Question time

[TheMaulClaw]

The only receiving option we have who can stand on his own without Steve Smith playing at the same time is Greg Olsen.

 

Yeah that's not true man.  Record doesn't lie....3-0 without Smith.   Smith is definitely productive for his age, though not in the redzone anymore.  I'm not going to dispute that.  I want him to retire a Panther and work the slot, just not at 7 mil a year.  He's not worth that kind of money.  That's the underlying issue. That and he's starting to turn into a bit of a diva again.  I don't think his teammates say it too much...but I don't think they love him like the fans think they love him.  Gross played with Smith since college and Smith was the last person he brought up.  Gross's tone just made it seem like it took a long time for him and Smith to become friends and not great ones at that even though they had played together so long.  

 

Ultimately I think Smith's situation is just sort of confusing.  There are pros and cons to both sides.  

 

Do you think he's worth 7 mil next year?

[therealmjl]

Out

[Peppers90 NC]

unprovable hypatheticals are what message boards are made of

[TheRed]

Yeah that's not true man.  Record doesn't lie....3-0 without Smith.   Smith is definitely productive for his age, though not in the redzone anymore.  I'm not going to dispute that.  I want him to retire a Panther and work the slot, just not at 7 mil a year.  He's not worth that kind of money.  That's the underlying issue. That and he's starting to turn into a bit of a diva again.  I don't think his teammates say it too much...but I don't think they love him like the fans think they love him.  Gross played with Smith since college and Smith was the last person he brought up.  Gross's tone just made it seem like it took a long time for him and Smith to become friends and not great ones at that even though they had played together so long.  

 

Ultimately I think Smith's situation is just sort of confusing.  There are pros and cons to both sides.  

 

Do you think he's worth 7 mil next year?

 

You're going to have to dig a little deeper into the stats from those games he missed time in. I have a post in another thread about that. But to simply throw out "3-0 without Steve Smith, clearly we don't need him" is being incredibly short sighted, there is much more to it than that.

 

Which receiving option not named Greg Olsen do you see stepping up huge without Steve Smith on the field?

 

As for this diva silliness, and insinuations about his teammates possibly not liking him, that's just laughable. Really man?

[TheMaulClaw]

You're going to have to dig a little deeper into the stats from those games he missed time in. I have a post in another thread about that. But to simply throw out "3-0 without Steve Smith, clearly we don't need him" is being incredibly short sighted, there is much more to it than that.

 

Which receiving option not named Greg Olsen do you see stepping up huge without Steve Smith on the field?

 

As for this diva silliness, and insinuations about his teammates possibly not liking him, that's just laughable. Really man?

Well in a previous post on this same thread I went much more in depth with his in season statistics regarding our best games as an offense....so I would refer you to that.  

 

As for the diva statement....he has a history of calling out teammates publicly, and in training camp.  Now he's gone on a radio station and called out the GM who had done a fantastic job.  So I don't think that diva statement is that over the top.  In the past he's gotten away with it because of his production on the field.  He can't get away with it anymore.

 

As far as players stepping up.  Everyone hates on Lafell and he had 16 fewer catches yet only 118 fewer yards with 5 tds as opposed to Smith's 4tds.   Ginn also had 5 tds averaging 3 more yards per catch.  Both those players were targeted much less then Smith.

 

So if I had to answer your question honestly I'd say no.....but I would also include Smith in the no category....considering he didn't do much stepping up himself.  He had a very poor season for a "number 1" receiver.  Truth is we need to over haul all our receiving core as a whole including Smith unless he's willing to take a pay cut and move to the slot.

 

Here's a chart that's posted on Panthers.com

 

Greg Olsen 73 816 11.2 31 6 Steve Smith 64 745 11.6 44 4 Brandon LaFell 49 627 12.8 79 5 Ted Ginn 36 556 15.4 47 5

 

 So now answer my question....that you chose not to answer.  Is Smith worth 7 mil next year?

 

To give you a reference point....Anquan Boldin is close in age making close to the same thing and here are his statistics for the 2013 season.  Which is why I want to sign Boldin on a 1 year.

Year Team G Rec Yds Y/G Avg 100+ TD Rush Yds Y/G Avg 100+ TD Lost Yds TD Yds TD 2013 SF 16 85 1179 73.7 13.9 2 7 2 11 .7 5.5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0

[TheRed]

 

Well in a previous post on this same thread I went much more in depth with his in season statistics regarding our best games as an offense....so I would refer you to that.  

 

As for the diva statement....he has a history of calling out teammates publicly, and in training camp.  Now he's gone on a radio station and called out the GM who had done a fantastic job.  So I don't think that diva statement is that over the top.  In the past he's gotten away with it because of his production on the field.  He can't get away with it anymore.

 

As far as players stepping up.  Everyone hates on Lafell and he had 16 fewer catches yet only 118 fewer yards with 5 tds as opposed to Smith's 4tds.   Ginn also had 5 tds averaging 3 more yards per catch.  Both those players were targeted much less then Smith.

 

So if I had to answer your question honestly I'd say no.....but I would also include Smith in the no category....considering he didn't do much stepping up himself.  He had a very poor season for a "number 1" receiver.  Truth is we need to over haul all our receiving core as a whole including Smith unless he's willing to take a pay cut and move to the slot.

 

Here's a chart that's posted on Panthers.com

 

Greg Olsen 73 816 11.2 31 6 Steve Smith 64 745 11.6 44 4 Brandon LaFell 49 627 12.8 79 5 Ted Ginn 36 556 15.4 47 5

 

 So now answer my question....that you chose not to answer.  Is Smith worth 7 mil next year?

 

To give you a reference point....Anquan Boldin is close in age making close to the same thing and here are his statistics for the 2013 season.  Which is why I want to sign Boldin on a 1 year.

Year Team G Rec Yds Y/G Avg 100+ TD Rush Yds Y/G Avg 100+ TD Lost Yds TD Yds TD 2013 SF 16 85 1179 73.7 13.9 2 7 2 11 .7 5.5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0

 

 

I'm not going to argue about whether or not he's worth his contract, opinions vary.

 

Let's get down to the problem here. Who do we replace him with? Since we are parting ways with Steve Smith because he apparently makes too much money, obviously we aren't going to sign a top FA, but a cheap option. Who would that be? If you want go draft, how long will that receiver experience rookie growing pains while we wait?

 

Are we willing to sacrifice winning simply to move on for a cheaper option? Because the likelihood of us experiencing growing pains is very high, especially considering we had statistically one of the worst offenses in the league last year already.

 

As for Lafell, he had no yards in the Atlanta game to close the season, and had 0 (yes, zero) touchdowns through the final 5 games of the season, including the playoff game.

 

On Anquan Boldin, do you really not think that the other weapons they have help take pressure off of him? He doesn't have to carry the offense.

 

The diva stuff is nonsense.

[TheMaulClaw]

I'm not going to argue about whether or not he's worth his contract, opinions vary.

 

Let's get down to the problem here. Who do we replace him with? Since we are parting ways with Steve Smith because he apparently makes too much money, obviously we aren't going to sign a top FA, but a cheap option. Who would that be? If you want go draft, how long will that receiver experience rookie growing pains while we wait?

 

Are we willing to sacrifice winning simply to move on for a cheaper option? Because the likelihood of us experiencing growing pains is very high, especially considering we had statistically one of the worst offenses in the league last year already.

 

As for Lafell, he had no yards in the Atlanta game to close the season, and had 0 (yes, zero) touchdowns through the final 5 games of the season, including the playoff game.

 

On Anquan Boldin, do you really not think that the other weapons they have help take pressure off of him? He doesn't have to carry the offense.

 

The diva stuff is nonsense.

On Anquan Boldin:  Remember that Crabtree didn't play most of the year.....so he spent most of the season as the 49ers number 1 in a run first offense, and the year before that he won a SB with the Ravens.  So yes Anquan Boldin is legit and he's always owned the Panthers.  He's been successful everywhere he's been and I'm not leaving out his time with Arizona.

 

Personally I would rather spend the same money on Boldin then Smith just because of production.  He brings the same toughness and physicality that Smith is known for.

 

Regarding Lafell.....I answered your question.   I said no, but included Smith into the equation. I would say that Lafell does a great job of putting himself in position to be successful and make plays, then he just doesn't make them.  He is a better blocker then Smith though.  I don't expect to see him on the roster next year either.

 

Ginn is our best big play receiver.  Good on returns....he's not going anywhere.  

 

Not that hard to fix our WR problem.  Bring in Boldin, draft Benjamin (which is good because they're both FSU guys should have a good chemistry), pick up a TE in the 4th.  Most importantly the best way to improve our passing game is to improve our traditional run game which increases the potency of our play action.

 

Diva stuff is real.  No one would even be talking about Smith not being a Panther next year if he didn't go run his jaws on the radio.  He brought this on himself.  

 

Listen man....I think Smith has meant more to this franchise then any other player not named Newton.  He deserves a warriors ending.  I remember watching his kick return touchdown against the Vikings in his first game.  X Clown is "the" Panthers memory.  No one is taking that away.  What he's provided for this franchise in the past is not being disputed.  Which is why I'm disappointed in general about his rift between Rivera, Gettleman, and Smith. I agree with you on this.   Steve drew a line in a sand, and I don't get the impression that DG responds well to that. 

 

Still though, we're trying to get better while dealing with restraints that Hurney's dealings put on this  organization.   I can imagine JR reprimanding Hurney for how his deals could lead us into the position we are in today....which is why he was fired.  

 

What's done is done though.  We have got to find a way to field a competitive roster next season and it all comes down to money available.  

 

Can you honestly blame Gettleman for taking the approach he's taken in regards to Smith?  He's playing the hand that was given.

 

Unfortunately getting better and getting that ring that the organization and the fans deserve involve very tough emotionally challenging decisions that test our loyalty.   But I'm all in.  I want a Superbowl and I hope they do what it takes.  Smitty or not.  Kracken or not.

[TheRed]

Uh yeah if people aren't wanting to pay Steve Smith, there's no way in hell we bring in Anquan Boldin.

[TheMaulClaw]

Uh yeah if people aren't wanting to pay Steve Smith, there's no way in hell we bring in Anquan Boldin.

 

 

Boldin essentially cost the same thing with much more production.  It's not that they won't spend the money it's just why buy a sirloin at 8 bucks when there's a special on NY strip for the same price.

[TheRed]

Boldin essentially cost the same thing with much more production.  It's not that they won't spend the money it's just why buy a sirloin at 8 bucks when there's a special on NY strip for the same price.

 

I thought the idea was to go cheaper, and younger?

 

Boldin is a pipe dream. He likely isn't leaving San Francisco, but wherever he ends up, he's going to be making even more money.

[PandaPancake]

Going by the numbers Olsen was the best reciever on the team last year.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I727 using CarolinaHuddle mobile app

How dare you bring facts into this!

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using CarolinaHuddle mobile app

[jarhead]

Yeah that's not true man.  Record doesn't lie....3-0 without Smith.   Smith is definitely productive for his age, though not in the redzone anymore.  I'm not going to dispute that.  I want him to retire a Panther and work the slot, just not at 7 mil a year.  He's not worth that kind of money.  That's the underlying issue. That and he's starting to turn into a bit of a diva again.  I don't think his teammates say it too much...but I don't think they love him like the fans think they love him.  Gross played with Smith since college and Smith was the last person he brought up.  Gross's tone just made it seem like it took a long time for him and Smith to become friends and not great ones at that even though they had played together so long.  

 

Ultimately I think Smith's situation is just sort of confusing.  There are pros and cons to both sides.  

 

Do you think he's worth 7 mil next year?

 

 

Most of our team is overpaid but I do not see you calling them out. Sometime the value of a player goes beyond stats/The bottom line we are a much better team with Steve Smith and until that changes yes he is worth it.

[Doyle]

Where is PhillyB and his obscure trivia when you need him?

[AceBoogie]

We could barely get a damn first down without 89.