A Whole Gaggle of Conflicting Thoughts

[Pantha-kun]

A part of me wishes we'd just sit Cam until he's 100 percent, start anderson , and just throw the season. Go 4-12, finally get Rivera/Shula out of here, get some great high draft picks on a franchise LT and a good  young DE . Get a new GM. This season is already cursed by injuries to star players and the season isn't even 1/4 of the way  done yet. 

[The Lobo]

2 hours ago, Kevin Greene said:

Re the Bills and their suckage. They spanked the broncos today.

That's the only thing from keeping me to be a Debbie downer about the season. We laid an egg but I don't think we are done

[Eazy-E]

I hate saying it but the Colts made the right decision with Luck. After not playing / practicing all preseason the staff should have known not to play Cam until he could make it through a weeks practice without setbacks. He is our franchise and we are just shortening his career year by year.

I'm starting to wonder if not sitting him last season and to start this year is because of Ron thinking about his job. He may have been worried about being fired last season and now with a new GM his fate as HC is an unknown and taking loses at the start of a season without your franchise QB isn't going to help you. I feel like Ron is sacrificing Cam for his own personal gain at this point. If he benches Cam until he is healthy and we go on to suck it up and finish with 4 to 6 wins again is there any possible way he keeps his job?

[Asurfaholic]

I got to the positivity police part and decided that was enough.

ever think that some people realize that no team is ever perfect and while every team has some really good pieces, there are also weaknesses?

are you trying to say that New Orleans is a better coached or managed team? L O L 

no, their players just showed up today with an insane amount of motivation. They didn't want to go 0-3 more than the panthers wanted 3-0.

the final score reflected that.

Panthers have some key injuries. Your team is always a couple key injuries away from having a very difficult time winning games. 

My advise to everyone who is ready to hang themselves or slit their wrists after the panthers loss--- just keep it in perspective. No wins come easy in the NFL. That's what keeps it fun. If you are going to analyze what happened wrong, don't overanalyze it- it will only serve to blind you from enjoying watching football.

[Zaximus]

1 hour ago, Asurfaholic said:

I got to the positivity police part and decided that was enough.

ever think that some people realize that no team is ever perfect and while every team has some really good pieces, there are also weaknesses?

are you trying to say that New Orleans is a better coached or managed team? L O L 

no, their players just showed up today with an insane amount of motivation. They didn't want to go 0-3 more than the panthers wanted 3-0.

the final score reflected that.

Panthers have some key injuries. Your team is always a couple key injuries away from having a very difficult time winning games. 

My advise to everyone who is ready to hang themselves or slit their wrists after the panthers loss--- just keep it in perspective. No wins come easy in the NFL. That's what keeps it fun. If you are going to analyze what happened wrong, don't overanalyze it- it will only serve to blind you from enjoying watching football.

The Saints are by far a better coached team.    If Payton had Cam he'd probably be setting some records.     Managed though, maybe not, at least at this point.  

[Fox007]

2 hours ago, Asurfaholic said:

are you trying to say that New Orleans is a better coached or managed team? L O L 

Uh...yes...yes they are....they even have a rang to show you.

We have an updated 2003 to reference.

[reds37win]

Proudiddy is just about spot on. 

Cam is just not being...Cam. He offered multiple threats in the past - he could run and/or throw. Now, through injury, draft picks and change in the offensive design, Cam is strictly one-dimensional. What we are seeing is what we have always seen - Cam is a less-than-accurate passer. If that hasn't been fixed by now, this far into his career, it's not going to change now. Take away his threat to run and, well, here we are. I loved the Cam of 2015, but that Cam is gone and not likely coming back.

In watching the Redskins game last night, I saw what our offense should be. Nice, quick passes mitigating Oakland's pass rush, complimented with just enough of a running game to keep Oakland honest. They used Chris Thompson the way the Panthers should be using McAffrey. That comes down to play design (Shula) and execution, something the Panthers seriously lacked yesterday.

So, I'm down on the Panthers today, as expected. It was hard to see Cam at less than his best and making bad decisions, to boot. I'm not in the camp of rip and replace, but I'm starting to pay more attention to the arguments. Richardson is using the Steeler's model for the Panthers. Having said that, the Steeler's have turned over more than their fair share of offensive coordinators. 

[TheRed]

Better play design, and improved OL play could have put us in position to win. We had ample opportunity.

Don't forget, this is a running team first and foremost. Problem is, we have struggled to be able to do that. When you add that on top of everything, especially an inaccurate quarterback, this is what happens.

Cam is still Cam. Feeble minded fans are turning on him, but it's of no surprise. They don't even attempt to wonder why he had the worst game of his career the same time he's been facing an uphill battle returning from shoulder surgery. Then you consider the fact that the only stable consistent LT we've had here in the Cam era was Jordan Gross, which was back in 2011, and it's not hard to figure out why this franchise has struggled to adequately protect him.

Beyond all that, I have serious doubts we'll ever win a Super Bowl with Rivera and Shula.

[SCO96]

11 hours ago, Proudiddy said:

Here comes a wall o' text...  

I don't know where I am with this team, with the NFL, with everything in general right now.  

Today's game was the true litmus test of this team for me.  I was outspoken about my concerns following the first two weeks, and I was met with the usual droves of positivity police whose extreme optimism blinds them from the actual problems that plague our team and organization.  They believed the offense would pick up.  They believed in the defense.  I did not.  We played the Niners and Bills.  LOL...  And for you to believe either of those statements, you would have to believe in a strong, competent coaching staff, which we do not have.  I'm not negative, I'm realistic...   And a bit of a perfectionist, which doesn't always serve me well, but my intentions are pure.  That being said, here are the overarching thoughts I have following this disgusting loss...

*Something was taken out of this team today, and I don't think it can be pieced back together.  I think it's possible we're on the downside of the hill, and certain off-field mandates finally took their toll on this team to a point that is irreparable.  JR has been a looming figure that seemingly overpowers any and everything else in this organization.  He is the first word, and he is the final word.  I think he may have overstepped his authority today, even as the owner.  Furthermore, he simultaneously further neutered and emasculated his team, whose heart and attitude in the Rivera Era have repeatedly been called into question.  These are grown men, and like it or not, it is their right to express themselves as individuals - whether you love or hate their stances, that is their right.  One team didn't meddle with their players' feelings and opinions, one did...  and it carried over into the game.  We were already soft, mentally weak, and fragile.  Today's directives just made our players even more docile and accommodating.  "Bank of America Stadium and the entire Carolina Panthers Organization welcomes you, opposing team and fans, to your home away from home!"

Our Staff, and especially our OL, allowed other teams to cheap shot our QB repeatedly last year until he was injured, and now that injury has carried over into this season, and who knows, Cam may never fully recover.  I have played, talked, and watched football for 23 years, and all I know is, if you allow another team to take shots at your teammate and go unchallenged, you're a punk.  You're weak.  You're soft.  And you really don't care about your teammate or winning.  Last year, our OL had multiple chances to stand up for the franchise QB, and they didn't.  They encouraged more of it by their lack of inaction.  That same mindset is what allowed outings like today to happen...  Getting blown out, never being competitive, and flat out getting embarrassed, AT HOME, against the worst defense in the league, while our defense turned into a pumpkin right before our very eyes.

*Everyone here knows, you will not find a bigger Cam fan than me, secondary only to my love of the team...  but, I'm starting to distrust the team and their ability to make smart, sound decisions.  Furthermore, my loyalty to the team will never wane, but my love for them is taking a beating akin to the one Cam has taken under Gettleman-constructed rosters.  All that being said, it's time to look out for Cam.  I had a bad feeling since the surgery was announced, especially regarding the timing when it was announced.  I stated at the time that I did not think it would play out the way the organization told us it would, and that it would be a much longer process.  I also feared it would have much more serious implications than simply just "we're going in there to clean it up, then he'll be back to normal in 2 months."  Well, here we are.  

I honestly think Cam should've started the season on the PUP.  He should've been given time to build up his muscle endurance to the point that he could go through entire practices throughout an entire week.  He was never pinpoint accurate, but he's accurate enough to be throwing 60-65% completions a year.  The misses we're seeing now aren't due to injury, they're due to lack of reps.  But, not allowing him to practice, then throwing him out to the wolves to be judged by idiot fans who have been waiting for a reason to get a more "traditional," subdued personality at QB is not doing him any favors.  Furthermore, allowing him to play behind Matt "Turnstile" Kalil isn't doing him any favors in recovering from his injury.  Let him rest.  Let him get better.  Let him get 100% now, or I fear he won't ever get back to 100%.  I'm sure Cam insists on playing, but I'd give him next week to see if he can practice and work the kinks out, and if he can't do it, I think it's time to protect him from himself.  Also, this will kill two birds with one stone - it allows Cam the rest he needs, AND shows all of the idiots how yellow the grass is on the other side of the fence...  DA will stink it up, we will lose, even worse than we would otherwise because he is horrible, AND it will allow for Rivera and Shula to finally, hopefully be fired, and hopefully get a staff, and an OC in particular, in here that knows what they're doing, to come in and work with Cam (come back home Chud!).  I just feel like we aren't doing Cam any favors by resting him all week, then putting him out there with a lack of weapons and protection.  He's risking injury, re-injury, and just outright crappy performances until his shoulder is 100%.

*And finally, I know about 75% of the huddle will love this, as they consider the guy somewhere between Einstein and The Pope, but if we can't get Cam back on track, you can thank Gettleman.  If Cam is ruined, that is Gettleman's ultimate legacy.  Failure.  He took a Ferrari and parked it next to the cart corral at a Wal-Mart, then he took it and ran it through a local demolition derby, and then he decided that he wanted to take it to car shows, while also being his daily driver.  Surprise!  The Ferrari is having some lingering effects, nicks, and dents from the parking selection and the demolition derby!  And full disclaimer:  Hurney sucks for his own reasons.  But, this roster, and all of the other ones that allowed Cam to be demolished are Gettleman's fault.  So, aside from pushing Gross, Smitty, and Norman out, and the accompanying legacy of epic failure at those positions following their departures along with foreseen losing in their absences, his lasting legacy will be running a franchise, generational, transcendent talent into the ground.  But, hey, we have minimally impactful Shaq Thompson, Vernon Butler, Funchess, and now two-teams removed, Kony Ealy.  But, he was a mad genius right?  Those are all fairly ineffective players to this point in their careers and Cam still has no real protection at tackle, and no real receiving threat outside of KB that Gettleman brought in himself.  I really, really hope Cam can get back on track, but I'm starting to become concerned as to whether he can.

TL;DR


 

I think the highlighted section sums up what is killing this team. Our 1st round choices in recent years haven't been difference makers.

KB had a solid rookie season. Yet, he missed his sophomore season and we went to the superbowl without him. He came back last year and we lost 10 games. So far we haven't had a winning season with him.

Shaq doesn't play enough so I can't really blame him for his lack of impact. But in hindsight, if we hadn't selected him would the team be any worse?

Vernon Butler. I don't believe I've heard his name called in a game this year. He was hurt most of last year. So, far it has proven to be a wasted pick.

Furthermore, Normans departure is still being felt. During his last season QB's weren't even throwing in his direction. Imagine how much better we'd be with him and Bradburry at the CB spots.

Smitty had plenty left in the tank. I think his presence alone could've got us to play more competitively in SB 50.

Gross hasn't been replaced. He was a solid LT his entire career. G-Man lowballed him into retirement. In fact, didn't he kind of influence Chris Gamble to hang it up a bit prematurely as well?

I understand making tough personnel decisions. When you do though, you'd better have a proven commodity or a can't miss prospect waiting in the wings. If you don't, you'll get exactly what we have now, an underachieving football team.