Young nominated again...

[jb2288]

1 hour ago, tukafan21 said:

I don't think he's worthy of being nominated for the award this week, even with those very broken down stats.  He had a great statistical game, I'm not saying he didn't, I just see how it was a Top 6 statistical performance this week.

Brown's 10 receptions for 132 Yards and 2 TDs is so much better than anything Bryce put out there statistically today.

It also means you're giving more credit to the "3 TDs of 30+ yards" than Mahomes throwing for 25% more yards and an extra TD, which is something else I'd disagree on, if you need to break down how long a TD pass was to give reasoning as to why lesser stats were actually better than someone else's, then I think you're hurting your own argument.

And yes, I know I've been a very vocal anti Bryce guy, but this has NOTHING to do with that.  I just view this as an award that is purely statistically based, and if anything, could (or maybe should) be done blind and only looking at box score output without knowing players or game outcomes.  And in that view, I don't see how Bryce had a game worthy of being nominated for the award this week, that there were at least 6 better purely statistical performances, that's all.

QBs win MVP (year, month, week, whatever timeframe you want) all the time where it 100% should go to a RB, WR, CB, DE, etc. QBs with a hot week will always be discussed in these type of meaningless awards. You are seriously overanalyzing this. 

[cranky]

1 hour ago, tukafan21 said:

No, it's that there are a lot of us who think we're winning in spite of Bryce and that he is not, and can not, succeed at a high level in this league.  The reason we're becoming more vocal the last month or so is because we see the writing on the wall, and that the team's success in spite of him is going to get his 5th year extension picked up and brought as our starter despite his actual play not being worthy of either.

But I KNOW there are many Panthers fans who want to see Bryce succeed so badly that they are completely blind to the glaringly obvious issues he has and have wet dreams over mediocre games.

I'm sorry, but I'm just so sick of people making comments like this.

It's so asinine to think the anti Bryce crowd is willing to spend as much time as they do watching the games, following the team, talking on here or other places online, spend our money on team gear, etc, but because we don't think a player is good enough to be our long term QB and give specific and legitimate reasons why, that we want to see the Panthers tank.

It's just such nonsense

I will fully give him credit that he's improved in certain areas, particularly turnovers.  But small improvements in some areas don't make up for his severe limitations and issues in other critical aspects.  

Saying these things doesn't mean we want the Panthers to fail, it just means we have objective opinions and aren't afraid to voice them, even if unpopular with a segment of our fan base.

He is 23rd in QB Rating, there are only 3 QB's in the league with at least 10 starts who have less passing yards per game (not to mention he's 29th in the league in YPG overall).  But some fans here think he's playing at some elite level and has proven he deserves to be our long term solution.

“All I know is you’ve spent a lot of time and energy arguing that a Panthers player doesn’t deserve national recognition for their performance. That just seems like an odd stance for a fan to take.”

[jb2288]

Just now, cranky said:

“All I know is you’ve spent a lot of time and energy arguing that a Panthers player doesn’t deserve national recognition for their performance. That just seems like an odd stance for a fan to take.”

Seriously. It's a Twitter poll, not the Heisman trophy. He should just go cast his vote for another NFC team and move on. 

[tukafan21]

18 minutes ago, jb2288 said:

I literally said nothing about Bryce Young and your original post said nothing about Bryce Young. My statement was just a reply to your original comment. I'm not supporting any individual player, I'm stating that it isn't 2019, teams majority run base nickel (imagine that in 2005), and 206 yards is not an underachieving performance as insinuated. Not just for Bryce, for any QB in the NFL. 

206 yards per game would be the 20th rated passing game in the NFL this year.

I'd say if you are ranking 20th as a team in any category in the NFL, you're underachieving and need to improve there.

There are also only 3 teams I'd say ranked below that who are comfortable with their QB situation moving forward, MAYBE a 4th depending who you ask.

Two of those teams are the Ravens and Eagles, who have 2 of the best rushing attacks in the league.  Another is the Commanders, who have missed their starting QB for much of the season to injury.  The 4th would be the Jags, who seem to have a fan base that would rather move on than continue with Lawrence.  

Most Dolphins fans are very ready to move on from Tua, and it's probably too soon to say either way on Cam Ward for the Titans, the rest all are looking for changes at the position moving forward.

Edited 52 minutes ago by tukafan21

[jb2288]

2 minutes ago, tukafan21 said:

206 yards per game would be the 20th rated passing game in the NFL this year.

I'd say if you are ranking 20th as a team in any category in the NFL, you're underachieving and need to improve there.

3 TD per game would be the 1st rated TD passing game in the NFL this year at 39 blowing Stafford out by 7. 

 

Do we think that's accurate extrapolated across the full season? See how stupid an argument that is? 

[tukafan21]

14 minutes ago, jb2288 said:

3 TD per game would be the 1st rated TD passing game in the NFL this year at 39 blowing Stafford out by 7. 

 

Do we think that's accurate extrapolated across the full season? See how stupid an argument that is? 

This is some weird mental gymnastics you're trying to do here by now twisting it into extrapolating one game's stats out for a full season.  Especially since your post that I was responding to never mentioned TD's, you simply said that 206 yards wouldn't be a bad passing game in today's NFL.

I'm not extrapolating anything out to a full season, I was responding specifically to you saying in today's NFL, 206 passing yards isn't an underachieving stat line.

So unless you don't think being 20th in something out of 32 would be "underachieving", all I did was point out how the facts of today's NFL season contradict what you said.  That throwing for 206 yards in a game is clearly an underachieving stat line for today's NFL.

And if your next argument is going to be "well you're looking at season long passing averages and comparing that to one game", then that also just hurts your argument.  As if you're trying to say a one game performance is deserving of winning an award, then it should fall in the upper levels of the season long averages, not the bottom.

Edited 36 minutes ago by tukafan21

[Jon Snow]

4 minutes ago, tukafan21 said:

This is some weird mental gymnastics you're trying to do here by now twisting it into extrapolating one game's stats out for a full season.

I'm not extrapolating anything out to a full season, I was responding to you saying in today's NFL, 206 passing yards isn't an underachieving stat line.

So unless you don't think being 20th in something out of 32 would be "underachieving", all I did was point out how the facts of today's NFL season contradict what you said.  That throwing for 206 yards in a game is clearly an underachieving stat line for today's NFL.

And if your next argument is going to be "well you're looking at season long passing averages and comparing that to one game", then that also just hurts your argument.  As if you're trying to say a one game performance is deserving of winning an award, then it should fall in the upper levels of the season long averages, not the bottom.

Its not based solely on yards. Never has been. It takes in all aspects if the game performance. 

[tukafan21]

Just now, Jon Snow said:

Its not based solely on yards. Never has been. It takes in all aspects if the game performance. 

Well sure, but that's completely beyond the point in that post and this particular back and forth discussion.

These last few posts were purely about his comment of "206 yards is not an underachieving post" and nothing else besides that, nothing to do with this award.

[Jon Snow]

1 minute ago, tukafan21 said:

Well sure, but that's completely beyond the point in that post and this particular back and forth discussion.

These last few posts were purely about his comment of "206 yards is not an underachieving post" and nothing else besides that, nothing to do with this award.

This year 200 yards or less are the norm.

[tukafan21]

1 minute ago, Jon Snow said:

This year 200 yards or less are the norm.

But are they?

Or are there just more instances of throwing sub 200 than in the past, so it feels like they are the norm, but in reality, it's just that there are more than there used to be so it makes you think they're the normal game, but still the minority?

Because the stats don't agree with you, there are only 8 teams averaging less than 200 yards passing this year.  Yes, passing yards in general are a bit down this year, but sub 200 games is not the norm for teams with a good QB

[Navy_football]

So the NFL is recognizing Bryce's game, but his "fans" are saying he isn't worthy. Lawd make this make sense. Now I see what Smitty meant. Geez!

[Jon Snow]

2 minutes ago, tukafan21 said:

But are they?

Or are there just more instances of throwing sub 200 than in the past, so it feels like they are the norm, but in reality, it's just that there are more than there used to be so it makes you think they're the normal game, but still the minority?

Because the stats don't agree with you, there are only 8 teams averaging less than 200 yards passing this year.  Yes, passing yards in general are a bit down this year, but sub 200 games is not the norm for teams with a good QB

I didn't say average. Its that they are more likely to be sub 200 than 300+ yard games. 

[ncbob]

2 hours ago, TN05 said:

I’ve never seen a group of fans so unhappy to be winning

No one is unhappy to be above 500, but to be kissing BY’s jock strap is unreal! His performance is a roller coaster, mostly on the downhill side. Show me Some consistency over the next four games, I might change my mind. Show me his ability not to choke, or throw passes everywhere except where the receiver is, put up consistently good numbers and I’ll hop on the train. Until then the jury is still out as for him to be the future of this team. We are not fighting to win the Super Bowl this year, we’re trying to find out who is going to be the future leader of this franchise. 

[mav1234]

I'm happy for Bryce that he was nominated and it was a good game by him with some great throws. Always love to see Panthers nominated for and winning accolades and I don't see why a fan would really be annoyed he was. It's irrelevant to anything meaningful but it's nice for the player and team all the same.