Your Feelings on Bryce Through 3 Seasons? (POLL)

[strato]

1 hour ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

If Bryce hadn't folded like a cheap suit on the last drive, we'd still be in the playoffs. Probably could have done a lot better if we'd spent some of the huge amount of resources to get Bryce to mediocre on our defense. 

Technically we most likely would not have won on that drive just tied. 
But I am in agreement about that last 38. Nothing. Folded. Bring Canales in if you need to, but don’t leave Bryce out. Ball was in his hands 4 times. And we got zip. 

 

 

[SmokinwithWilly]

16 minutes ago, strato said:

Technically we most likely would not have won on that drive just tied. 
But I am in agreement about that last 38. Nothing. Folded. Bring Canales in if you need to, but don’t leave Bryce out. Ball was in his hands 4 times. And we got zip. 

 

 

Canales is 100% at fault for calling long balls on the 1st 3 plays. Didn't need to get it all in one chunk with 3 time outs. But it's also Bryce's job to know the situation, read the defense, and adapt to what's being given. With 3 timeouts you have the option to go into the middle of the field and stop the clock. Situational awareness by DC and BY were both horrible. DC does not have the chops to be HC and OC. 

[strato]

1 minute ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

Canales is 100% at fault for calling long balls on the 1st 3 plays. Didn't need to get it all in one chunk with 3 time outs. But it's also Bryce's job to know the situation, read the defense, and adapt to what's being given. With 3 timeouts you have the option to go into the middle of the field and stop the clock. Situational awareness by DC and BY were both horrible. DC does not have the chops to be HC and OC. 

I don’t remember the game but I could swear we saw that earlier in the year. Same fold.

The 5th to last pass Young made was absolutely a big time throw.  That last bit, turn in your clutch card. 

[DeAngelo Beason]

2 hours ago, shaq said:

10 of the top 14 defensive teams in EPA per play made the playoffs. Defensive EPA is the gold standard for how we grade and value defenses. Having a good defense is imperative to having a successful team. To your point of this team being a QB away I adamantly disagree I think we’re realistically 1-2 good off seasons away roster construction wise from truly competing for a Super Bowl. To your point that the offense needs to be upgraded I entirely agree, we were far too inconsistent last year and our running game fell off a cliff the last 6 weeks.

I don't see how you can logically make that argument when the team beat two of the top teams in the entire league during the regular season.  Now imagine the additional games we would have won against absolute tip top competitors like SF and SEA had we had a professional QB.  You can throw any random stat at the problem you want, but the proof is in the pudding.  We all watched it live.  This roster would have produced 13 wins (wins against SF and SEA, two wins against NO, and would have swept the Bucs) and (almost certainly) a #1 seed with a remotely competent QB.  Those were not games where we needed an all star performance to win.  Those were games where a very, very modest stat line would have netted us an easy win.

Nearly every measurable aspect of the team would have been significantly improved with a competent QB.

[Joe Bear]

2 hours ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

You'd be wrong in your assumptions. I watched the whole thing start to finish. Wasn't a fan at all of the prevent, but I think it had more to do with Horn being out and a CB that had barely played on the field. 

 

The middle of the field was wide open and we had 3 time outs to burn. Bryce is supposed to read the defense, change the play if necessary, which it was, and go from there. Get some yards, call the TO. 

A franchise QB, an elite processing QB, any QB, has to be able to do these things. Bryce is mediocre at best. 16 games to break 3k yards on the last play of regular season, c'mon. 

But we're picking up his 5th so there's that now. Teppers commitment to mediocrity continues. 

You're not making a good-faith argument by blaming literally everything on the quarterback when the defense gave him a fat 38 seconds to overcome its ineptitude, but it seems you're dead-set on blaming him for any problem the team encounters. In this case, it's not warranted. Sometimes it is.

But he had no time to throw (pressured on 46% of all dropbacks, an insane amount) and that's simply not all his fault -- particularly when they rush 4 or less and are in the backfield in 1.5s or less.

Should we have gotten more than 0 yards? Sure! But he hit a WR in the hands on fourth down and it was dropped. Not his fault. He missed one throw on second down but I attribute first down to a bad play call and third down to poor pass protection. I would've called some quick slants, personally, but it really seems you're saying:

- playcalling: Bryce's fault
- poor pass protection: Bryce's fault
- defensive choking away a lead: Bryce's fault, not the defense
- Horn dropping a pass: Bryce's fault

It's a great way to garner support on here, because when it comes to Bryce, logic takes such a backseat to context that it's not even in the same vehicle. Plenty of games can be attributed to him. Can't take anyone seriously who solely blames him for that one. 

[DeAngelo Beason]

3 hours ago, Joe Bear said:

Bryce Young's performance and whatever anyone thinks of it shouldn't become a built-in excuse, let alone a crutch, for the worst pass rush in the NFL. 

It's 100% part of the problem.  I am not saying we don't need upgrades.  Of course we do.  That said, we had a two touchdown lead ONCE in the ENTIRE season.  One time.  That's insanity.  It absolutely sets the defense up to fail when you have garbage time of possession and can never get a lead that affords them the luxury of playing aggressively.  

[frankw]

Two functional human beings actually voted for option 10?

[SmokinwithWilly]

37 minutes ago, Joe Bear said:

You're not making a good-faith argument by blaming literally everything on the quarterback when the defense gave him a fat 38 seconds to overcome its ineptitude, but it seems you're dead-set on blaming him for any problem the team encounters. In this case, it's not warranted. Sometimes it is.

But he had no time to throw (pressured on 46% of all dropbacks, an insane amount) and that's simply not all his fault -- particularly when they rush 4 or less and are in the backfield in 1.5s or less.

Should we have gotten more than 0 yards? Sure! But he hit a WR in the hands on fourth down and it was dropped. Not his fault. He missed one throw on second down but I attribute first down to a bad play call and third down to poor pass protection. I would've called some quick slants, personally, but it really seems you're saying:

- playcalling: Bryce's fault
- poor pass protection: Bryce's fault
- defensive choking away a lead: Bryce's fault, not the defense
- Horn dropping a pass: Bryce's fault

It's a great way to garner support on here, because when it comes to Bryce, logic takes such a backseat to context that it's not even in the same vehicle. Plenty of games can be attributed to him. Can't take anyone seriously who solely blames him for that one. 

I'm looking at the final drive, and that's where I'm laying the blame at Bryce's feet. Stepping up to the line, 38 seconds left, 3 time outs on the clock. 30 yards needed to attempt a FG. It's not Bryce's job to call the plays, that's DC's and it was terrible play calling.  It's Bryce's job to read what the defense is giving him at the line. The middle of the field is open. Rams are guarding against the deep ball and bringing pressure leaving the middle of the field ripe for the taking. Knowing his line not holding up for long, Bryce should have read the defense, called the audible, and thrown to the middle of the field for 6- 8 yards, like you said, quick slants would have worked. Then run either hurry up or call a TO. We had time. He has to make the adjustments. Any QB has to make the adjustments.

 The pass Horn dropped hit his hands but was at his knees. Should he have slid and caught it? Probably. Was the pass a good one? No it wasn't. Both players were at fault, not just Horn. Let's not pretend that Bryce threw a beautiful pass that hit the receiver chest high right in the hands in perfect stride because that damn sure wasn't the throw. 

The defense didn't choke away a lead. They never had a real lead. Choking away a lead is being up by multiple scores late in the 4th and losing. We were up by 4 and handed the ball back to a potential MVP with an All pro WR and potential future HoF WR2. One score games in the 4th are a slug fest. 28-3. That's choking away a lead. 

I don't solely blame Bryce for the game, but you seem to solely blame the defense for the game because they went to prevent after losing Horn. You are forgetting the short field that the offense left them that led to the early Puka TD on one of our 2 failed 4th down conversions. Our defense has been given very limited resources over the past 3 years while we have tried to put everything possible around Bryce. We added a little bit to the D this year after giving up a NFL record in points last year. Our defense overachieved based on what they've been given to work with. 

Edited 43 minutes ago by SmokinwithWilly