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ESPN guys talk Bryce fifth year option

Mr. Scot

By Mr. Scot,
in Carolina Panthers

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CRA Grand Master

CRA

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28 minutes ago, GoobyPls said:

How many of those drops are off target throws which Lawrence is near the top in?

Off-target/bad balls generally don't meet the criteria for a drop.   I mean two things can be true.  The Jags skill positions players have been a big let down this year.....and Lawrence can be headache. 

Trevor is below league average in bad throw % though.  Bryce as always, above it despite playing less aggressive.  I mean, Bryce being at the top in bad throw % is the really wild part because he isn't playing aggressive dumb ball look so many QBs are willing to. 

I feel Bryce Young people are fixated on Trevor being a thing to use....but it just is too forced.  I mean, they have being a bad picks in common but that's it. 

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Mr. Scot Grand Master

Mr. Scot

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52 minutes ago, rebelrouser said:

Howell is an UFA in 2026 so it would not cost anything. For those who want to cut Dalton, that would be a 5.8M cap hit.  They guaranteed 5.9M of Dalton's salary because they thought he was a good mentor for Bryce so the plan is obviously to keep them both in '26, which really means they plan to pick up the fifth year option in May.  Adding a Sam Howell or third round draft pick in '26 makes sense even though it limits roster spots.  Dalton is Bryce's security blanket.  

I've said it before re: Dalton, if he's that good in a mentor role just bring him on to the coaching staff.

As a player, he's done.

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Mr. Scot Grand Master

Mr. Scot

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57 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Evidently the Seahawks were interested in Howell in the draft and the guy on the staff primarily responsible for scouting him was their QB coach at the time... Dave Canales. Canales was the Seahawks representative sent to the UNC pro day.

 

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cranky Experienced

cranky

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1 hour ago, Castavar said:

Why Sam Howell hasn't been given another chance to start on a team after putting up decent numbers on a bad commanders team running for his life (most sacked QB in the league in 2023) is beyond me, especially when you have the likes of Geno Smith, Bryce Young, JJ McCarthy, Justin Fields, Tyrod Taylor, Trevor Lawrence, and Tua still being given a chance.

In 2023:

Passing yards (15th)

Completion % (14th)

Total TDs (12th)

YPG (17th)

QBR (24th)

I think Sam Howell would absolutely kill it in Canales' system. Throw a late rounder the Eagles way and go get him. Still only 25 too. Low risk high reward. 

I think it's because in the last half of that season (9 games) he had a total of 8 TD's to 13 INT's. 

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Mr. Scot Grand Master

Mr. Scot

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25 minutes ago, Jackson113.2 said:

The Tarheel Glazers on here  will tell you that Howell is the second coming of Peyton Manning,  it gets old after a while...

I'm neither fan nor hater (totally UNC neutral)

But I do think Sam Howell has a quarterback skill set that fits quite well into a WCO type scheme like Canales runs. He wouldn't be high priced as a backup either.

Put that together with what Linville mentioned and is say it becomes a very real possibility. 

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SmokinwithWilly Grand Master

SmokinwithWilly

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25 minutes ago, Jackson113.2 said:

The Tarheel Glazers on here  will tell you that Howell is the second coming of Peyton Manning,  it gets old after a while...

I'm not a glazer, and I don't think he's the 2nd coming of PM, I think he was in a very bad situation in Washington behind an oline as bad or worse than Vegas' this year. He was under pressure constantly. Like David Carr's rookie year in Houston pressure. It's hard to really judge a guy under those circumstances. 

I think he has the tools to be a QB in the NFL and he could work in the system that DC likes to run. At worst, he's an improvement over Dalton. At best, we find someone who can push for the starting role or take it and get some stability at the position. If he doesn't work out, we move on. There's nothing wrong with taking a look at the guy. 

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Mr. Scot Grand Master

Mr. Scot

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14 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

The last one was Darnold. I guess we could run it back?

I don't know what his status is next year. 

I know he got better coaching from somebody other than Matt Rhule after he left us, but if I remember correctly his playoff performance last season was... less than stellar. 

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Castavar Grand Master

Castavar

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4 minutes ago, cranky said:

I think it's because in the last half of that season (9 games) he had a total of 8 TD's to 13 INT's. 

I mean, ups and downs are to be expected for a 23 year old first year starter. But he showed huge potential all season and has a huge arm. All I'm saying is all these castoffs and terrible 2nd year QBs continue to get chance after chance, while Sam Howell has proven he can throw in this league and doesn't even get an opportunity to start on another team after a decent year as a first year starter. 

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cranky Experienced

cranky

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25 minutes ago, CRA said:

Off-target/bad balls generally don't meet the criteria for a drop.   I mean two things can be true.  The Jags skill positions players have been a big let down this year.....and Lawrence can be headache. 

Trevor is below league average in bad throw % though.  Bryce as always, above it despite playing less aggressive.  I mean, Bryce being at the top in bad throw % is the really wild part because he isn't playing aggressive dumb ball look so many QBs are willing to. 

I feel Bryce Young people are fixated on Trevor being a thing to use....but it just is too forced.  I mean, they have being a bad picks in common but that's it. 

Where are you getting your numbers?

According to pro-football-reference, Youngs bad throws number is 17.5%. Caleb Williams for comparison is at 22.5% and Stroud is at 16.3%. So pretty much the same as Stroud and considerably better than Williams. 

As far as Lawrence goes, yes he is better at 15.6% but last year he was at 17.5% and the year before that he was at 18.8%.  The same or worse than the "top in bad throws" Bryce.

Given all of that, how can you claim Bryce is at the top and Trevor is below average. 

And I must say I find it ironic that I can comment on Bryces' lack of receiver talent in 24 and 23 and you say I am just using that as an excuse, yet you excuse Trevors' play with "The Jags skill positions players have been a big let down this year."

So which is it - does the talent surrounding a QB matter or not?

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    • cranky
      2027: Sharing my thoughts on the cap without a lotta research

      By cranky · Posted

      Why do you say that. What leads you to think that we, as supporters, think his ceiling is 10-12. That's a ridiculous assumption on your part. The Seahawks won the SB with Darnold passing for 25 TD's, 14 Ints with a 99.1 rating for the season.  The Panthers with Young were at 23 TD's, 11 Ints and a 78.8 rating for the season. Not that far off. The problem with all the Young discourse around here is the assumption that the QB is the sole determining factor for a teams success. That just isn't true and it's certainly not how Morgan and Tilis are building the Panthers. 
    • SmokinwithWilly
      2027: Sharing my thoughts on the cap without a lotta research

      By SmokinwithWilly · Posted

      Do we pay based on how many wins or how many games Bryce led us to wins? We've spent quite a bit on defense this year and hopefully they're much improved. If the Panthers do get to 10 wins, but Bryce has another year like last year where he showed up big in a couple, was present in a few, and forgettable in most, do we still pay him 50m per year?  I keep bringing it up because I think it's relevant, but Bryce was outplayed by a 6m per year backup last year. I don't see how it's possible to pay a top tier QB contract to someone who's putting up backup QB production. 
    • XClown1986
      Post-Draft: Gantt sets A stage, not THE stage. Perhaps Reset Your Expectations

      By XClown1986 · Posted

      I understand tempering expectations, but there are some issues with his points. Walker was a 3 year starter, but Green Bay let him walk and no other team was quick to snatch him up. That says something. Freeling will compete to start. With Hunter, we rotate our linemen and even 5th round pick Cam Jackson played some meaningful snaps last year. Both Brown III and Wharton have underwhelmed since we picked them up. Hunter is a run plugger that we have needed. Hunter will play early, even if he isn't the "starter." Brazzell was described as one of Canales' favorite prospects in the draft and he has a speed element we have been missing. I think Canales is going to have plays drawn up with Brazzell on the field just out of pure excitement. It will be up to Brazzell to prove he can handle it, though. If he can, he will play. As far as our secondary picks, yeah they have to earn their stripes and Evero tends to lean on veterans. So they might take time, but if they can show they can play, they will see the field. Smith-Wade and Ransom did. Sam Hecht simply has to show he can handle the mental side of the NFL game. If he can, he is in a direct competition with Fortner, who's also relatively young, but also on his 3rd NFL team and doesn't have the power profile of Hecht.  I can appreciate that Gantt wants to pour cold water on what was perceived as an impactful draft, but facts are facts.
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