5 wide

[LinvilleGorge]

2 minutes ago, top dawg said:

Look,  man!  I like the theory of Kaelin Clay,  but there's a reason he has bounced around the league in such a short span of time,  with seemingly some exciting upside.  He's just not a starting caliber receiver.  His hands let him down.  I was ready to give the kid some benefit of doubt (and indeed suggested for people not to overlook him myself),  but seeing him drop a perfectly placed ball in the end zone, during the Saints just slapped me back to reality. He is as legitimate as Russell Shepard and Corey Brown,  and you know what I  suggested to this place about them.  But for his return-ability,  I don't see any reason whatsoever to keep him.  Bersin is much more reliable. 

Did you miss the "dedicated return man" part?

[LinvilleGorge]

7 minutes ago, Trill OG said:

Was just about to post this. People are sleeping on Byrd, this dude is one of the fastest players in the NFL. He had shown so much potential before he got hurt. If he can stay healthy he will be our Ted Ginn and probably a better version.

There always has to be a borderline roster spot player who the Huddle thinks is going to be the next big star.

[Mr. Scot]

Just now, TheRed said:

If we're intent on rolling the dice with the WR core this year, which it seems that way, I'd rather use any resources available to us to shore up the OL and run game to ensure we can make another postseason run. Which backup QB gets the honor of getting beat like a drum in place of Cam Newton if he gets injured is ultimately not worth much concern because unless that QB is going to play the season of his life we are toast.

Based on what he said, Norv Turner does seem to favor keeping the current core. That could change of course, and Turner isn't the guy making the ultimate decisions anyway.

I'm hoping that the team improves overall. If part of that is getting a better backup, okay. If not, I'm fine with that too.

I do feel fairly comfortable saying that whether it's done via draft pick or free agency, it is looking like we'll have a different backup this year.

Given that, hopefully he's not just different, but better.

[Davidson Deac II]

24 minutes ago, top dawg said:

Saca,  Saca,  Saca.  I am not trying to bust your balls here (yet again). l agree with you that Samuel has lots of upside. And,  hell yeah,  I'm still excited by the guy.  I also think that there's a somewhat perceptible negative undercurrent going on with some people here whenever Samuel is discussed as a viable playmaker in this offense,  but to call him a "sure-fire stud" is premature, bordering on reckless when taking into account the entire state of the Panthers' receiving corps. Come on,  man. 

Hamstring injuries should be concerning.  Now if it's just your garden variety hammy,  then nothing to worry about.  Perhaps his body had to adjust to the pro game is all. But,  if it's the chronic hammy issues that plagued players like Miles Austin, that's not good. At this point,  I don't believe that it's "stupid" to have some concern, even if it's premature to label the kid.  At this point,  I don't see any reason not to think in terms of proceeding with caution. We need to be resolute with providing Can rock-solid options,  and, sorry,  It's going to take more than one game from Samuel to prove himself as rock-solid. 

Agreed, and its absurd to think that Samuel was the difference in the Atlanta games.  The difference was that in the first game against Atlanta, we didn't turn the ball over, and got a td after an int.  And Atlanta/Julio Jones dropped a sure fire td pass.  The offensive numbers were nearly identical and the passing attack was not that good in either game.  

 

With all the injury issues, Samuel should get the benefit of the doubt for now.  But so far, he hasn't shown much at all.

[top dawg]

21 minutes ago, Trill OG said:

Was just about to post this. People are sleeping on Byrd, this dude is one of the fastest players in the NFL. He had shown so much potential before he got hurt. If he can stay healthy he will be our Ted Ginn and probably a better version.

Byrd showed potential in a spurt, otherwise he really hasn't shown much of anything, except how to disappear. Samuel showed decidedly  more versatility in his spurt than Byrd did (who has yet to prove that he's more than anything but a glorified one-trick pony). Moreover,  Samuel's college resumé is so much greater in all respects from production to versatility,  to playing time,  maybe level of competition, and even route running (as limited as it was).  That's why Samuel is ahead of Byrd. 

[Saca312]

33 minutes ago, top dawg said:

Saca,  Saca,  Saca.

lol.

[Saca312]

i'm all for bringing in another veteran WR. I think we need some.

I also think we still have a lot of talent. Adding Samuel and Byrd back is huge, and they've shown a ton of flashes of solid route running and getting open.

Sure, we can debate "oh but how long were they on the field again" but no one can deny they didn't significantly alter how a defense was to defend against us.

The only thing we surely need is a sure handed guy. Get rid of Russell Shepard or sign him for dirt cheap for special teams duty only, and grab a sure-handed receiver who knows how to run routes.

Otherwise, we got a pretty decent core in Funchess, Samuel, and Byrd. 

[Davidson Deac II]

29 minutes ago, top dawg said:

Look,  man!  I like the theory of Kaelin Clay,  but there's a reason he has bounced around the league in such a short span of time,  with seemingly some exciting upside.  He's just not a starting caliber receiver.  His hands let him down.  I was ready to give the kid some benefit of doubt (and indeed suggested for people not to overlook him myself),  but seeing him drop a perfectly placed ball in the end zone, during the Saints just slapped me back to reality. He is as legitimate as Russell Shepard and Corey Brown,  and you know what I  suggested to this place about them.  But for his return-ability,  I don't see any reason whatsoever to keep him.  Bersin is much more reliable. 

We are talking about the #5 or #6 receiver, not the starter. Clay is not a starting caliber receiver, but very few who are the fth or 6th receiver on a team are starting caliber.  But not being a starting caliber receiver doesn't mean he doesn't deserve a spot as a dedicated returner.  

[Car123]

19 minutes ago, top dawg said:

Byrd showed potential in a spurt, otherwise he really hasn't shown much of anything, except how to disappear. Samuel showed decidedly  more versatility in his spurt than Byrd did (who has yet to prove that he's more than anything but a glorified one-trick pony). Moreover,  Samuel's college resumé is so much greater in all respects from production to versatility,  to playing time,  maybe level of competition, and even route running (as limited as it was).  That's why Samuel is ahead of Byrd. 

This is false. Samuel didn’t do anything but catch a few catches with his body. Byrd caught key touchdowns vs Green Bay and showed of his YAC/tackle breaking ability in his big catch and kick return TD vs Tampa. He has greater potential.

[Davidson Deac II]

4 minutes ago, Car123 said:

This is false. Samuel didn’t do anything but catch a few catches with his body. Byrd caught key touchdowns vs Green Bay and showed of his YAC/tackle breaking ability in his big catch and kick return TD vs Tampa. He has greater potential.

He was also open for a long td against the Saints, but Cam under threw him.  

[Car123]

45 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Samuel was a 2nd round pick for a reason. He's more talented. Already being a raw WR coming into the NFL and then missing virtually his entire rookie offseason with injury really put him behind the eight ball.

So was Dwayne Jarrett. Not calling Samuel a bust, just saying draft position is highly overrated.

[Car123]

2 minutes ago, Davidson Deac II said:

He was also open for a long td against the Saints, but Cam under threw him.  

Yep.

[top dawg]

1 minute ago, Car123 said:

This is false. Samuel didn’t do anything but catch a few catches with his body. Byrd caught key touchdowns vs Green Bay and showed of his YAC/tackle breaking ability in his big catch and kick return TD vs Tampa. He has greater potential.

Believe what you want. It's not the first time that I haven't been listened to about receivers.  Sometimes people just have to see how it all plays out.  

[top dawg]

10 minutes ago, Davidson Deac II said:

We are talking about the #5 or #6 receiver, not the starter. Clay is not a starting caliber receiver, but very few who are the fth or 6th receiver on a team are starting caliber.  But not being a starting caliber receiver doesn't mean he doesn't deserve a spot as a dedicated returner.  

I'm not against the idea of him being a dedicated returner if that's how it ends up,  I'm just not so sure that there aren't better options in Byrd and Samuel even on that front.  Honestly,  I don't know if it's enough to justify KC's roster spot. And,  If last season didn't teach us anything else,  there will be instances where that 5th or 6th receiver will come into play.