Bryce was allegedly yelled at by Bozeman...

[BrisbanePanther]

9 hours ago, BenjaminBreeg said:

The frequency of ums is a lot higher after losses than after (the two) wins. That's my point. When he's under some kind of duress, his speech deteriorates alarmingly. It's normal for a person's speech to deteriorate when under duress, by the way, but not to the extent that Bryce exhibits. Other QBs after a tough loss would look angry or subdued, but they could still string together terse but coherent sentences to express their disappointment and frustration. Not Bryce though, he was often on the verge of crying, with his voice trembling while he uttered endless streams of ums as if he's reading Shakespeare in Morse code. I don't know about you, but his fidgety behavior on camera and his panicky play on the field are to me a sign of his lack of mental toughness. 

Fair enough. It may be worth seeing his Bama pressers to get a bigger sample size, but I get your point. I think the ums and ahs are also him always trying to find the "right" thing say all the time, so he uses 100 words (60-70 of them fillers) when 10 would do. When you lose and have a lot of uncertainty, it's a lot harder to do that. I don't know that it's a sign of lack of mental toughness as much as a telltale sign he's significantly less confident now than he was six months ago. We criticise him for overthinking while playing. He clearly is doing the same while speaking. My voice trembles sometimes when I'm talking about things I actually like, so much so that I actually have to mentally tell myself, "no shaky voice!"

On the other hand, I clearly remember Cam's post Super Bowl presser and he was excoriated for it (unfairly IMO), including in this here forum. Even Stroud's presser after the lost to Carolina was dissected and some Texans fans thought he was coming after Slowik, and I guarantee that if they ever hit a downturn his demeanour at pressers will be attacked too.

[BrisbanePanther]

9 hours ago, mrcompletely11 said:

Recording yourself solves a lot and also taking a class such as Dale Carnegie etc would solve this issue.  Its pretty nuts the panthers pr hasnt worked with him because he sounds horrible in his pressers.

100% agree. Maybe they were saving that for next year too...dopes.

[BrisbanePanther]

3 hours ago, csx said:

His footwork got the coach and qb coach fired according to the athletic.

I mean, it didn't "get them fired". They lack of attention to it did--or at least helped.

[raleigh-panther]

9 hours ago, BenjaminBreeg said:

The frequency of ums is a lot higher after losses than after (the two) wins. That's my point. When he's under some kind of duress, his speech deteriorates alarmingly. It's normal for a person's speech to deteriorate when under duress, by the way, but not to the extent that Bryce exhibits. Other QBs after a tough loss would look angry or subdued, but they could still string together terse but coherent sentences to express their disappointment and frustration. Not Bryce though, he was often on the verge of crying, with his voice trembling while he uttered endless streams of ums as if he's reading Shakespeare in Morse code. I don't know about you, but his fidgety behavior on camera and his panicky play on the field are to me a sign of his lack of mental toughness. 

You are correct

i thought darnold was bad with the ‘like’s and ‘you know’ but this kid 

..my god I forget which presser it was..,he had a tank top on and the fidgeting and scratching himself under the tank and was totally cringe worthy …it was constant 

I do not expect a great oration from a pro football player but  sweet baby Jesus, he’s bad    Did he never talk to the press at Bama ?   …I mean, I know it’s Alabama…but come on 

…and this….is the face of the franchise … lol.  Fitting 

[csx]

1 hour ago, BrisbanePanther said:

I mean, it didn't "get them fired". They lack of attention to it did--or at least helped.

We don't know if they didn't pay attention. Its possible but i doubt 2 former qbs wouild ignore it. What we know is his footwork has been constantly bad from Alabama to last Sunday. They weren't effective in changing it. Sure. But he also bears responsibility. He was the #1 pick. He's supposed to be to be the football savant

Edited January 6, 2024 by csx

[strato]

5 hours ago, csx said:

His footwork got the coach and qb coach fired according to the athletic.

That's one way to interpret it. There is something to that. 

His footwork should get everyone that okayed his selection fired, and himself unpicked. It was there when they selected him. And I can’t think of a single worse example of someone ‘dropping’ back in such a way. Honestly. (and we aren’t to the shifting from drop to being in position to throw yet, that’s just half so far). 

I bet maybe two people thought it could be fixed and a couple more agreed with the boss because they saw what happened when you didn’t.

I remember a breakdown of Stroud’s footwork and whoever did it was very impressed. Called it special. ::::headbang::::

Edited January 6, 2024 by strato

[WUnderhill]

13 hours ago, BenjaminBreeg said:

The term "NFL-open" is popular this season because Bryce backers (most of whom are hilariously lacking in basic football knowledge) need to be educated on the fact that the NFL is very different from college football. In the NFL, receivers don't get nearly as much separation from defenders as they do at Alabama, whose players are significantly more talented than the opposition, save two or three opponents each season. In the NFL, the talent disparity is much smaller and throwing windows are far tighter, and therefore the demand on timing, processing, and ball placement (throwing receivers open is a big thing) is also significantly higher. This is precisely why so very many good college QBs don't make it in the NFL. Bryce backers just can't seem to grasp this simple fact and instead they resort to blaming the O-line, the receivers, the coaches, and anything and everything except their golden boy.

Yeah everybody needs you to educate them that college is different from the NFL.

You say “NFL open” because that’s the best you can do for our abysmal receivers to put as much of the blame on the QB as possible. Separation charts had been posted earlier in the season. It wasn’t good. Again, nobody’s in here absolving the QB of all blame. He’s missed throws. He’s accounted for his own share of sacks and mistakes. EVERY QB has. Some of us just choose to acknowledge the dumpster fire around him as well. If there’s anybody I’m in “wait and see” mode with it’s the rookie QB, not the vet OL whiffing on blocks, not the slow receivers quitting on routes, not the jag RBs. You can keep screaming bust for another season if you want because like it or not Young will get at least that. Sounds fun.

[BenjaminBreeg]

1 hour ago, WUnderhill said:

Yeah everybody needs you to educate them that college is different from the NFL.

You say “NFL open” because that’s the best you can do for our abysmal receivers to put as much of the blame on the QB as possible. Separation charts had been posted earlier in the season. It wasn’t good. Again, nobody’s in here absolving the QB of all blame. He’s missed throws. He’s accounted for his own share of sacks and mistakes. EVERY QB has. Some of us just choose to acknowledge the dumpster fire around him as well. If there’s anybody I’m in “wait and see” mode with it’s the rookie QB, not the vet OL whiffing on blocks, not the slow receivers quitting on routes, not the jag RBs. You can keep screaming bust for another season if you want because like it or not Young will get at least that. Sounds fun.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but our receivers are not as terrible as you say they are. Here are the latest data points I can find (because I don't have a subscription). 

The X-axis is teams' average receiver separation. The Y-axis is the percentage of throws a QB makes to open receivers (i.e. how often a QB finds an open man and throws to him). According to the chart, our receivers are somewhat below NFL average in achieving separation (13 teams are ranked below us), while our golden boy Bryce is ranked 3rd from the last in throwing to open receivers, ahead of only Tannehill and Sam Howell. 

Well, well, well, would you look at that! Hah!

You certainly don't hear (nearly as much) bitching about poor receiver separation from backers of Jared Goff, Patrick Mahomes, Josh Allen, Dak Prescott, Jordan Love, Justin Herbert, Geno Smith, Russell Wilson, or even Justin Fields. All of them have receivers achieving even less separation than ours, and yet they don't have nearly as much trouble finding open receivers and throwing to them. 

Of course, the data is only through the first nine weeks, and it could be (although I don't know for sure) that our receivers' performance has trailed off since then. I wouldn't be surprised if it has, because who wouldn't be sick and tired of playing for a QB who can't even manage simple 3-, 5-, or 7-step drops? Why bust your ass to get open when your QB rarely ever finds you and throws to you?

That said, nine games are still a decent sample size. There is no denying that your golden boy sucks at finding NFL-open receivers.

Now you see what I mean about Bryce backers being hilariously lacking in football knowledge? Get this through your head: Bryce Young is the problem!

 

Edited January 6, 2024 by BenjaminBreeg

[mav1234]

I'd like mroe detail on what percent of throws to open men mean.  For instance, is it percent of throws to open men out of total percent of throws, or out of total percent of throws in which a player was open?  That's an important distinction.

[LinvilleGorge]

The complaints about the ums and ahs are honestly just dumb. Nobody would care if he looked good on the field.

[BenjaminBreeg]

2 hours ago, mav1234 said:

I'd like mroe detail on what percent of throws to open men mean.  For instance, is it percent of throws to open men out of total percent of throws, or out of total percent of throws in which a player was open?  That's an important distinction.

Could you rephrase the question? I'm not clear on what you're asking.

Not sure if this would help, but that chart tallies all the receivers running all the routes, not just receivers who ended up being targeted by the QB. 

 

[mav1234]

8 minutes ago, BenjaminBreeg said:

Could you rephrase the question? I'm not clear on what you're asking.

Not sure if this would help, but that chart tallies all the receivers running all the routes, not just receivers who ended up being targeted by the QB. 

 

Let me put it this way - we know what the numerator is in this case, a throw to an open receiver. If the denominator is the total number of passes attempted, it doesn't tell us if a receiver was open on a play and thus it doesn't tell us if Bryce actually made a bad read.  If the denominator is the number of plays in which a receiver is open and a throw is attempted, it would tell us more on that.  Aka, is Bryce not throwing to open men because nobody is open?  That is actually what I think this figure might show from the last time it came up. 

Average separation isn't a great measure on if players are always open on plays, but it indicates approximately if receivers are getting space... It will be really badly skewed if a team has a heavily targeted guy good at getting open (what I suspect is going on with Goff)... Ours is towards the middle/ low end of that, which is consistent with what I think of our receivers...

Our receivers are better than a lot of the crazy defenders of Bryce say, but they're still pretty bad, lol. There are plays where nobody is actually open... It seems about half of our passing plays are like that.

[BenjaminBreeg]

1 hour ago, mav1234 said:

Let me put it this way - we know what the numerator is in this case, a throw to an open receiver. If the denominator is the total number of passes attempted, it doesn't tell us if a receiver was open on a play and thus it doesn't tell us if Bryce actually made a bad read.  If the denominator is the number of plays in which a receiver is open and a throw is attempted, it would tell us more on that.  Aka, is Bryce not throwing to open men because nobody is open?  That is actually what I think this figure might show from the last time it came up. 

Yes, the denominator for the Y-axis appears to be all passes attempted. The X-axis shows average separation receivers achieve for all routes run on all pass plays. Even though the chart doesn't tell us how open our receivers were on any given pass play, it does show where they stand compared to their peers on other teams. The point I was making, as you also rightly pointed out, is that our receivers aren't the bottom dwellers many Bryce fanboys are making them out to be (or at least they weren't through the first nine weeks), so that a strong case can be made that Bryce is considerably underperforming relative to the other 14 QBs whose receivers achieved similar or worse average separation. 

Edited January 6, 2024 by BenjaminBreeg

[Selltheteamtepper]

3 hours ago, LinvilleGorge said:

The complaints about the ums and ahs are honestly just dumb. Nobody would care if he looked good on the field.

Correct. But he was presented to us as this extremely articulate mature genius who was well beyond his years. That’s clearly not the case.