For everyone that thinks our offense would be top-tier if Chud stopped going full-retard...

[CRA]

As HC? Did Bama not have an OC or QB coach? Can we throw out Shula's work with Cam and assign credit for his development to Rivera?

Also, since it looks like the metric for successful coaching is failure + indeterminate amount of time, I really think we should keep Jeff Davidson's name in mind. He was horrible, but that was years ago and he's got to be getting good now.

I don't recall anyone saying Davidson sucked when Carolina went 12-4 in 2008 ( top 10 O in yards and pts)....which was the only season he didn't have laughable QB play overall on a season sabataging things.

Guys on the field ultimately is what matters....

[Sloth]

I don't recall anyone saying Davidson sucked when Carolina went 12-4 in 2008 ( top 10 O in yards and pts)....which was the only season he didn't have laughable QB play overall on a season sabataging things.

Guys on the field ultimately is what matters....

Just to make sure I understand, your position is that Davidson was a good OC being held back by players?

Or is it that coaches don't matter at all and it's all on what players you have?

[Zod]

I am sure the fact he had to ask guys like Shaun King to execute the plays had nothing to do with things not working well.

Tampas offense, led by Shaun King, improved greatly after Shula was canned. It's a fact and all you need to know.

[Zod]

His last year he Tampa went 7-3 with Dilfer and 4-1 with King.

The defense was allowing close to single digits all season. They won the games despite the awful offense, not because of it.

I remember at one point the media hounding Dungy on why the offense was so horrid. Being the loyal guy he is, he said its the defense's fault for not scoring points on their own. Lol

[magnus]

He never had to start King. He had Dilfer for his entire tenure.

His replacement came in and jumped the offense all the way up to 6th. With Shaun King.

yeah, that guy was so good he was fired after a year. Let's not get carried away.

[Snake]

I'm sorry but when a coach has a choice of OCs and picks the worst resume, I worry. Rivera is gone already he just does not know it yet.

[Marguide]

So, CRA, let me get this straight...by your reasoning we could hire anyone as OC and the results would be comparable because it's all about the Jimmies and Joes?

In that case, maybe they should have just hired Martha Stewart. It would probably increase women's interest in the sport and according to you it doesn't matter if she has no clue what she's doing.

[Zod]

The locker room would smell better I think.

[CRA]

Just to make sure I understand, your position is that Davidson was a good OC being held back by players?

Or is it that coaches don't matter at all and it's all on what players you have?

My position is players make coaches in the NFL....they essentially make or break guys careers. That doesn't mean coaches are pointless....just player impact is huge.

Always said, even last year, Chud wasn't impressive....Cam was. Give Chud Clausen and he is coaching TEs again. No one would have called him a mad scientist....he would have been Chud The Dud

[xclr82xtc]

I willing to bet that cam Gets almost full control of offensive play selection next season. Let me explain..I think shula will probably spend time in meetings finding defenses weaknesses, spend time in his office picking plays that will work best and personnel packages, spend time in practice coaching up those descisions and then spend time in the boot. but i think the booth time will be more of a "run this package because they are weak on the left" and let Cam decide exactly what play should be run that way with the players shula put on the field.

but thats just a theory, but that theory is based off of 2 things.. 1) Cam and shula have a good relationship and Im sure Cam has no problem telling Shula he wants more descision making ability. I dont think anyone here (knowing Cam) Would say that cam doesnt want more of the burden. Its just how he is. and 2) Almost every time this season, towards the end of the season, when Cam audibled they went for good yardage. sometimes big yardage. those two things make me beleive this offense is going to be run a little different next year, even if it is the same (albeit lightened) playbook.

[beastson]

Question, which game have you seen where it felt like the offense game-planned their attack strategically ?

[CRA]

So, CRA, let me get this straight...by your reasoning we could hire anyone as OC and the results would be comparable because it's all about the Jimmies and Joes?

In that case, maybe they should have just hired Martha Stewart. It would probably increase women's interest in the sport and according to you it doesn't matter if she has no clue what she's doing.

Martha Stewart isn't qualified....

But if you put competent guys in place....it comes down mainly to players. At least in terms of who wins or losses. Coaching sets apart the winning teams from championship teams IMO.

Shanahan's son suddenly is praised as a mad scientist and guru....he isn't. RGIII is special. You give great players to decent coaches and those coaches suceed. You give turds to decent coaches turds and those coaches get fired

[JawnyBlaze]

I willing to bet that cam Gets almost full control of offensive play selection next season. Let me explain..I think shula will probably spend time in meetings finding defenses weaknesses, spend time in his office picking plays that will work best and personnel packages, spend time in practice coaching up those descisions and then spend time in the boot. but i think the booth time will be more of a "run this package because they are weak on the left" and let Cam decide exactly what play should be run that way with the players shula put on the field.

but thats just a theory, but that theory is based off of 2 things.. 1) Cam and shula have a good relationship and Im sure Cam has no problem telling Shula he wants more descision making ability. I dont think anyone here (knowing Cam) Would say that cam doesnt want more of the burden. Its just how he is. and 2) Almost every time this season, towards the end of the season, when Cam audibled they went for good yardage. sometimes big yardage. those two things make me beleive this offense is going to be run a little different next year, even if it is the same (albeit lightened) playbook.

I think that might be what's best for Cam and the team for the long term but unfortunately the person making those kinds of decisions has proven he's not interested in the long term yet, he's only worried about saving his job. Maybe if Ron gets a contract extension we might start seeing decisions made for the long term good...

[frash.exe]

Ok so where did this whole chud had an ego thing come from? Has this been reasonably substantiated by a source or is this a coping mechanism from panther fans to try to downplay the fact that we lost a good offensive coordinator?