X-Clown

I'm not saying that he's better than any of those guys. The argument has been made against him that supposedly his passing yards and TDs are just a function of being behind all the time and playing against soft defenses. I would think that yes he would have more opportunities if that's the case, but at the same time he wouldn't have as many of them under his belt. Teddy Bridgewater sure did have a shitload of them for us in 2020, but won zero of them.

Brady has 31 4th quarter comebacks since 2009, Stafford has 34. It's pretty close. If you look at the career leaders (not just since Stafford started), it's Peyton, Brady, Ben, Brees, then Stafford. That's pretty good company, considering that the top 4 guys played on winning teams for their whole careers.

It's like the 2010 season all over again, except there's no threat of a lockout.

Try reading the OP next time

And ended when he missed a quarter of the season. The fact that you’re reaching this far to defend the sanctity of the Pro Bowl because you can’t just admit you had a hot take is killing me. Yeah 3-13-1 is so much better than 3-14. Their third win was the last game of the season against the packers who had nothing at all to play for and benched Rodgers at halftime. Good luck finding a QB that would have done better playing for clowns like Matt Patricia, Jim Schwartz, and Rod Marinelli.

Pro Bowl voting ended in mid December, Murray missed the entire month of November. It stands to reason that the Lions would have been even worse during the 15 year period without Stafford.

I misread the part about the Jags in my other response and couldn’t edit it. They have at least been to a conference championship recently, on the back of a great defense and running game.

I can't find the rhyme in all my reason I've lost sense of time and all seasons Feel I've been beaten down By the words of men who have no grounds Can't sleep beneath the trees of wisdom When your ax has cut the roots that feed them Forked tongues in bitter mouths Can drive a man to bleed from inside out What if you did? What if you lied? What if I avenge? What if eye for an eye? I've seen the wicked fruit of your vine Destroy the man who lacks a strong mind Human pride sings a vengeful song Inspired by the times you've been walked on My stage is shared by many millions Who lift their hands up high because they feel this We are one we are strong The more you hold us down the more we press on What if you did? What if you lied? What if I avenge? What if eye for an eye? I know I can't hold the hate inside my mind 'Cause what consumes your thoughts controls your life So I'll just ask a question A lonely simple question I'll just ask one question What if What if What if What if What if I What if What if What if What if What if I What if What if What if What if What if I What if What if What if What if What if I

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Thoughts and prayers.

You started off by completely dismissing a player's HOF candidacy because of number of Pro Bowls, like that's the only factor in ranking a quarterbacks' play. Then when I called you out and brought up several points on why the Pro Bowl is bullshit, rather than actually explain why it's important, you move the goalpost moving about "find me a quarterback that only has one pro bowl in the HOF". As I suspected you moved to the trope of "wins being a QB statistic". But you can't connect the dots that it's a lot harder to win for the league's worst organization. Gee, what a surprise that the Lions have had a bad record against winning teams, it's not like that's happened to them a lot before? You picked a random 2017 game where the Lions leading rusher was something called *checks notes* Tion Green? Great job! Why bring up Jared Goff? Well he has two pro bowls, was the # 1 pick, won playoff games, and went to a Super Bowl, probably has a better record against winning teams. Clearly that makes him a better than QB than Stafford right? Wins, check, pro bowls, check. That's all that matters right? Is Andy Dalton better than Matt Stafford? You still haven't answered.

The Lions really needed to upgrade their QB after no playoff wins in 12 years, so surely trading their "garbage time king" for a proven winner like Jared Goff who is young, had won playoff games and went to a Super Bowl was going to be the answer to their problems, right? Yup, and that paid off to the tune of *checks notes*, 3 wins. Oh well that's just one fluky year, they were a playoff contenders before the "garbage time king" showed up right? Wow, am I seeing this correctly, that they had 8 straight losing seasons before Stafford got there, and 17 straight years before that with no playoff wins. You're right, Stafford really destroyed that well respected franchise, must just be a coincidence that his new team won a Superbowl. You glossed right over the point about Stafford having more 4th quarter comebacks than anyone in the league since he arrived...how can that be possible if he's the garbage time king. Why do you think he's on pace to obliterate the pass attempt record? Is that something he just decided to try for when he entered the league? You didn't address my question....is Andy Dalton a better QB and closer to HOF worthy because he has 3 Pro Bowl berths and Stafford has 1?

Goff is a checkdown machine that utterly held back the Rams from having multiple titles. Any rams fan would tell you they were winning in spite of him, that McVay was having to scheme around all of him by short designed passes and hiding him as much as possible with the run game. Stafford will throw INTs from time to time but is willing to take chances and can bring a team back from behind. It's not a coincidence that Cooper Kupp put up the numbers he did in large part to the upgrade of Goff to Stafford. You missed the part of my post where the two throws to Kupp I referenced were during the Tampa game. Stafford didn't have any INTs in that game, and the reason he needed those throws were because of the four fumbles that other players lost. No way Goff does that with less than a minute left, they would be watching yet another Tom Brady super bowl victory if he was playing. But since you're bringing up the super bowl, one of the INTs in the Super Bowl popped up off his WRs hands and went to a defender. The other one was a 50/50 ball thrown up on 3rd and 14 in the endzone, not a great throw but also not a back breaker. He also doesn't need a TD at the end if the refs don't miss a blatant OPI call on the Higgins TD. I don't ever remember the media giving Stafford much credit for anything. If anything it was the narrative that Cam faced his first two seasons of having good stats but not being a "winner" even though plenty of times he put his team in position to do so only to have things he had no control over cost him games.

I can't believe I'm having to explain to you that the Pro Bowl is a popularity contest. It's not a surprise that someone who played QB for the Detroit Lions, the worst franchise in NFL history for most of his career is not going to get elected to the Pro Bowl every year. He played his entire career in the same conference as Drew Brees, Aaron Rodgers, and Russell Wilson who are all locks for the hall of fame. He's at almost 50,000 yards passing for his career and he's only 33. He's had more 4th quarter comebacks that any other quarterback since he came in the league (despite playing for the Lions). He had three more of them in the playoffs this year, including one against Brady and now has a Super Bowl championship to top it off. Two or three more seasons with a deep playoff run or another championship and I don't know how you can exclude him, especially since Philip Rivers and Eli Manning are likely getting in.

I saw what I thought was a push in real time that knocked Ramsey down. I didn’t see it was the facemask until replay.

I would have said that about last year's Super Bowl, not this year's

Hey don’t forget about Johnny “Football” Wolford. He got a ring out of this.

Agree with everything you said here except that Brady didn’t win a SB with Caldwell. Caldwell was his #1 WR for one season, in 2006 when Manning finally beat the Patriots and then won the SB. He dropped 2 passes in that game. If anything though it proves your point further.

So that’s the only way you judge a players career? Does that mean that Andy Dalton is a better QB because he’s been to three?

This sounds a lot like those people that never liked Cam Newton from the get go and were never going to have their opinion changed no matter what he did. There is ZERO chance that Jared Goff could have made those two throws with all that was on the line to Kupp at the end against Tampa and a 10 point 4th quarter comeback against the Niners to even make it to this game. There’s a reason McVay and Snead were willing to give up two first rounders to dump Goffs contract, and bring in Stafford. I guarantee you there’s no point in the last 4 weeks they’ve regretted that call.

If he retired today, I’m not sure. If he played at a high level for 2-3 more years, I would say yes.

So is he above average or is he a bum? How is it possible to be both? Sam Darnold, Jared Goff and Carson Wentz are bums. I get you adopted the bengals and are emotional after they came up short, but stafford came up big after losing Beckham, having his running backs average less than 2 yards per carry, and having to throw prominently to *checks notes* Brycen Hopkins and Ben Skowronek when the bengals were triple covering kupp. He’s not on the level of mahomes, Allen, Herbert etc…as he’s a little older but he’s also not some guy that was just along for the ride either.

Incorrect, he proved a lot of people wrong who believed he was the problem in Detroit. But just as in Detroit he wouldnt be good enough to carry a a bad team and even worse coaching staff if he were here.