Dane Brugler of the Athletic Mock: Panthers trade up to 3 for Fields

[Icege]

Just now, Varking said:

It’s about having more chances to get “your guy”. There’s no guarantee that he’s going to be a success but again… we were one pick away from Herbert and we heavily scouted him. We would be set at the QB position and could focus elsewhere. I also believe Okudah is going to be fine. He played this season on a horrible defense and when he played he was hurt. Imagine this year if 4 QBs go in the top of the draft before we pick. Then two years in a row we would have lost out on potential franchise QBs off a late season win. 
 

It’s pointless to argue about fans wanting C or Z player in the draft. Do you believe Brown was the Panthers guy this past draft? No. They settled for him because other guys like Burrow, Herbert and Chase Young were off the board. We need our franchise quarterback. We have sucked consistently for far too long. 

The draft in retrospect is consistently a walk of could'ves, would'ves, and should'ves.

If Brown wasn't one of "the guys," the team would have moved up to take somebody else. If Herbert was that player, they'd have moved up for him. The fact that they stayed put showed that they were comfortable with how the board ended up. We know this to be the case because this was exactly what was done with Greg Little.

The top 4 QBs in the draft prior to last were Kyler Murray, Daniel Jones, Dwayne Haskins, and Drew Lock. Just because the player plays at a position that the team could use an upgrade it does not mean that player is worth a top 5 pick. We have re-drafts all of the time showing this.

Again, the idea that a team should have lost the Washington game last season to make sure they got the #3 pick is stupid considering the true cost that would require and the fact that any of the other W's could have been L's. There isn't any amount of spreadsheet adjusting that can be done to change that.

[45catfan]

I don't even want Fields at #8, let alone trading up for him.  A solid NO for me.

[Icege]

5 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

You're not understanding the concept. Draft pick value is real. That is real team building capital. You can make the picks, you can trade the picks, more draft capital means more options. What you're arguing is like saying that you'd just as well rather have less money in the bank because there's a chance you'll piss it all away anyway so why bother? It's just not an intelligent argument to make.

You keep saying that folks don't understand the concept, but in actuality that's you bby. Everyone understands that draft selections are assigned values and that the higher picks have greater value because in theory, you'll be selecting the best player available for your team. Nobody has debated this, yet you keep going back to it as if it's the final answer when it isn't.

What exactly makes those draft picks valuable? Aside from getting in new talent, there's the salary cap implications as well as an attempt at competitive balance. What makes a draft pick a bust? If they do not pan out. Therefore, each of those selections is essentially a spot in line to gamble. This is why the attempt at quantification falls flat, because you have no idea what the final value is going to be in the player that you exchanged that draft pick for. By it's very nature, the draft is not a surefire thing. Therefore, the idea that the team should purposefully lose a game for selections that all 32 teams value differently is illogical and if acted upon harmful.

You can keep repeating your point without ever considering another, but that's doesn't make it logical.

 

[LinvilleGorge]

2 minutes ago, Icege said:

You keep saying that folks don't understand the concept, but in actuality that's you bby. Everyone understands that draft selections are assigned values and that the higher picks have greater value because in theory, you'll be selecting the best player available for your team. Nobody has debated this, yet you keep going back to it as if it's the final answer when it isn't.

What exactly makes those draft picks valuable? Aside from getting in new talent, there's the salary cap implications as well as an attempt at competitive balance. What makes a draft pick a bust? If they do not pan out. Therefore, each of those selections is essentially a spot in line to gamble. This is why the attempt at quantification falls flat, because you have no idea what the final value is going to be in the player that you exchanged that draft pick for. By it's very nature, the draft is not a surefire thing. Therefore, the idea that the team should purposefully lose a game for selections that all 32 teams value differently is illogical and if acted upon harmful.

You can keep repeating your point without ever considering another, but that's doesn't make it logical.

 

You can't be this dense. The value of the DRAFT PICK is not altered by the PLAYER that is selected at that spot. The draft pick value is the draft pick value. If you have a Hurney who botches it that doesn't make the pick itself any less valuable. By your logic, we should be trading all of our picks straight up for lower picks because hell, we might draft a bust anyway so let's lessen our cap exposure. 

The reason I'm not considering your point is because it's without merit.

[Varking]

1 hour ago, Icege said:

The draft in retrospect is consistently a walk of could'ves, would'ves, and should'ves.

If Brown wasn't one of "the guys," the team would have moved up to take somebody else. If Herbert was that player, they'd have moved up for him. The fact that they stayed put showed that they were comfortable with how the board ended up. We know this to be the case because this was exactly what was done with Greg Little.

The top 4 QBs in the draft prior to last were Kyler Murray, Daniel Jones, Dwayne Haskins, and Drew Lock. Just because the player plays at a position that the team could use an upgrade it does not mean that player is worth a top 5 pick. We have re-drafts all of the time showing this.

Again, the idea that a team should have lost the Washington game last season to make sure they got the #3 pick is stupid considering the true cost that would require and the fact that any of the other W's could have been L's. There isn't any amount of spreadsheet adjusting that can be done to change that.

Again, going to disagree respectfully. Not going to call you or your ideas stupid. Just going to say I disagree. 

[DeAngelo Beason]

If we turned that 2022 1st into a 2022 2nd I might be up for it.  

[mrcompletely11]

7 minutes ago, DeAngelo Beason said:

If we turned that 2022 1st into a 2022 2nd I might be up for it.  

True that.  I still think with our roster we could be looking at another top 10 pick next season.