Panthers' Offense: Some Core Concerns Surfacing Early

[OldhamA]

1 hour ago, mrcompletely11 said:

Timestamp me a throw you like

Good god there's zero zip on his throws. 

[Bear Hands]

2 hours ago, joemac said:

I just don't understand why we hire a bright, young McVay disciple, and then implement NONE of the McVay style of offense.  WTF does Thomas Brown even do day to day?  Reich needs to give up the damn clipboard and get out of his own way - before its too late for everybody.

Reich has mentioned collaborating and working together on building a playbook but I just don't see much at all of what where the philosophy and calls are coming from the wide zone systems/Brown's side of things.    

That's a huge question for me.  I'd really like to know what the deal is with what we've seen.  Are they (a) still implementing (b) favoring more generic west coast principles (c) combination?

I can see the easy answer being a or c but they need to show it--I see a lot of deep step backs w/ developing routes, they're running dives, some traps, WC 3 WR sets, some pistol, very few stuff like bunch formations w/variable personnel which shouldn't be difficult to throw into the sauce pan.

[joemac]

1 minute ago, Bear Hands said:

Reich has mentioned collaborating and working together on building a playbook but I just don't see much at all of what where the philosophy and calls are coming from the wide zone systems/Brown's side of things.    

That's a huge question for me.  I'd really like to know what the deal is with what we've seen.  Are they (a) still implementing (b) favoring more generic west coast principles (c) combination?

I can see the easy answer being a or c but they need to show it--I see a lot of deep step backs w/ developing routes, they're running dives, some traps, WC 3 WR sets, some pistol, very few stuff like bunch formations w/variable personnel which shouldn't be difficult to throw into the sauce pan.

Do we even have 1 WR who would be ideal in a West Coast type system?

[Bear Hands]

7 hours ago, Panthering said:

Yeah this is my gripe as well. I understand other teams have better talent than us but it still looks like teams like the Rams, Dolphins, 49ers of the world are playing an entirely different sport PRE-SNAP. I am not even addressing what happens after the snap, which hasn't been good either. 

It's a tough pill for fans to swallow after Reich openly talked about how vanilla preseason is and how he specifically called it that way and said it was "good" that it was boring. To then trot out the exact same stuff is just brutal to watch unfold for a team that's so talent deficient on that side of the ball. 

They simply aren't helping themselves here, I would much rather see some creativity to open it up and take shots. They did this on one playcall that I liked, someone set a pick to release Mingo (I think) up the right sideline, he was open, then Bryce overthrew it. I can live with those plays! It really is a shame that Laviska is such a dud of a route runner that he can't even get on the field as a WR in the regular season. We need his speed out there desperately. 

 

Meant to respond to this -- I can definitely agree.

Just look at the recently succesful teams and the coaching tree/affiliations:

McVay/LAR, Shanahan/SF, McDaniel/MIA, Taylor/CIN, O'Connell/MIN, Staley/LAC...not to mention BJ (under Campbell in DET and Waldren under Carrol in SEA are carving out really stellar offenses.  LeFleur is making Love look pretty effective without their main weapons at 100%.  They're all intertwined in more than a few ways.

The McCoy/Haley tree that Reich, Sirianni, Steichen and a few stem from has promising aspects but it's a mixed bag of old and new.  And very dependent on who's running the offense.  

We just look to be on an entirely different plane than most and it falls like this bc of scheme and their philosophies (and a few other factors I mentioned in the OP). 

I just thought we were finally pushing past this fragmented cellar we've found ourselves in for some time with the new staff.  I officially have some heavy pause.  The next few weeks and how this offense progresses/regresses will be telling.  

I'm of the opinion coaching outweighs QB and player by a little bit of a margin so if you don't have the right coach, you're not getting to the big games.  You can make it there with a balance of parts/players...but not without the right coach.  Rarely there are players that can supersede -- Brady, Cam, etc.

Edited September 19, 2023 by Bear Hands

[Byrdman4real]

5 hours ago, Castavar said:

They just love moving those goalposts further and further back eh? First it was "it's just preseason, everything's vanilla". Then it was "it's only one week, chill out". Now it's "just wait until week8/9". After that it will be "just wait until next year when Bryce has a year under his belt". So forth and so on. Newsflash people, this offense ain't getting no better UNLESS Frank Reich lets Thomas Brown do what he was hired to do.

This

[stratocatter]

9 hours ago, 4Corners said:

Come on guys the preseason don’t matter 

That is what they are treating it like. And if you think about it, until a couple years ago we played our fourth preseason game opening week.

And the first week of the season was this past weekend, and those game have traditionally been bad indicators of season success. 
I always threw the first game out in the days of 4 preseason games because non predictable poo always happened, without fail. Not with every team but to enough that you just cant trust the results. 

So you are kind of right, in tne joke you are making without really intending to be. 
The first real game, traditionally, that you can start to get a handle on teams, is coming up in week three. That is when poo really starts. If they suck hard after three weeks, start making holiday vacation plans.