Could "the list" have been a bluff?

[Mr. Scot]

Recent discussion and little tidbits of info here and there have made me wonder.

My own theory at the time "the list" came out was that it was designed to force the Panthers to trade him to the Cowboys. Gantt had a similar take, but a different target. He believed the list was meant to move the Panthers in the direction of trading him to the Patriots.

With that said, it's well known that what Peppers ultimately wanted was the freedom to go anywhere. It's also generally accepted that "leaks" like the four team list can kill the market for a player from other sources. Whether this leak accomplished that, or other forces did, interest in Peppers has been pretty minimal.

Is it possible though, that the real reason for "the list" was to present the team with no attractive options, in the hope that the team would eventually just throw their hands up in frustration and say "Whatever. Just leave then. We don't care where you go."

It makes some sense when you think about it.

If this was indeed the logic behind the ploy though, it's hard to classify it as anything but a dismal failure. The Panthers are, at this point, completely unwilling to budge. That means Peppers' options are as follows:

1. Sign the tender and play for the Panthers

2. Sign the tender and accept a trade on the Panthers terms

3. Hold out and put off your hopes until next year

To be more specific, what option 3 really means is something along the lines of "Hold out hoping you don't get franchised again in what might be an uncapped year while also hoping there's a market for a 30 year old disgruntled player who's had a year off and whose effectiveness some folks were already questioning anyway." :skep:

Get all that? :confused:

All that, combined with the drafting of a potential replacement, to me means that in the end, either A) Peppers negotiating position was nowhere near as strong as he believed it was, or Carl Carey isn't really that good an agent, or C) both A and B.

If there's one question Id most like answered in all this, it's whether Carey actually went out looking for offers from other teams at all. The Panthers put the onus on him to do so when they franchised Julius. Other agents have done such for franchised clients, and have been successful. Did Carey even try, or did he just sit back thinking the Panthers would eventually cave?

No idea, but I'd certainly like to know.

And one other question: If this list was a bluff, then where did he really want to go?

[Sandy Claws]

Recent discussion and little tidbits of info here and there have made me wonder.

My own theory at the time "the list" came out was that it was designed to force the Panthers to trade him to the Cowboys. Gantt had a similar take, but a different target. He believed the list was meant to move the Panthers in the direction of trading him to the Patriots.

With that said, it's well known that what Peppers ultimately wanted was the freedom to go anywhere. It's also generally accepted that "leaks" like the four team list can kill the market for a player from other sources. Whether this leak accomplished that, or other forces did, interest in Peppers has been pretty minimal.

Is it possible though, that the real reason for "the list" was to present the team with no attractive options, in the hope that the team would eventually just throw their hands up in frustration and say "Whatever. Just leave then. We don't care where you go."

It makes some sense when you think about it.

If this was indeed the logic behind the ploy though, it's hard to classify it as anything but a dismal failure. The Panthers are, at this point, completely unwilling to budge. That means Peppers' options are as follows:

1. Sign the tender and play for the Panthers

2. Sign the tender and accept a trade on the Panthers terms

3. Hold out and put off your hopes until next year

To be more specific, what option 3 really means is something along the lines of "Hold out hoping you don't get franchised again in what might be an uncapped year while also hoping there's a market for a 30 year old disgruntled player who's had a year off and whose effectiveness some folks were already questioning anyway." :skep:

Get all that? :confused:

All that, combined with the drafting of a potential replacement, to me means that in the end, either A) Peppers negotiating position was nowhere near as strong as he believed it was, or Carl Carey isn't really that good an agent, or C) both A and B.

If there's one question Id most like answered in all this, it's whether Carey actually went out looking for offers from other teams at all. The Panthers put the onus on him to do so when they franchised Julius. Other agents have done such for franchised clients, and have been successful. Did Carey even try, or did he just sit back thinking the Panthers would eventually cave?

No idea, but I'd certainly like to know.

And one other question: If this list was a bluff, then where did he really want to go?

There is a 4th option. He could sign an offer sheet with another team. Of course, that would mean that his agent would have to do a MAJOR sale job at this point.

[Jangler]

Option #5 could retire and go play basketball in Denver.

[carpanfan96]

Lets go through all that, (nice write up as usual Mr. Scot)

1. Option three isn't an option.

2. Don't be surprised if he signs a long term deal, before the deadline in July

3. I'll go with C. Carey isn't really an agent and he sucks trying to be one (biggest reason IMO this all failed on Peppers part, but Peppers position wasn't strong to begin with.

4. I'm not sure if he did try or not, but it didn't seem like he did to me. We'll never know on this one, unless he writes a book. On second thought I prefer not to know, that would be too much of a chore to even read.

5. Does Peppers even Want to Leave now? Is it now a game of Peppers getting the Massive over 100 million dollar contract?

[carpanfan96]

There is a 4th option. He could sign an offer sheet with another team. Of course, that would mean that his agent would have to do a MAJOR sale job at this point.

He won't do that because it gives Carolina the chance to match. If they match he's under contract and there ain't a damn thing he can do about it.

[Matt Foley]

Option 6....walk into Hurney's office, put him in a headlock, have Hurney call Belichick and say "how about Peppers for a 2nd rounder next year?" and hope there aren't any witnesses.

I think this is clearly his best option.

[Guest]

Is it possible though, that the real reason for "the list" was to present the team with no attractive options, in the hope that the team would eventually just throw their hands up in frustration and say "Whatever. Just leave then. We don't care where you go."

Any agent who thinks a team is just going to throw up their hands like that, when there are millions of dollars and top level jobs potentially on the line, is sadly sadly mistaken and should find another career. If it was a head case like TO or Ocho Cinco I suppose a team could consider it but not a guy like Pep.

-and, nice post Mr. Scot. :-)

[carpanfan96]

Any agent who thinks a team is just going to throw up their hands like that, when there are millions of dollars and top level jobs potentially on the line, is sadly sadly mistaken and should find another career. If it was a head case like TO or Ocho Cinco I suppose a team could consider it but not a guy like Pep.

-and, nice post Mr. Scot. :-)

And that's what Peppers gets for Hiring his friend and not a real damn agent. LMAO, He wasn't getting anything done without signing his tender. Carey is a laughing stock, no one was going to deal with him. Peppers wasn't going to sign it, because that would've ended the trade discussions there.

Hurney - Hey Peppers, since your signed I expect you at the Mandatory camps after the draft. ok? If you don't show, were going to dock a million off of your salary for each day. Later.

[rayzor]

thought i would get this out there just because it may take a while for him to show up in the thread....

ur so stupid. panthers screwed this up and everything is working in peppers favor. hurney is a moron. we're screwed.

i think savior faire and jangler's options are just as likely as the 3 that mr. scot gave.

still....it doesn't seem like whatever tactic they were using is showing much results. panthers got probably who they would have in the 1st round anyway. they signed 20 UDFAs and were pretty aggressive going after them. for a team more interested in building and looking for diamonds in the rough and also building a young team this was as good a strategy as any.

hurney is selling it like this was a direction they wanted to go anyway...going younger and faster to fill what few holes there were, building through the draft...so peppers is losing leverage.

they have had no problem saying that they prefer to move on with peppers but have also had no problem acting like they have no problem going on without him. no one seems overly concerned either way on any front. the team and players aren't bothered and i'm sure after today you are going to hear nothing but excitement about the possibilities of the coming season. from other teams you are hearing nothing in the way of interest in peppers. panthers say they don't anticipate him not showing up and playing but by all appearances don't seem like they will be bothered much if he sits or holds out. if he does he only makes himself look bad in the eyes of other teams, especially the way that the team has handled everything speaking of peppers with the utmost respect.

so far, while it's peppers move the panthers have things weighed in their favor.

[carolinarolls]

duh, I thought this was accepted as common knowledge by now. Somebody tell scottie we landed on the moon too

but it was not a bluff

in essence he followed through with it. it was meant to send a message to not tag him. It was a clear message that he was going to be difficult.

One that was not picked up on very well.

[rayzor]

duh, I thought this was accepted as common knowledge by now. Somebody tell scottie we landed on the moon too

but it was not a bluff

in essence he followed through with it. it was meant to send a message to not tag him. It was a clear message that he was going to be difficult.

One that was not picked up on very well.

that will work, too.

[Jangler]

I think it was a bluff and he was called on it.

[CatMan72]

I agree with Gantt, I think the list was meant to steer the Panthers towards trading Peppers to the Patriots. Three NFC teams and one AFC team is a no-brainer for the Panthers. I think "fulfill my potential" really means "put a ring on my finger before I retire".

[Snake]

Option #7 Call Shenanigans and everyone grabs there broom.