Jaws: "I wouldn't give up on Jimmy"

[mountainpantherfan]

Chicago? Cincy? NY? Defense played well in several games putting the team in position to win games.....and in big fashion. Didn't matter how hard they played the offense screwed it up and there work went unnoticed. When they made big plays....there thanks was going right back on the field w/ no points. They did some really good stuff(especially considering that talent they had at DT)....and a remotely functional offense would have given us some more wins.....and some nice ones at that. They weren't great but they were far from sucking.

Sorry, I don't buy the "the offense caused the defense to be bad" excuse.

The defense gave up plays and points and where on the field doesn't matter. There were some games where the defense showed more than others, I'll give you that. But there was also games where Clausen showed more than other games. That didn't make any of his performances, aside the Arizona game, worth being proud of. (The Arizona game was a great game by all three units, really, and the only one to speak of.)

There was not one game where the offense was held scoreless, right? So, in my book, the offense did in fact but the defense in position to win every game just as much as the defense put the offense in that same position.

[bleys]

Sorry, I don't buy the "the offense caused the defense to be bad" excuse.

The defense gave up plays and points and where on the field doesn't matter. There were some games where the defense showed more than others, I'll give you that. But there was also games where Clausen showed more than other games. That didn't make any of his performances, aside the Arizona game, worth being proud of. (The Arizona game was a great game by all three units, really, and the only one to speak of.)

There was not one game where the offense was held scoreless, right? So, in my book, the offense did in fact but the defense in position to win every game just as much as the defense put the offense in that same position.

keeping an offense in today's NFL under 7-10 points isn't very common anymore. unless an offense is piss poor.. which never helps your defense..

[bleys]

Sorry, I don't buy the "the offense caused the defense to be bad" excuse.

The defense gave up plays and points and where on the field doesn't matter. There were some games where the defense showed more than others, I'll give you that. But there was also games where Clausen showed more than other games. That didn't make any of his performances, aside the Arizona game, worth being proud of. (The Arizona game was a great game by all three units, really, and the only one to speak of.)

There was not one game where the offense was held scoreless, right? So, in my book, the offense did in fact but the defense in position to win every game just as much as the defense put the offense in that same position.

you may need to reanalyze your expectations..

the Pittsburgh Steelers had the lowest PPG (14.5) as a defense.. Our offense had the lowest PPG (12.2) as an offense.. so if we had the #1 defense in the league, we would still on average lose games..

it's very hard to keep a team from scoring <10 points in today NFL.. and that's something the best defense in the league (based on scoring) couldn't even do, but something you just said you expect our defense to do..

[TheRealDeal]

To be fair there were games that our defense looked bad and it wasn't caused by the offense. TB got up two quick scores on us, SF jumped out to a lead right away, and so on.

But that is besides the point. Offense still blew way worse than the defense, and it's not even close.

[bleys]

To be fair there were games that our defense looked bad and it wasn't caused by the offense. TB got up two quick scores on us, SF jumped out to a lead right away, and so on.

But that is besides the point. Offense still blew way worse than the defense, and it's not even close.

yeah, those things are going to happen though.. we weren't anywhere near the #1 defense.. like you said, it's not even close..

[SPANKY]

Was Jaw's talking about the Panther's? When you go 3and out, 3and out ect., that will wear down the best defense. Was our D perfect..no, but the offense was keeping our D on the field way too long. But Charles johnson is turning into a top notch pass rusher, soon Hardy will join him.

[R0CKnR0LLA]

I think with the right mentor, a couple years to develop and a WCO he'll be (reasonably) successful. I don't see him getting that here.

[mountainpantherfan]

you may need to reanalyze your expectations..

the Pittsburgh Steelers had the lowest PPG (14.5) as a defense.. Our offense had the lowest PPG (12.2) as an offense.. so if we had the #1 defense in the league, we would still on average lose games..

it's very hard to keep a team from scoring <10 points in today NFL.. and that's something the best defense in the league (based on scoring) couldn't even do, but something you just said you expect our defense to do..

I'm not expecting the defense to be that. I'm just pointing out the stupidity of blaming the offense for the defenses short comings. The same can just as easily be turned around, that doesn't make it reasonable.

I know our opinions differ so I don't want to into a back and forth based on opinions. Stats can be misleading and a players rep or popularity can sway fans. All I look at is 2-14 and know that that team isn't any good right now and that the expectations going into next season should be comparable. Can they over-achieve? And Rivera pull a turn around like Fox. Maybe but the expectations of the team and the players should begin with the lead in of them being a 2-14 team.

Not trying to be a smartass but I think my expectations are very reasonable.

[Lumps]

People confuse these definitions all of the time.

That is because ball-control can mean a million things for a million coaches and millions of coaching styles. Saying it means one thing for one coach is different for another. Rivera has not coached one game as a HC so we don't know exactly what he means yet. Sorry but there is no 'definition', or official term of something so vague as ball-control, not sure why your trying to sound so correct and everyone else inaccurate. What team doesn't want to control the ball, that's what I want to know. Obviously ball control is just the overall goal, coaching style and how they get there will support how it is 'defined', for that coach. But since we are talking vocab, your posts are the definition of bigotry.

[panthers55]

Ball control doesn't mean a million things it is pretty simple to define. Accomplishing it can be done several ways but the result is the same. Ball control means holding on to it and maximizing your offensive opportunities while minimizing your opponent's opportunities. It includes elements of defense, offense and special teams but isn't rocket science. Rivera has told you his formula. He will be aggressive on both sides of the ball, run when he can and throw when he needs to. He will limit the opponent's opportunities, keep them from scoring and be fundamentally sound on special teams.

Accomplishing it is harder than talking about it but it isn't some big mystery or unknown at this point.

[rayzor]

you know, i've got to say that in spite of all the doubts i have about clausen, after reading that softball game thread and seeing all the crap that he's gotten, i'm actually pulling for clausen to pull it off and be the QB we need.

it would sure make life a lot easier for this team if he was and it would be awesome to see guys that have given him so much crap have to admit that he was actually a good QB.

i'd gladly eat crow about him if it meant we were winning games.

[LinvilleGorge]

I consider Jaws to be a pretty good analyst and this is what I've been saying since Luck decided not to come out. Beef up the D, play ball control offense and run the ball with our great RBs and ask Jimmy to only be safe wit the ball. I don't think there's much choice to do otherwise anyway at this point unless some really good FA drops on us or Hurney comes up wih some great trade for a better QB.

This.

Resigning DeAngelo is vital.

[MadHatter]

Ball control doesn't mean a million things it is pretty simple to define. Accomplishing it can be done several ways but the result is the same. Ball control means holding on to it and maximizing your offensive opportunities while minimizing your opponent's opportunities. It includes elements of defense, offense and special teams but isn't rocket science. Rivera has told you his formula. He will be aggressive on both sides of the ball, run when he can and throw when he needs to. He will limit the opponent's opportunities, keep them from scoring and be fundamentally sound on special teams.

Accomplishing it is harder than talking about it but it isn't some big mystery or unknown at this point.

Thanks for explaining this so eloquently.

I just give up trying to explain anything to the likes of that idiot.

[koolkatluke]

you know, i've got to say that in spite of all the doubts i have about clausen, after reading that softball game thread and seeing all the crap that he's gotten, i'm actually pulling for clausen to pull it off and be the QB we need.

it would sure make life a lot easier for this team if he was and it would be awesome to see guys that have given him so much crap have to admit that he was actually a good QB.

i'd gladly eat crow about him if it meant we were winning games.

This is where I'm at with Clausen.