DJ Wonnum effect

[strato]

38 minutes ago, Khyber53 said:

Green shoots coming up. Finally.

Still too early to tell if they'll be fruitful long-term, or if they're just weeds, but at least something is coming up from this manure pile we've made here.

Our defense the week after Shaq and Jewell went down, was I think maybe the worst NFL defensive unit I have seen in 30 years. Probably forgetting someone.

[kungfoodude]

13 hours ago, Basbear said:

 

 

 

I maybe huffin the hopuim too much for the defense during 2 games winning.

 

If DJ played like that each game(??), DBrown, Turlte, ARob(who's been like Dbrown), clowny

 

That's a solid front 5, or is it too much homer huffin??

 

Then Jewell and Shaq

 

Again solid, not trash or elite.

 

Horn(heathly) Mike Jackson. Dane Jackson, Woods, and Fuller

 

I swear the "solid" enough feels are here again

 

Of course Id love to drop a elite edge and have DJ come off the bench or another stud CB, but I swear if that group was 100% healthy I feel they'd be around 18th best. (yes still need a true NT). 

Please correct me.

Yeah, you have officially ODed.

Very few of that front 7 are more than league average or rotational guys.

That area needs a multi-year overhaul.

[Khyber53]

2 hours ago, strato said:

Our defense the week after Shaq and Jewell went down, was I think maybe the worst NFL defensive unit I have seen in 30 years. Probably forgetting someone.

Oh, I agree wholeheartedly. Remember when our linebacking corps was the best in the league. Like for all but the last five years as we've gotten more analytics driven and basically, softer.

Shaq has been a great player but those injuries are mounting up and this is the second year in a row with a season ending injury. His career is looking like it is in the twilight. Jewell was better than most acknowledged but beyond them, there's really not a lot. Just some edge rushers with LB in their title. 

This team has been cleansed of grit in the last few years. And it shows.

[strato]

2 minutes ago, Khyber53 said:

Oh, I agree wholeheartedly. Remember when our linebacking corps was the best in the league. Like for all but the last five years as we've gotten more analytics driven and basically, softer.

Shaq has been a great player but those injuries are mounting up and this is the second year in a row with a season ending injury. His career is looking like it is in the twilight. Jewell was better than most acknowledged but beyond them, there's really not a lot. Just some edge rushers with LB in their title. 

This team has been cleansed of grit in the last few years. And it shows.

I think we have some grit back. Burns was soft as hell and I think he was addition by subtraction in the long run. 

Horn, not soft. A'Shawn, I don't see him as soft. Jewell looks serviceable, I suppose Wallace may turn out okay I have been critical but her was thrown in with the green dot job, and I haven't really zeroed in on him since Jewell came back. Just unexcited to rewatch things lately. 

[Davidson Deac II]

1 hour ago, kungfoodude said:

Yeah, you have officially ODed.

Very few of that front 7 are more than league average or rotational guys.

That area needs a multi-year overhaul.

I am somewhere in between the two of you in terms of my thoughts on the defense. 

I think we have some guys who would make decent to good backups or adequate starters.  They need to add three or four talented players.  A topflight defensive end, couple of linebackers and maybe one safety.  That would turn this defense from subpar to top 10.  

[Jon Snow]

18 minutes ago, Davidson Deac II said:

I am somewhere in between the two of you in terms of my thoughts on the defense. 

I think we have some guys who would make decent to good backups or adequate starters.  They need to add three or four talented players.  A topflight defensive end, couple of linebackers and maybe one safety.  That would turn this defense from subpar to top 10.  

To be a top 10 defense they will need 2 topflight defensive ends along with the others and maybe another DT. The D needs a lot.

[PadresPanthersFan]

I might be in the minority but I think pass rush still needs to be a top priority as i thought the pass rush was still minimal.  I saw a bunch of times where jones had all day to throw but luckily he remembered that he was Daniel Jones and absolutely terrible. 

This won't be the case with mahomes. 

[Jon Snow]

1 minute ago, PadresPanthersFan said:

I might be in the minority but I think pass rush still needs to be a top priority as i thought the pass rush was still minimal.  I saw a bunch of times where jones had all day to throw but luckily he remembered that he was Daniel Jones and absolutely terrible. 

This won't be the case with mahomes. 

Mahomes is going to pick this defense apart. It will be over by the second quarter. 

[kungfoodude]

5 hours ago, Khyber53 said:

Green shoots coming up. Finally.

Still too early to tell if they'll be fruitful long-term, or if they're just weeds, but at least something is coming up from this manure pile we've made here.

Likely just ends up being hallucinogenic.

[Davidson Deac II]

1 hour ago, Jon Snow said:

To be a top 10 defense they will need 2 topflight defensive ends along with the others and maybe another DT. The D needs a lot.

I think we could do with one great one and one decent one.  Think Mike Rucker and Julius Peppers.  

But the linebackers have to be upgraded as well.  Trevin Wallace and Josey Jewell have done better than expected recently, but I think we need one or two more to go with them.  

[Jon Snow]

4 minutes ago, Davidson Deac II said:

I think we could do with one great one and one decent one.  Think Mike Rucker and Julius Peppers.  

But the linebackers have to be upgraded as well.  Trevin Wallace and Josey Jewell have done better than expected recently, but I think we need one or two more to go with them.  

We don't even have a Mike Rucker type on the roster. And finding another Peppers in the near future isn't likely to magically manifest itself. The D is going to take a while to upgrade. 

[kungfoodude]

22 minutes ago, Jon Snow said:

We don't even have a Mike Rucker type on the roster. And finding another Peppers in the near future isn't likely to magically manifest itself. The D is going to take a while to upgrade. 

Yeah, this roster is bereft of any top 25 pass rush talent. Clowney is the closest and he is far closer to being retired than being a core player for us.

We have a smattering of players that can be decent rotational or average-ish starters, but nothing close to elite talent minus Brown. 

This front 7 will need to be completely rebuilt over the next 2-4 offseasons.

[Jon Snow]

39 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

Yeah, this roster is bereft of any top 25 pass rush talent. Clowney is the closest and he is far closer to being retired than being a core player for us.

We have a smattering of players that can be decent rotational or average-ish starters, but nothing close to elite talent minus Brown. 

This front 7 will need to be completely rebuilt over the next 2-4 offseasons.

I don't think folks realize how lacking it is. It shouldn't surprise me though because Burns was considered a franchise player and was going to break out any day now. 

[Basbear]

5 hours ago, Davidson Deac II said:

I am somewhere in between the two of you in terms of my thoughts on the defense. 

I think we have some guys who would make decent to good backups or adequate starters.  They need to add three or four talented players.  A topflight defensive end, couple of linebackers and maybe one safety.  That would turn this defense from subpar to top 10.  

I was like others in "this is pure trash".....but if they all were healthy I feel it would be at least around 18, 20th ranked

 

If you dropped one miles garrett, it would changed everyone's output and jumped to ranks to top 10ish. 

 

It's not as bad as I once thought, but still plenty of room for improvements. Arob has looked like dbrown at times, dam shame they lost the best player. Even dbrown back on the team, it would benifit the DL, LBs, and DBs not a little bit either. 

Add a couple more players and put up spots for grabs along with hitting on a legit rookie edge pressure machine. Panthers would start to feel like the old defenses ..somewhat...