Other NFL Games Week 7

[ForJimmy]

2 hours ago, WhoKnows said:

That OL was just awful to watch. Add in the drops on some potential nice gainers and that offense is terrible.

This sounds just like a lot of Panthers fan during Bryce's rookie year

[CPF4LIFE]

1 hour ago, Jon Snow said:

Hustons oline was not their problem last night. Stroud was seeing ghosts. 

You are absolutely blind then. 

[strato]

1 hour ago, PanthersATL said:

Tampa lost Mike Evans for the season (well, "most of the season") in last night's game.  He's always been an impactful player when we've played the Bucs.  

He has been a good player and clean player over the years. I don’t follow that close but think he was closing in on setting his resume for his place in the all time rankings. I am sympathetic to him becaus this will hurt him there. 

[strato]

3 hours ago, *FreeFua* said:

Stroud looked really good year 1 because that situation was a great spot for any QB to be in. 

The longer this plays out and we’re seeing Stroud struggle with pressure while still having a top 5-10 WR1 I have no doubt in my mind had we drafted him instead of Young it would’ve played out the same way

We’re seeing just how important situation and coaching matters when it comes to Stroud. If the Texans ever decide to move on from him he’ll be someone that will have no shortage of options. You put him in a good spot like Tampa and he’d go off

I thought this presented an interesting point. It is fair to wonder now, about switching the two QBs as so many tried to do that first year where Bryce was trash and CJ looked great. 
It is almost the reverse scenario now and I wonder what CJ would look like here with better weapons better coaching and better protection. Overall, compared to year one. 
If each player had been in the other place for the three years. I would love to see CJ with this team now.  Just to see. 

Edited 2 hours ago by strato

[kungfoodude]

22 minutes ago, strato said:

He has been a good player and clean player over the years. I don’t follow that close but think he was closing in on setting his resume for his place in the all time rankings. I am sympathetic to him becaus this will hurt him there. 

Had he gotten another 1k season, he would have broken Jerry Rice's record for consecutive 1k seasons.

[strato]

3 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

Had he gotten another 1k season, he would have broken Jerry Rice's record for consecutive 1k seasons.

there you go. Boy that is a big one. Probably other things. He has accrued some years putting up numbers. 

Edited 1 hour ago by strato

[PleaseCutStewart]

2 hours ago, *FreeFua* said:

https://x.com/samhoppen/status/1978470668782969186?s=46&t=W75E23VenL1ei42iX22E5g
 

Our OL is good when it comes to running the ball but pass blocking not so much and we see it so often

I need to look more into how pass block win rate is calculated. Like, if the other team gets a coverage sack because nobody is open and the guy I am blocking gets free to pressure/sack the QB after 5 seconds, is that considered a pass block "loss"?

I honestly don't think our pass blocking has been that bad this year (outside of Nijman at LT week 1 and Zavala for 2 out of 3 games). For the most part, teams aren't getting by with a 4 man rush and are having to blitz. Looks like teamrankings says we are 10th in sacks allowed (1.7/game) - and that isn't because we have a QB getting the ball out at an elitely quick rate.

[PleaseCutStewart]

4 hours ago, *FreeFua* said:

I know most people here just box score watch but man what Slowik was doing year 1 made Stroud’s life so easy. He was scheming guys wide open. I thought he was well on his way to becoming a HC

Then year 2 happened 

Stroud looked really good year 1 because that situation was a great spot for any QB to be in. 

The longer this plays out and we’re seeing Stroud struggle with pressure while still having a top 5-10 WR1 I have no doubt in my mind had we drafted him instead of Young it would’ve played out the same way

We’re seeing just how important situation and coaching matters when it comes to Stroud. If the Texans ever decide to move on from him he’ll be someone that will have no shortage of options. You put him in a good spot like Tampa and he’d go off

The Texans have failed Stroud miserably. Going into the draft, the biggest con on Stroud is his ability to handle pressure via pass rush. The Texans have turnstiles at all 5 sports on their oline and at no point has Houston thought it is important to draft or get a good oline in free agency.

Put Stroud on the Colts (or any team with a good oline) and he would be lighting it up out there

[kungfoodude]

5 minutes ago, PleaseCutStewart said:

I need to look more into how pass block win rate is calculated. Like, if the other team gets a coverage sack because nobody is open and the guy I am blocking gets free to pressure/sack the QB after 5 seconds, is that considered a pass block "loss"?

I honestly don't think our pass blocking has been that bad this year (outside of Nijman at LT week 1 and Zavala for 2 out of 3 games). For the most part, teams aren't getting by with a 4 man rush and are having to blitz. Looks like teamrankings says we are 10th in sacks allowed (1.7/game) - and that isn't because we have a QB getting the ball out at an elitely quick rate.

IIRC, win rates are basically sustaining your block for 2.5 seconds. The theory behind that being that is a reasonable amount of time to not get your ass whipped and let the QB throw the ball. It's a decent general idea of how solid guys are at stoning their competiton on an average basis. It's limited in some ways.

Edited 1 hour ago by kungfoodude

[*FreeFua*]

1 hour ago, ForJimmy said:

Ours at least isn't from lack of effort in our front office.  Icky missed the first game, Moton missed week 6, Hunt has missed a lot of the games and will be out for a while, Lewis was out last game, our center fortunately upgraded when Corbs went down.  I don't know if we have started the same group of OL yet this year....

our pass rush win rate is 27th in league. Houston is 29th

pressure rate allowed both 30%. Panthers 15th Houston 19th

Houston is 1st with the lowest stuffed run percentage but their run block win rate is low but they’re at least always moving forward

Houston kinda took the Cincy approach. They drafted Dell. Signed Diggs last season. This year spent their 2nd and 3rd rounders on Higgins and Noel. Brought in Kirk. They signed Dalton Shultz who was at least when signed one of the better pass catching TE’s. Shultz turned us down and we immediately gave Hurst the contract we offered Shultz smh

Stroud has always had weapons but the last two years the OL has struggled. 

Meanwhile Bryce had literally zero weapons his rookie season or OL. Second year he had a better OL but still zero weapons. Now he has TMac and the OL’s pass blocking is just as bad as Houston’s 

This board would be yelling to move on from Stroud by now had we drafted him and did what we did to Bryce

[*FreeFua*]

1 minute ago, PleaseCutStewart said:

The Texans have failed Stroud miserably. Going into the draft, the biggest con on Stroud is his ability to handle pressure via pass rush. The Texans have turnstiles at all 5 sports on their oline and at no point has Houston thought it is important to draft or get a good oline in free agency.

Put Stroud on the Colts (or any team with a good oline) and he would be lighting it up out there

I agree

Someone like CJ who throws one of the nicest balls and throws with anticipation and everything you want just protect him. He has Nico. All other resources should’ve gone into the OL

Now with that said I don’t think Young’s numbers would be very far off from Stroud’s had he gone to Houston 

I mean since the whole CJ giving Caleb that post game speech their numbers are pretty similar if I’m recalling correctly 

[PleaseCutStewart]

5 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

IIRC, win rates are basically sustaining your block for 2.5 seconds. The theory behind that being that is a reasonable amount of time to not get your ass whipped and let the QB throw the ball. It's a decent general idea of how solid guys are at stoning their competiton on an average basis. It's limited in some ways.

Yeah, I am just looking at our pass blocking stats and the Texans stats being similar, but our oline is way better than theirs IMO. I feel like there are at least 5 times a game 3+ guys come free on a pass rush for opposing teams vs. the Texans. I can't recall too many times I have seen multiple lineman get beat/blow their blocking assignment on the same play this season for us.

Edited 1 hour ago by PleaseCutStewart

[kungfoodude]

6 minutes ago, PleaseCutStewart said:

Yeah, I am just looking at our pass blocking stats and the Texans stats being similar, but our oline is way better than theirs IMO. I feel like there are at least 5 times a game 3+ guys come free on a pass rush for opposing teams vs. the Texans. I can't recall too many times I have seen multiple lineman get beat/blow their blocking assignment on the same play this season for us.

Bryce and CJ have similar Time to Throw stats(2.81 vs. 2.73). 

 

From PFR:

Bryce's Pressure Percentage this season has been 21.9% with a 21.4% Blitz% and a 2.5 Sec Pocket Time.

CJ's Pressure Percentage this season has been 14.3% with a 20.7% Blitz% and a 1.8 Sec Pocket Time. 

So it seems like Bryce is getting as much pressure but the pressure it getting to CJ more. CJ has a 7.21% Sack Percentage to 4.68% Sack Percentage.

[ForJimmy]

4 hours ago, frankw said:

Revisionist history.

Virtually no one in the NFL sphere was saying this when they drafted him. Many agreed he would be a project to develop slowly over the course of a few years.

Why does it matter what people were projecting vs the reality of what happened? Young was projected to be the most NFL ready day 1 starter. Projections don’t always align with reality.