S Fowler Coker in, Legette out as wr2

[kungfoodude]

3 hours ago, CBDellinger said:

what are they gonna get?  a 2048 7th rounder?

Just keep him, hes cheap, maybe he can become something.  Prob not but they are not gonna get anything for him so might as well be patient and see if the light comes on.  Sometimes WRs to figure it out in year 3.

He is literally a waste of a roster spot. If you can get anything from a 4th(lol) to a conditional 7th, I would move him. The only light that is gonna come on for him is the one on his air fryer to let him know his crispy squirrel nuggets are done.

[jasonluckydog]

I had no idea that this dude was our offensive coordinator Brad Idzik. 

[kungfoodude]

3 hours ago, cranky said:

Yeah I'm still not sure about Canales' play calling but I'll give him another season.

Still can't quite figure out why you think Young won't work out. His numbers with Theilen are as good as any QB Theien's ever had - including the three games he has started with Rogers this year. Cokers' numbers are as good as Theilens and he is an UDFA and TMac is in the run for ORTY with Young as his QB. Young's throwing more accurately now (from 21.5% in 23 to 16.5% this year) and he has shown he can make the throws in clutch moments. If you take into account he was saddled with XL, Chark, Mingo and Johnson for receivers at one point, had a coaching staff his first year that didn't want him and a current coach who is suspect at play calling, I'm not sure he has been as bad as people here say. I know he has had terrible moments/games but most qb's still on their rookie contract will. 

Anyway, had to give my weekly BY plug. Guess I thought this was the perfect time lol.

After two seasons, I definitely have strong opinions of his playcalling and even stronger ones on his game coaching abilities. 

Isolating AT as logic for BY success doesn't make any sense. Look at his body of work, his ratings in intermediate and deep, his bad throw percentages or FOR fuging SURE his terrible footwork. As I have continued to stress, he is an arm throwing, scrambling QB with significantly below average arm strength and underwhelming athletic ability for a modern QB. The "clutch" stuff is a lot of wishful thinking for a guy with a very low career winning percentage. I have never heard clutch attached to a QB that has the kind of winning percentage that he does. It doesn't logically make sense.

I understand you are keeping your hope alive but most of us can see what I think you will eventually come to realize, he just isn't an NFL caliber QB. 

3 hours ago, strato said:

Yeah he is sunk cost. No point in not seeing if he can be of help. I think he can be.  
If he wasn’t aware of his weak hold on the starting spot, he is now
Competition for snaps is what we need to have in all the rooms. 

Sunk cost fallacy is holding onto assets in the hope of recovering a return, rather than taking your losses and reinvesting them into something that may pay off. This is the exact opposite of sunk cost fallacy by keeping a failed asset.

3 hours ago, CBDellinger said:

Bro if there is one thing we know for sure its that his awareness is nonexistent.  I feel bad for him.  Has all the tools except the one that matters most... a brain.

He has to be one of the football dumbest players we have ever had in the history of this franchise. Easily the most football dumb 1st round draft pick.

2 hours ago, Navy_football said:

That and a lack of situational awareness there. He's just better when he has room to operate and not have to think about too many things at once. Catch the ball, then run to daylight. Keep it simple and plain.

Yeah well he seems to fug that up pretty often too.

42 minutes ago, Shotgun said:

The sideline is the perfect spot for him. lol

Further back into the stands, I would say.

[strato]

 

. 

   3 hours ago,  strato said: 

Yeah he is sunk cost. No point in not seeing if he can be of help. I think he can be.  
If he wasn’t aware of his weak hold on the starting spot, he is now
Competition for snaps is what we need to have in all the rooms. 

Sunk cost fallacy is holding onto assets in the hope of recovering a return, rather than taking your losses and reinvesting them into something that may pay off. This is the exact opposite of sunk cost fallacy by keeping a failed asset.him be a second stringer for a year.  

————

You he think he is a fallacy. You aren’t alone. I am a minority probably.
I could say it differently. We have something invested in him, unless he is a locker room issue or bad teammate I am not calling him completely sunk. I would let him be a backup and let it play out some more and just see where everything goes. He has had good days and Dalton played he seems to be able to make it work, I just wouldn’t make that move right now. Demoted is fine, no argument.  

Edited 17 hours ago by strato

[UnluckyforSome]

XL needs to be out the door.

[Chief Keek]

Coke Boys!

[kungfoodude]

45 minutes ago, strato said:

 

. 

   3 hours ago,  strato said: 

Yeah he is sunk cost. No point in not seeing if he can be of help. I think he can be.  
If he wasn’t aware of his weak hold on the starting spot, he is now
Competition for snaps is what we need to have in all the rooms. 

Sunk cost fallacy is holding onto assets in the hope of recovering a return, rather than taking your losses and reinvesting them into something that may pay off. This is the exact opposite of sunk cost fallacy by keeping a failed asset.him be a second stringer for a year.  

————

You he think he is a fallacy. You aren’t alone. I am a minority probably.
I could say it differently. We have something invested in him, unless he is a locker room issue or bad teammate I am not calling him completely sunk. I would let him be a backup and let it play out some more and just see where everything goes. He has had good days and Dalton played he seems to be able to make it work, I just wouldn’t make that move right now. Demoted is fine, no argument.  

I don't think you are understanding what I am saying. You said he is "sunk cost" which is a reference to the sunk cost fallacy. The investment has been made and gained little to no return. Cutting our losses now(future draft capital and/or roster spots) is the prudent course of action. Having a bad backup WR serves no value.

[raleigh-panther]

1 hour ago, jasonluckydog said:

I had no idea that this dude was our offensive coordinator Brad Idzik. 

Neither does anyone else

he is dave’s buddy  

no idea what he dies past that 

[CBDellinger]

2 hours ago, kungfoodude said:

After two seasons, I definitely have strong opinions of his playcalling and even stronger ones on his game coaching abilities. 

Isolating AT as logic for BY success doesn't make any sense. Look at his body of work, his ratings in intermediate and deep, his bad throw percentages or FOR fuging SURE his terrible footwork. As I have continued to stress, he is an arm throwing, scrambling QB with significantly below average arm strength and underwhelming athletic ability for a modern QB. The "clutch" stuff is a lot of wishful thinking for a guy with a very low career winning percentage. I have never heard clutch attached to a QB that has the kind of winning percentage that he does. It doesn't logically make sense.

I understand you are keeping your hope alive but most of us can see what I think you will eventually come to realize, he just isn't an NFL caliber QB. 

Sunk cost fallacy is holding onto assets in the hope of recovering a return, rather than taking your losses and reinvesting them into something that may pay off. This is the exact opposite of sunk cost fallacy by keeping a failed asset.

He has to be one of the football dumbest players we have ever had in the history of this franchise. Easily the most football dumb 1st round draft pick.

Yeah well he seems to fug that up pretty often too.

Further back into the stands, I would say.

Hes up there with Rod Gardner and Dwayne Jarret for dumbest panthers of all time. 

[strato]

1 hour ago, kungfoodude said:

I don't think you are understanding what I am saying. You said he is "sunk cost" which is a reference to the sunk cost fallacy. The investment has been made and gained little to no return. Cutting our losses now(future draft capital and/or roster spots) is the prudent course of action. Having a bad backup WR serves no value.

I understand it. I shouldn’t have used that term. What I meant was we spent already and I am not sure he is as bad as a lot of people portray him to be, in spite of the obviously stupid poo that he has done. Of maybe a half dozen I could remember. I don’t mean a simple drop where he did everything right but catch it. 
Stuff like not getting the feet down. Couple of his penalties. Lollygagging. 
We have invested in him, yes. He has had some good days. Not enough. Sunk? Not to me. Is he taking on water? Yes he is. But I am willing to give him a chance to respond to this and pencil him into the plans for next year in a reduced or modified role.  

[kungfoodude]

1 minute ago, strato said:

I understand it. I shouldn’t have used that term. What I meant was we spent already and I am not sure he is as bad as a lot of people portray him to be, in spite of the obviously stupid poo that he has done. Of maybe a half dozen I could remember. I don’t mean a simple drop where he did everything right but catch it. 
Stuff like not getting the feet down. Couple of his penalties. Lollygagging. 
We have invested in him, yes. He has had some good days. Not enough. Sunk? Not to me. Is he taking on water? Yes he is. But I am willing to give him a chance to respond to this and pencil him into the plans for next year in a reduced or modified role.  

The things that make people give up on him is that he is getting worse in terms of simple football things and he isn't improving on much in terms of being a WR. He has improved his drops but then he has increased his insanely boneheaded penalties. I mean, the dude has THREE false start penalties. That is the second most on the team. 

Couple that with his obvious limitations in terms of field vision, agility, etc and you just start to wonder what there really is to even believe in.

I'll put it this way, when such a notoriously terrible personnel management coach like Canales gives up on you, that's saying a lot. He has ridden more bums for longer than any of us care to remember. 

[strato]

17 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

The things that make people give up on him is that he is getting worse in terms of simple football things and he isn't improving on much in terms of being a WR. He has improved his drops but then he has increased his insanely boneheaded penalties. I mean, the dude has THREE false start penalties. That is the second most on the team. 

Couple that with his obvious limitations in terms of field vision, agility, etc and you just start to wonder what there really is to even believe in.

I'll put it this way, when such a notoriously terrible personnel management coach like Canales gives up on you, that's saying a lot. He has ridden more bums for longer than any of us care to remember. 

I see it all too. What put some people in the mode was they wanted McConkey. They have wanted XL to fail and just had it in for him. 
I see what he does and those people were right but people have been dogging him mercilessly since he dropped that ball vs Philly I guess it was.  The Bryce stans really hated him for that. 

I stopped defending him this year because I can see too. I am just slower to condemn. Normally. 
To me, a miss on him is small potatoes where we took him.  I mean it isn’t good but it isn’t setting the franchise back 5 years or anything. I am pretty good about accepting some misses. And we got Coker in that same season. Part of the rookie class. Wash, more or less. You can quibble that Coker is a 2nd or 3rd value and doesn’t make up for it if you want. 

You want to get on my bad side, start trading future 1st round picks. That is what sets me off. 

[kungfoodude]

3 minutes ago, strato said:

I see it all too. What put some people in the mode was they wanted McConkey. They have wanted XL to fail and just had it in for him. 
I see what he does and those people were right but people have been dogging him mercilessly since he dropped that ball vs Philly I guess it was.  The Bryce stans really hated him for that. 

I stopped defending him this year because I can see too. I am just slower to condemn. Normally. 
To me, a miss on him is small potatoes where we took him.  I mean it isn’t good but it isn’t setting the franchise back 5 years or anything. I am pretty good about accepting some misses. And we got Coker in that same season. Part of the rookie class. Wash, more or less. You can quibble that Coker is a 2nd or 3rd value and doesn’t make up for it if you want. 

You want to get on my bad side, start trading future 1st round picks. That is what sets me off. 

I wanted McConkey because he was just clearly the better WR. All that "X vs. slot" BS didn't matter to me, he was a true, skilled football player and XL just wasn't. He was a one year wonder, underwear Olympics project. Hate the pick, hated the trade up but tried to give it a chance. Then he was so bad during his rookie year. Then all offseason he is just being a social media goober and doesn't appear to actually be working on his game. Then this season shows up and proves without a shadow of a doubt that he wasn't and he gets even worse. So, yeah, that pisses me off.

The thing that is the most infuriating is that there is just nothing to build on. He's genuinely football dumb. He has so few useful football skills for a WR.

But, whatever. I am just glad this dumb HC of ours finally figured it out too.

[strato]

18 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

I wanted McConkey because he was just clearly the better WR. All that "X vs. slot" BS didn't matter to me, he was a true, skilled football player and XL just wasn't. He was a one year wonder, underwear Olympics project. Hate the pick, hated the trade up but tried to give it a chance. Then he was so bad during his rookie year. Then all offseason he is just being a social media goober and doesn't appear to actually be working on his game. Then this season shows up and proves without a shadow of a doubt that he wasn't and he gets even worse. So, yeah, that pisses me off.

The thing that is the most infuriating is that there is just nothing to build on. He's genuinely football dumb. He has so few useful football skills for a WR.

But, whatever. I am just glad this dumb HC of ours finally figured it out too.

Let it out, you will feel better. I don’t have that passion for poo like that. Only shitty QBs. 
But if I tell you again why they took him over McConkey, people will again deny it. You might. It was always “mental gymnastics to defend Morgan” so I could just skip that and go directly jabbing needles into my eyes. 
It was Bryce related and specifically Bryce and AT related and instant results related. It was not done with any kind of long term planning in mind. That’s courtesy of the owner IMDAO.