Cameron Artis Payne should start over J-Stew

[CPF4LIFE]

Looks like hurney is gonna have to trade or cut somebody again for the coaches to get the message.

[Ace_Aladdin]

@Jeremy Igo have you heard anything from coaching staff to get CAP more carries with CMC getting extra load in the receiving game.

 

@KB_fan

@KillerKat

@AggieLean

 

[AviationMX]

Honestly, I would love to have a smash mouth running game, using all of our weapons. We ran well against MN, a good defense but I agree with the OP and others...we need change the tempo with CAP, CMC and TE schemes.

Stew has a role, ..I think he still have some miles left but we need to be committed to the run and use some imagination to keep our opponents off balance. 

[uncfan888]

It's hilarious that sanjay is allowed to make a thread questioning the coaches but if I do it, he tells me to find another team and calls me a racist. Hypocrite 

[TheBiggerCat]

You see this same mindset with other teams and coaches. I dont get it. You clearly have a player on the bench that would be more effective than the starter. But the coach will stubbornly stick with his vet favorite. Examples being the Titans with Murray and Henry. The Dolphins with Williams and Drake. Until Williams got injured. But at least those teams do slit the carries somewhat between those backs. I really don't get why CAP hasn't been involved  in the backfield.

[kungfoodude]

I am not sure CAP is anything other than JAG. I don't see sound logic in making that move this late in the game(especially with the potential to get a better seed in play). Stew is showing his age but CMC hasn't been effective running the ball consistently either, so I am not sure just swapping the RB is going to change much. The interior of our line has been banged up all season, so I am sure that probably has a pretty big impact on our running game effectiveness. 

Also, why even waste any effort at all bitching about Shula not running the kind of running plays that the Huddle prefers? The dude has been our OC since 2013. Do you really think that he is magically going to change his scheme? His offense has some good points and he does a good job here and there. But the bulk of it is frustrating and hard for most of us to fathom the logic behind. At this point, he is who we thought he was and it is what it is. 

[CRA]

we will run Stewart for one painfully slow and inefficient yard over and over again in the playoffs. 

there is zero doubt we this franchise will do with an old RB that isn't effective. 

[kungfoodude]

11 minutes ago, CRA said:

we will run Stewart for one painfully slow and inefficient yard over and over again in the playoffs. 

there is zero doubt we this franchise will do with an old RB that isn't effective. 

I am not sure it is really as much about him being effective as setting him up to be successful. That's Shula's issue with the running game, IMO. We do this narrow range of running plays the bulk of the time, whether they are successful or not. Then we just hope Cam bails us out. 

[PantherNation123]

30 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

I am not sure CAP is anything other than JAG. I don't see sound logic in making that move this late in the game(especially with the potential to get a better seed in play). Stew is showing his age but CMC hasn't been effective running the ball consistently either, so I am not sure just swapping the RB is going to change much. The interior of our line has been banged up all season, so I am sure that probably has a pretty big impact on our running game effectiveness. 

Also, why even waste any effort at all bitching about Shula not running the kind of running plays that the Huddle prefers? The dude has been our OC since 2013. Do you really think that he is magically going to change his scheme? His offense has some good points and he does a good job here and there. But the bulk of it is frustrating and hard for most of us to fathom the logic behind. At this point, he is who we thought he was and it is what it is. 

Because Stew hasn't been playing very well overall.  You have a guy in CAP who has shown flashes of explosiveness more consistently.  That is the sound logic.... Not saying you bench Stewart, but just give CAP a few more carries (than 0) and see what he does with him.  If he does well.... feed him the rock more.  Pretty simple really

[CRA]

14 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

I am not sure it is really as much about him being effective as setting him up to be successful. That's Shula's issue with the running game, IMO. We do this narrow range of running plays the bulk of the time, whether they are successful or not. Then we just hope Cam bails us out. 

he is old and slow simply getting the the line of scrimmage.   The rule of 30 has always been a rule for a reason for RBs.  VERY few beat the 30 mark. 

You can watch CMC, Fozzy, CAP and then Stew all run comparable plays.  Stewart is just old. 

I mean, we can debate Shula's run scheme if you want....but that is another topic IMO

[kungfoodude]

54 minutes ago, CRA said:

he is old and slow simply getting the the line of scrimmage.   The rule of 30 has always been a rule for a reason for RBs.  VERY few beat the 30 mark. 

You can watch CMC, Fozzy, CAP and then Stew all run comparable plays.  Stewart is just old. 

I mean, we can debate Shula's run scheme if you want....but that is another topic IMO

I just don't see how making a substantial switch in Week 17 is going to make a big impact. Futhermore, I really don't think I am a big believer in CAP. CMC is much more explosive than Stew but is only averaging 0.4/yards a rush more. IMO, the issues we have(OL injuries/play and scheme) are probably going to negate any perceived or actual benefits that giving CAP the bulk of Stew's carries offer.

That said, don't misconstrue this as being a Stewart fan boy. If we can jettison him in the offseason, I think it is high time to move on at that position.

[CRA]

1 minute ago, kungfoodude said:

I just don't see how making a substantial switch in Week 17 is going to make a big impact. Futhermore, I really don't think I am a big believer in CAP. CMC is much more explosive than Stew but is only averaging 0.4/yards a rush more. IMO, the issues we have(OL injuries/play and scheme) are probably going to negate any perceived or actual benefits that giving CAP the bulk of Stew's carries offer.

That said, don't misconstrue this as being a Stewart fan boy. If we can jettison him in the offseason, I think it is high time to move on at that position.

consistently running for 1 yard vs 3-4 actually makes a huge difference for an offense over the course of the game.   Stewart just doesn't have it.  Eyeball test is very clear.  

Averages skew reality sometimes in football.  two players could average 4 yards a carry.  The consistency in those runs however can be wildly different. 

[juliosantos]

maybe if we blow out atl we rest stew

[kungfoodude]

On 12/28/2017 at 10:42 AM, CRA said:

consistently running for 1 yard vs 3-4 actually makes a huge difference for an offense over the course of the game.   Stewart just doesn't have it.  Eyeball test is very clear.  

Averages skew reality sometimes in football.  two players could average 4 yards a carry.  The consistency in those runs however can be wildly different. 

Actually, Stewart has a higher First Down Percentage than CMC this season. Stew is at 20.7% and CMC at 18.0%. They both also have the same number of 20+ and 40+ yard rushes, one. The averages do tell the story in our rushing game. I am willing to bet if you look at the rushes with no gain or loss stats, they are going to be pretty similar as well. 

That's not really an accident. If the whole story was that Stewart sucked and he was 100% the problem, CMC wouldn't have such a paltry YPC averages either. IMO, our problems stem mostly from scheme and OL issues. I would be willing to wager you could put a guy like Kamara back there, utilize him in the same way as CMC or Stew and the results wouldn't be tremendously better. 

Let me give you the Saints as an example. In the first four games, Ingram had a 4.0 YPC average, Kamara had a 4.9 YPC average and Peterson had a 3.0 YPC average. Those averages are now; Ingram at 5.0 YPC, Kamara at 6.2 YPC and Peterson at 3.5 YPC. The one thing that seems pretty clear with these numbers is that the Saints running game was having success, just not with Adrian Peterson. It's been pretty clear since then that AP is past his prime(something that is usually a pretty dramatic drop off for bigger RB's). In our case, both guys are performing pretty similarly, which is to say not very well. I don't think it is a stretch to say that is because we have just struggled as a team to run the ball, except for Cam Newton. In fact, if you remove Cam's production from our stats, we drop from a 4.3 YPC average as a team to 3.9 YPC. 

Again, my ultimate point is that we are going to struggle as a team from the RB position pretty much no matter who is back there because of the OL issues and scheme issues.