Anyone know which DEs we are still entertaining?

[Panthero]

Just now, Jackie Lee said:

Luckily edge is probably the most plug and play position on defense, I think draft then waiver wire is the way to go looking at the current fa options. Let DJ Johnson and Barno get a ton of work in camp to see if they are developing into anything decent

Plug and Play from a playbook perspective, yes. Not from a physicality standpoint, otherwise I'd say fug it, just draft some guys. 

[Jackie Lee]

Just now, Panthero said:

Plug and Play from a playbook perspective, yes. Not from a physicality standpoint, otherwise I'd say fug it, just draft some guys. 

I mean whoever gets cut in camp and is on the waiver wire will be in shape. Sometimes they get cut not because they're bad but because a rookie stepped up in camp and they need the roster spot somewhere else. Pretty sure there will be someone better than K'Lavon Chaisson on the waiver wire at some point

[bythenbrs]

19 minutes ago, Panthero said:

Plug and Play from a playbook perspective, yes. Not from a physicality standpoint, otherwise I'd say fug it, just draft some guys. 

Do both.  Draft and waiver wire cuts.  Let’s not overpay for one year rentals.  That’s what got us in this dumpster fire.

[Panthero]

10 minutes ago, bythenbrs said:

Do both.  Draft and waiver wire cuts.  Let’s not overpay for one year rentals.  That’s what got us in this dumpster fire.

I hadn't considered the waiver wire option--that could certainly work, but depending on the draft for a starter will be a disaster. I'm not asking for a 15 mil a year contract, just a guy to allow DJ and whoever we draft time to come along. If we'll pay for Jewell, why not a DE? I don't understand that logic. 

[bythenbrs]

1 minute ago, Panthero said:

If we'll pay for Jewell, why not a DE? I don't understand that logic. 

I have no problem with Jewell or similar Edge on a cap friendly contract.  Just don’t sign a ‘name’ like Clowney with a high salary expectations.  We need to be shopping at the bargain bin until we can build a real, legitimate roster of draft picks and young players on first contracts.  ‘Value’ signings are fine.  

[Panthero]

11 minutes ago, bythenbrs said:

I have no problem with Jewell or similar Edge on a cap friendly contract.  Just don’t sign a ‘name’ like Clowney with a high salary expectations.  We need to be shopping at the bargain bin until we can build a real, legitimate roster of draft picks and young players on first contracts.  ‘Value’ signings are fine.  

Agree completely. I think Clowny would be a mistake. Jewell and Wonnum are around 6 mil per. I was thinking that range would be fine. I prefer cheaper but I don't think that's too steep. I'd come off 10 for the right guy (under 28, willing to be here 3 years, etc.)

Edited March 23, 2024 by Panthero

[TheSpecialJuan]

5 hours ago, MHS831 said:

Just to be clear (because I do the same thing) you are referring to edge or the 3-4 rush OLB, correct?  To me, there is nothing there, short of overpaying Clowney.  I know Clowney had a good season last year, but he was on a winning team with a lot of support.  Here, he would not have as much support and he would not win as much.  I am afraid we'd be paying for performance in Baltimore and not Carolina. 

We now have Wonnum on the Strong side and he is mediocre.  We have an interesting choice in Chaisson on the Rush Edge side and he was out of position before--maybe he will return to first round pick status here.  I am cautiously optimistic.  We have Barno who played well at times and I think would improve in year 3.  Beyond that,  Johnson has underwhelmed and Leota has been below average, but he was an underafted rookie. 

I hope this is not seen as an attempt to derail your thread.  It is a good topic on its own.  I simply think the option to finding a free agent starter is to develop what you have and draft a player.  I have been researching this when you posted this, so I thought I'd share where my mind is right now:

If you look long term and at the cap, considering we are likely not going to make the playoffs, use the year to draft and develop an edge. Develop Chaisson (first round talent) and Barno, two players who have skills but lack technique, to overly simplify.

In the draft, I like the following players (note that not all players on the list are 3-4 rush OLBs like Burns was--that is what we need):

1. Chop Robinson (he could fall to the Panthers, but it is highly unlikely. pick #33)

2.  Bralen Trice (pick #65 if available) Was slow 4.72 40 but his college productivity shows 7 sacks and nearly 50 tackles.  To me, that suggests he has the potential to be effective vs the run and get pressure on the QB)

3.  Jonah Ellis (pick 65) Productive in college with 12 sacks, but his 3 passes defended suggests that he is in the face of the QB quite a bit.  I see him as a rotational player in the NFL, not a starter.

4. Austiin Booker (pick 65) He is my favorite and a value for the third round.  56 tackles and 8 sacks w/ 2 forced fumbles. He, like Bralen Trice, ran a slowish 4.79 40 but they had as many tackles as the top 3-4 OLBs and they had as many sacks, on average.

NOTE:  I like 2 others, but they played opposite studs.  Chris Braswell has a great motor but his physical makeup is questionable for an elite edge. I would seriously consider him at #39--based on the "Dawg" factor alone.  He played opposite Dallas Turner, so how many sacks were due to protecting the other side or pressure forcing the QB into Braswell's lap?  Braswell ran a 4.6 if that matters.

Adisa Isaac played opposite Chop Robinson, and he too has a high motor.He ran a 4.74 at the combine, so I have to think that the 40 times for Booker, Trice, and Isaac are based on 40 times--which means very little. It does measure, however, the takeoff and release. 

So I guess my point?  If you are building a program, develop some youth at $2m per season as opposed to paying a journeyman $8m for a rental season.

Nice work. 

[csx]

18 hours ago, Panthero said:

Agree completely. I think Clowny would be a mistake. Jewell and Wonnum are around 6 mil per. I was thinking that range would be fine. I prefer cheaper but I don't think that's too steep. I'd come off 10 for the right guy (under 28, willing to be here 3 years, etc.)

Clowney made 4.7 m will bonuses last year. He's not likely as expensive as everyone is thinking.

[Panthero]

7 minutes ago, csx said:

Clowney made 4.7 m will bonuses last year. He's not likely as expensive as everyone is thinking.

In that case, mistake rescinded! I'd have thought 10 minimum. 

[csx]

29 minutes ago, Panthero said:

In that case, mistake rescinded! I'd have thought 10 minimum. 

I could take him or leave him. Won't be upset either way. 

[Bear Hands]

I’ll take Chop, Kneeland, or Elliss please

[MHS831]

1 minute ago, Bear Hands said:

I’ll take Chop, Kneeland, or Elliss please

Jonah Ellis is going to be the steal of the draft--even if we take him at #33.  Under the radar.

[Bear Hands]

Just now, MHS831 said:

Jonah Ellis is going to be the steal of the draft--even if we take him at #33.  Under the radar.

Yeah not the best edge class but there’s a few (him included) that could be great. Elliss would slide right into a Jack role for us. His spin move is Freeney-esque

Then there’s Kneeland who is a straight up bully. Can set the edge, bull rush, throw OTs backwards. He also surprised with the best 3-cone and short shuttle. So he’s sneaky quick. 

I believe both of those guys are way high on team boards over certain website rankings.

[Jackie Lee]

46 minutes ago, Bear Hands said:

Yeah not the best edge class but there’s a few (him included) that could be great. Elliss would slide right into a Jack role for us. His spin move is Freeney-esque

Then there’s Kneeland who is a straight up bully. Can set the edge, bull rush, throw OTs backwards. He also surprised with the best 3-cone and short shuttle. So he’s sneaky quick. 

I believe both of those guys are way high on team boards over certain website rankings.

Good to know, the mock draft sims are depressing for the edge