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Are the Panthers attractive to a GM prospect?

Jan 06 2013 08:11 AM Zod Carolina Panthers
If I am a high level executive looking at prospective employers, no matter the industry, I am first going to look at the task at hand. What will my responsibilities be, what will I need to fix or improve. Will I be given the support from the owner or board to fix those issues? Or am I being set up to fail?

Surely these are the same things any GM will be asking.

When I see the Panthers, I see a team with a couple extremely talented young players, but also a good number of cap heavy older non producers. I also see ownership that isn't exactly eager to aggressively seek out free agents to fill holes unless left no other option.

So, I would line up the pros and cons...

Pros
An owner that is loyal. Previous GM had longevity through losing seasons.
2 potential young all pro players at key positions, QB and MLB
3rd year coach with system in place, not starting over
Team seemed to rally late in the year, being 6-2

Cons
A complete mess of a cap
Major cuts needed right away to long term vets, leadership and chemistry will take a hit
Ownership is not exactly eager to sign free agents or trades to fill holes unless last resort
3rd year coach who can't seem to win games against quality teams
An overall tradition of losing.

The way I see it, the Carolina GM job isn't extremely attractive, but it isn't terrible either. It's somewhere in the middle of the pack.

Top notch GM candidates will have better opportunities and take them. Secondary prospects will see the Panthers as an opportunity to impress.

Beane being a secondary prospect and already in house gives him the edge. See loyalty above. All things point to him being our guy.

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100 Comments

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the GM Ernie hired Coughin and won a super bowl. why would Reese come in and fire a super bowl winning coach?how did Cowher get into the convo, besides the guy who replaced him won a super bowl and was hired by the team that consist of the GM. my point is in those organization the GM is apart of the team that fires and hires most coaches. not just the owner.


Your years are off.

Ernie left after the 2006 season.

Reese inherited Couglin for the 2007 season. Couglhin had been on the hot seat. They won the Superbowl in 2007 which was Reese's first year as GM.

Cowher was an example of a coach put on a GM. He wasn't a Superbowl coach then...

Those were just examples involving coaches put on GMs who won Superbowls. Many examples though in general. point is simply, it isn't just a Jerry Jones type move. Yes, GMs often hire coaches....put plenty of times owners put the coach in place and force a new GM to first ride it out with a HC they don't hire.

You're making some pretty strong assumptions and the only point I've been illustrating is nobody knows anything except what JR wants them to know.

I have a hard time understanding why you're so intent on everything being public knowledge, when in reality there is more talking, texting and phone calls going on than you think. Just because every little tidbit isn't out there on some internet message board doesn't mean it's not happening. The ostrich taught us that.


Does your better half have an agent?

Richardson isn't the mob boss / illuminati / master manipulator that some make him out to be. People act like he has complete control over what all the press outlets say about the Panthers. He may have some influence in Charlotte, but not much nationally. Heck, even here at home he gets criticized plenty by local guys.

And to be clear, Richardson had zero control over what agents say. Agents are very free with information when it comes to their clients. They tend to be the guys that tip the press when their clients are up for something (if the team doesn't do it themselves).

You might also want to consider that some of the people reporting these things (guys like Albert Breer, Ian Rapoport, etc) work for the NFL. Richardson doesn't have the authority to tell league reporters not to talk about something.

Bottom Line: He likes to keep things quiet, but so do some other teams. Big deal.
Does your better half have an agent?
In her particular business, she has the equivalent of an agent, so yes.

With respect to who says what to whom and your other comments, I'll always respect and value your opinions. However, in this case, we'll just have to agree to disagree. My opinions on how JR commands the ship simply differ from yours.

Your years are off.

Ernie left after the 2006 season.

Reese inherited Couglin for the 2007 season. Couglhin had been on the hot seat. They won the Superbowl in 2007 which was Reese's first year as GM.

Cowher was an example of a coach put on a GM. He wasn't a Superbowl coach then...

Those were just examples involving coaches put on GMs who won Superbowls. Many examples though in general. point is simply, it isn't just a Jerry Jones type move. Yes, GMs often hire coaches....put plenty of times owners put the coach in place and force a new GM to first ride it out with a HC they don't hire.


and again one of my orginal questions was how many have been successful?not many, just the giants. you said this happens quite a lot but it does not. most of the time it is a team of execs that lead to find the next HC. normally the owner and GM is apart of that team.

and again one of my orginal questions was how many have been successful?not many, just the giants. you said this happens quite a lot but it does not. most of the time it is a team of execs that lead to find the next HC. normally the owner and GM is apart of that team.

My only point was it isn't a Jerry Jones thing....organizations don't do it every time they hire a new GM but it isn't really that unusual of a thing. It isn't something just bad organizations have done.

Depends on how you choose to define a lot. It happens. Normally when teams hire a new GM they do it after a 2010 type season....then I think you legitmately clean house.

Numbers also say, new HC brings in "his" QB with in 3 yrs if he doesn't inhert a Superbowl champ. JR doesn't want to burn this Cam thing down yet IMO

In her particular business, she has the equivalent of an agent, so yes.

With respect to who says what to whom and your other comments, I'll always respect and value your opinions. However, in this case, we'll just have to agree to disagree. My opinions on how JR commands the ship simply differ from yours.


Which is fine.

I've had my fair share of issues with how Richardson has run the Panthers. I just think people put way too much stock into his ability to control what the media says. Outside of possibly some of the lesser media in Charlotte, he doesn't really have all that much.

No GM worth a damn wants to work with a meddling owner who despite not being a "football guy" makes critical football based decisions.

We cant draw a quality GM for the same reasons the Cowgirls cant and the Raiders couldnt when Al was alive.


Unlike the few you mentioned, Dan Snyder seems to have learned his lesson.

Beane being a secondary prospect and already in house gives him the edge. See loyalty above. All things point to him being our guy.


So continuing to be a second tier franchise and mediocrity is in our future.
If Beane is the GM just hang me please. What was the point of letting Marty go?
All GM jobs are attractive for front office employees who aspire to run an NFL team... Some more attractive than others, but those jobs are (for the most part) generally taken by GMs who are currently doing an adequate job... GM opportunities come along at the rate of about 2 (maybe 3) a year, typically to a team in need of fixing...

I'll believe the GM position is unattractive when potential candidates start declining interviews...

As for not wanting to sign FAs, well, we used to be one of the more active teams in Free Agency (see Sean Gilbert, Kevin Greene, Chuck Smith, etc see: History of Carolina Panthers FA Signings) with mixed results... Much of that philosophy changed when Hurney took over... So, I tend to feel it was more a Hurney philosophy as opposed to a Panthers philosophy (or a Richardson philosophy to be specific)... I personally feel Hurney was given a long leash, and chose to attempt to build through the draft, and retain those he deemed as vital... Again, with mixed results...

This year, along with Carolina, NY, Jacksonville, Cleveland, San Diego and Arizona are all looking for GMs... Arguably, none of those teams are in better shape than Carolina currently is...

Carolina's cap situation is disconcerting, yes... However, it's likely that the release or restructure of a handful of players get the team into position to sign draft picks and/or a supporting cast of free agents (no huge splashes this year, sorry)... Gamble, Williams and Beason are all likely to be released/traded/restructured (but we all know this)... Losing those 3 (2 of which did not contribute significantly in any way this season) would not be the kiss of death for this team, and would get the team into position to meet the cap requirements... We all know there will need to be some tough decisions made, but the incoming GM is by no means going to need to blow things up and start over...

So, yes the new GM will have work to do, but I don't believe it's a complete reconstruction project, and certainly not enough to make potential candidates take a pass...

Richardson played what? 4 years? 4 decades ago? He's much more knowledgeable in foods. I guess Michael Jordan is a bball guy since he is the GOAT. Nevermind he makes horrible decisions and has brought in real execs who understand bball like Brown and Cho. No one thinks Jordan is this great bball exec even despite playing.He's swallowed his pride and removed himself from all bball related decisions. JR isnt smart enough to do this. He thinks he's Rooney, but our results say otherwise. He needs REAL football people in his organization not his old drinking buddies. As a football guy, JR gets you 7-9 at best.



Weren't you Bob Johnson's biggest supporter?
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King Taharqa
Jan 07 2013 09:05 AM

Weren't you Bob Johnson's biggest supporter?


Very much so. And I still stand by what I said years ago that made you guys gasp. Jerry Richardson is the worst pro owner in Charlotte history. Worse than Shinn, and worse than Bob. Those guys despite their flaws wanted to win and werent in the business of selling losing to their fans. JR has been given a pass for some reason 18 years to do just that.

Building a communications/real estate empire >>>>>>> Building an empire from Hardees
What was the bobcats record under Johnson and was that a losing product?
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King Taharqa
Jan 07 2013 09:14 AM

What was the bobcats record under Johnson and was that a losing product?


It was, just like the Panthers. The only difference being, Bob was never "comfortable" there. He never tried to justify 30 win seasons or hire people merely to be scapegoats for his ineptitude. He actually hired a HALL OF FAME COACH and gave him complete control of basketball. He hired MJ and gave him complete control of basketball. When he left town, despite all the hate thrown his way, the Bobcats were a playoff team with QUALITY players that have since left town and had more success elsewhere. When JR leaves town/this earth will the Panthers be a playoff team? They dont look like it.
So you can make excuses for Johnson, but not Richardson.
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King Taharqa
Jan 07 2013 09:23 AM

So you can make excuses for Johnson, but not Richardson.


Its not excuses, its track record. Richardson had a 1-15 year and several years of losing before Bob set foot town. He's had quite a few more since he's left also.

Its not excuses, its track record. Richardson had a 1-15 year and several years of losing before Bob set foot town. He's had quite a few more since he's left also.


You mentioned hiring Jordan in the context of a good thing.

Jordan was a great player, but a train wreck of a front office person.

See what I mean? You take horrible decisions and put them in a positive light.
Come to think of it, isn't Jordan the worst owner in Charlotte history? I mean, he owns the worst team in NBA history. By definition isn't that true?
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King Taharqa
Jan 07 2013 09:38 AM

You mentioned hiring Jordan in the context of a good thing.

Jordan was a great player, but a train wreck of a front office person.

See what I mean? You take horrible decisions and put them in a positive light.


What controversies did the Bobcats endure under Bob's watch? Did Bob ever release all his best players in protest "to prepare for a work stoppage"? Keep in mind, one guy was operating a business in his HOME MARKET, the other wasnt.
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King Taharqa
Jan 07 2013 09:40 AM

Come to think of it, isn't Jordan the worst owner in Charlotte history? I mean, he owns the worst team in NBA history. By definition isn't that true?


Jordan is terrible, but he has a lot less losing seasons than JR. Jordan also doesnt make a profit if the Bobcats lose.

Jordan is terrible, but he has a lot less losing seasons than JR.



What percentage of Jordan's seasons have been losing ones?

How about JR?
I know I am stating the obvious but at this point and time neither owner has anything really to be proud of.

I know I am stating the obvious but at this point and time neither owner has anything really to be proud of.

Two NFC championship games, a Superbowl, and just getting the Franchise in Carolina isn't something to be proud of?

Two NFC championship games, a Superbowl, and just getting the Franchise in Carolina isn't something to be proud of?


The state of the franchise at the present is what I meant
Indeed.....nothing says " Legit Football program" like Jerry Richardson.

one ten minute discussion with that sniveling board up his ass, overbearing, and complete smartass of an owner (who thinks he's good...when he's actually almost the worst owner in football), will run any legit GM candidate back to whatever shitty job they had before.

You all know this....right ?

They will need to offer an obscene amount of money to get anyone to even interview twice. I mean the panthers aren't exactly a desirable team.