interesting article on running and defense

[carolinanimal]

Article talks about running game and defense and how it correlates to championships and how this has changed. what do you guys think? Think the old way of play good defense and run the ball still holds true?

http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5d814a895c&template=with-video-with-comments&confirm=true

[Snake]

The fact of the matter is NO would not be as good if they didnt have such a good Defense. Also the last 5 SB winners have had very good Defenses. Now running the ball is def a lost art and with the NFL and there new rules they have made the NFL a passing league.

[CRA]

I agree.

the way to win use to be run the ball and play D....now it is pass the ball and play D.

[panthers55]

I think you have to separate the regular season from the championships. High powered offenses get you in the playoffs but don't necessarily win championships. How long has it been since a top five offense won a championship? Indy in 2006 when their defense played lights out. When did a top 5 defense win? Last year with Pittsburgh.

Last year three of the top 4 teams remaining at the end of the season were in the top 5 in defense.

Of the top 5 offensive teams this season- all of them are in the top half in defense in yards. If you look at points allowed here they are:

New Orleans- 15th (20.1)

Indianapolis Colts: 3rd (16.7)

New England Patriots: 7th (18.4)

Dallas Cowboys: 2nd (16.5)

Minnesota Vikings: 8th (18.5)

So in the only defensive stat. that matters 4 of the five are in the top 10 in fewest points allowed. So in my analysis it doesn't matter whether you run or pass, if you give up fewer points than you score you win.

Another problem with his story is that 3 of the top five offenses also have top 10 rushing attacks as well. It isn't passing versus rushing, it is more point differential between what you score and what you give up.

[OneBadassCat]

Of course I think it still holds true. But you have to be able to pass when you need to and we can't do that right now. We are completely one dimensional that's why we aren't winning.

[Pantherfan75]

Of course I think it still holds true. But you have to be able to pass when you need to and we can't do that right now. We are completely one dimensional that's why we aren't winning.

Agreed. A balanced pass/run offense can match up better against great defenses.

And this definitely is why the Panthers are struggling. Passing forces coverage to open-up, which spreads out the linebackers and keeps them in the flat and not plugging running lanes. If the defense knows your QB can't throw accurately in man-coverage, they'll constantly stack the box and your running game suffers. But if the QB is accurate, they'll play off the line and now a 2 or 3 yard rush can become a 5 or 7 yard rush.

Last year, everyone was scared to death of Steve Smith. Williams and Stewart ran league high averages per rush attempt because people were playing some sort of cover-2 against us. Then, someone figured this out:

"Hey, Delhomme has no pocket presence, so overload the line, blitz him early, hit him a couple times, then he'll start making bad reads and his accuracy goes to hell."

Hence the formula for beating the Panthers, which Arizona used to perfection on us, is to put your fastest corner on smitty, pressure the hell out of Delhomme, and basically use some sort of gap-blitz to limit runs to 3 yards per carry or less.

Passing alone can win games if you have a Brees or Manning that can make accurate reads in seconds or thread a needle into good coverage. But these types of QB are rare. Maybe two or three every decade or so. Dehomme is a complete failure when it comes to this.

[CharlotteBeer.com]

I think you have to separate the regular season from the championships. High powered offenses get you in the playoffs but don't necessarily win championships. How long has it been since a top five offense won a championship? Indy in 2006 when their defense played lights out. When did a top 5 defense win? Last year with Pittsburgh.

This is an awesome point, and one I also wanted to make. Arizona may not have won, but their playoff wins can be attributed as much to their improved run game and defense as it can their high-powered passing game.

We're just now seeing the same thing with the Saints, who have had a great passing offense for years, but without a running game and defense were nothing more than mediocre.

[carolinanimal]

Another problem with his story is that 3 of the top five passing teams also have top 10 rushing attacks as well. It isn't passing versus rushing, it is more point differential between what you score and what you give up.

Top 5 passing teams per nfl.com in order

Indianapolis Colts

New England Patriots

Houston Texans

New Orleans Saints

Arizona Cardinals

Teams rank rushing the football:

Indianapolis Colts 31st

New England Patriots 17th

Houston Texans 29th

New Orleans Saints 5th

Arizona Cardinals 27th

[Dpantherman]

It used to be that you ran to set up the pass. now you have to "Pass to set up the run". If you can't pass you can't win. And as NE learned Monday Night, you also have to play Defense.

[thefuzz]

It's all about making the playoffs, then anything can happen.

To make the playoffs on a consistent basis, you have to be able to throw the rock.

Also, if you can throw the football, your D has a better chance at being above average. Because many times they play with a lead, other teams have to pass, and they know that they can take chances, because of the O behind them.

[carolinanimal]

look at the patriots! won three superbowls with mediocre running games.

[Snake]

Of course I think it still holds true. But you have to be able to pass when you need to and we can't do that right now. We are completely one dimensional that's why we aren't winning.

NO had no run game last year and No Defense. The were poster child for One dimensional. You cant be successful in this league if everyone knows what your doing.

[Wither]

It isn't passing versus rushing, it is more point differential between what you score and what you give up.

Not to get too technical or anything, but isn't that obvious? Passing + Rushing = Score Points. Defense = Don't Give Points. Scores Points + Don't Give Points = Point Differential.

I see your overall point, but it's an obvious one. The author is trying to find out why that is true and makes a proposition based on that.

[Pantherfan75]

NO had no run game last year and No Defense. The were poster child for One dimensional. You cant be successful in this league if everyone knows what your doing.

You're right on about NO's Run game and D. They have vastly improved their running attack (up to #5 right now from #28 last year), and moderately improved their D (#16 from #23)

But this year, somehow (read: #18), Indy is getting it done (barely) with the 31st best rushing offense in the league and the 15th best D. So they're proving your team can have success if your QB is one of the best the game has ever seen and a shoe-in for the Hall of Fame.