

You can look at quarterback pressures for top guys like Coples, Ingram etc... you can even look back at Suh's quarterback pressure stat from the year he was taken and tell that the quarterback pressure stat isn't accurate.

[pantherclaw]

Well in that case we dont need a 3 tech. I believe alot more in terrell than fua.

agreed!