Rookie Watch 2014 - A Promising Start

[Mol3m4n]

Through the draft:

*denotes unproven but has potential as a starter.

Defense anchors (round):

Hurney Picks: Luke Kuechly(1), Thomas Davis(1), Greg Hardy(6), Charles Johnson(2).

Gettleman Picks: Star Lotulelei(1)

Winner: Hurney

Offense anchors (round):

Hurney Picks: Cam Newton(1), DeAngelo Williams(1), Ryan Kalil(2), Amini Silatolu(2)*

Gettleman Picks: Kelvin Benjamin(1)*, Trai Turner(3)*

Winner: Hurney

Free Agent anchors (Starting at position multiple seasons including 2014)

Hurney: Mike Tolbert, Greg Olsen, Byron Bell

Gettleman: Dwan Edwards

Winner: Hurney

While I did not care for Hurney as a GM and his lack of consistency in the NFL Draft, I dislike Gettleman even more. Gettleman has not done much to replace the foundation left by Hurney.

This is still Hurney's team. Gettleman has done little in 2 off-seasons to supplant what Hurney laid out. When I see Gettleman have free agents going to the Pro Bowl and banking key starters outside the 1st round, then we can talk. Gettleman has only improved the DT position and nothing else compared to Hurney's impact everywhere else. Gettleman has an opportunity with the OT, WR, OLB, and DB areas, but those are the constant areas to question even with Gettleman having 2 off-seasons under his belt.

Yes, Hurney was not great and messed up the draft several times. Hurney has still left a young foundation that is on the cusp of greatness. Do not award all of that to Gettleman. Will Gettleman give us any pro bowl picks in his first 3 off seasons? 1 more year to go to answer that question. Hurney gave the fans back to back rookie of the years and defensive player of the year. Not to mention all our pro bowl and all pro caliber players. Not Gettleman.

So, hush on this Gettleman butt love and Hurney hatred until he proves something more than mediocre talent and solid starters. Can he at least land a worthwhile free agent that stays on the team?

In all honesty, Gettleman does not even come close in his first two off seasons to the success Hurney had as a GM. Will Gettleman even come close to matching what Hurney did in his first two seasons as GM? Hurney replaced the former regime and drafted 6 key starters and brought in 4 key free agents which led to the 2003 Super Bowl. That is nearly replacing half of the core team, which Gettleman has not done in his first two off seasons. And 4 of the 10 Hurney brought in his first 2 off seasons went to the Pro Bowl.

Argue with those facts.

This argument is just silly. You're comparing 5 years to 2 years. Of course Hurney will have more players due to the amount of time spent with the team. Why don't you expand your analysis to include how many people from the draft classes are still on the team. Sure, that argument is biased with time too, but it's about pathetic that one person from the 2011 draft will be on the team by the time the regular season starts.

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[ed bell]

This argument is just silly. You're comparing 5 years to 2 years. Of course Hurney will have more players due to the amount of time spent with the team. Why don't you expand your analysis to include how many people from the draft classes are still on the team. Sure, that argument is biased with time too, but it's about pathetic that one person from the 2011 draft will be on the team by the time the regular season starts.

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Also, it isn't even two years, it's one year and two drafts. Plus we went 12-4 and had a top 5 defense last year.

[MedellinHeel]

Being concerned about Ealy in year one is just silly. It took till his fourth season for Charles Johnson to do anything more than flash in the NFL. DE is notoriously hard to transition to in the NFL more times than not.

 

all i am saying in players in the top 3 rounds should be able (or needs) to produce right away. 

 

atleast that is my thought process. 

[C47]

all i am saying in players in the top 3 rounds should be able (or needs) to produce right away. 

 

atleast that is my thought process. 

 

That's not realistic though. Plenty of guys drafted in the first three rounds don't start year one and still manage to carve out really good careers. 

[Mol3m4n]

That's not realistic though. Plenty of guys drafted in the first three rounds don't start year one and still manage to carve out really good careers.

It's very possible. Just look at Keenan Allen or even Turner this year. Starters from the get go.

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[LinvilleGorge]

Ideally you'd like your high picks to contribute early, but ultimately the primary goal is to have them contribute long-term. Luckily with our current DL depth, Ealy is a luxury this year. If he's not an impact player as a rookie it won't be detrimental to the team. We all know that Ealy was drafted for future cap flexibility given CJ's and Hardy's contract situations.

[C47]

It's very possible. Just look at Keenan Allen or even Turner this year. Starters from the get go.

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Exception, not the rule. For every Keenan Allen there's probably ten Damontre Moore's...

[MedellinHeel]

Ideally you'd like your high picks to contribute early, but ultimately the primary goal is to have them contribute long-term. Luckily with our current DL depth, Ealy is a luxury this year. If he's not an impact player as a rookie it won't be detrimental to the team. We all know that Ealy was drafted for future cap flexibility given CJ's and Hardy's contract situations.

 

Yea but I am not so he will ever be as good or live up to the 2nd round expectations. 

 

Not really impressive in TC and wasnt even the best DE on his college team. 

 

I am just hoping I am wrong, but my gut tells me he was a reach due to the Hardy/Johnson contracts on the horizon. 

[cookinbrak]

I am a tad concerned about Ealy. A 2nd round pick needs be be starter quality out the gate imo. He seems like a project that for some odd reason I don't think will ever reach with his 2nd round expectations. The gay dude from Mizzo outshined him all last season. 

 

Ugh I hope I am dead wrong about this. 

 

You are. Guys come out early, smart teams give them time to make up for the junior/senior years. A talented 24 year old is still a talented 24 year old. Ealy is gonna be a beast.

[MedellinHeel]

You are. Guys come out early, smart teams give them time to make up for the junior/senior years. A talented 24 year old is still a talented 24 year old. Ealy is gonna be a beast.

 

What makes him so talented? 

 

Explosiveness?

 

Speed?

 

Array of rush moves?

 

Strength?

 

Stats? 

 

Just curious. To me he seems ok, but nothing jumps out about him from what I know (limited)

[Blackmagic]

I am a tad concerned about Ealy. A 2nd round pick needs be be starter quality out the gate imo. He seems like a project that for some odd reason I don't think will ever reach with his 2nd round expectations. The gay dude from Mizzo outshined him all last season. 

 

Ugh I hope I am dead wrong about this. 

 

He just to learn to use the right technique all the time, because college is filled with guys who won't be pros. But you're wrong about Sam outshining him. Sam had more sacks, yes, but you would have seen Mizzou play. Sam was barely double teamed, but the offense was paying more attention to Ealy. Sam used speed rush only, and some of his sacks were laughable because he wasn't blocked. Sam had more sacks, but Ealy was the key to their pass rush.

[DaveThePanther2008]

Through the draft:

*denotes unproven but has potential as a starter.

 

Defense anchors (round):

Hurney Picks: Luke Kuechly(1), Thomas Davis(1), Greg Hardy(6), Charles Johnson(2).

Gettleman Picks: Star Lotulelei(1)

Winner: Hurney

 

Offense anchors (round):

Hurney Picks: Cam Newton(1), DeAngelo Williams(1), Ryan Kalil(2), Amini Silatolu(2)*

Gettleman Picks: Kelvin Benjamin(1)*, Trai Turner(3)*

Winner: Hurney

 

Free Agent anchors (Starting at position multiple seasons including 2014)

Hurney: Mike Tolbert, Greg Olsen, Byron Bell

Gettleman: Dwan Edwards

Winner: Hurney

 

While I did not care for Hurney as a GM and his lack of consistency in the NFL Draft, I dislike Gettleman even more. Gettleman has not done much to replace the foundation left by Hurney.

 

This is still Hurney's team. Gettleman has done little in 2 off-seasons to supplant what Hurney laid out. When I see Gettleman have free agents going to the Pro Bowl and banking key starters outside the 1st round, then we can talk. Gettleman has only improved the DT position and nothing else compared to Hurney's impact everywhere else. Gettleman has an opportunity with the OT, WR, OLB, and DB areas, but those are the constant areas to question even with Gettleman having 2 off-seasons under his belt.

 

Yes, Hurney was not great and messed up the draft several times. Hurney has still left a young foundation that is on the cusp of greatness. Do not award all of that to Gettleman. Will Gettleman give us any pro bowl picks in his first 3 off seasons? 1 more year to go to answer that question. Hurney gave the fans back to back rookie of the years and defensive player of the year. Not to mention all our pro bowl and all pro caliber players. Not Gettleman.

 

So, hush on this Gettleman butt love and Hurney hatred until he proves something more than mediocre talent and solid starters. Can he at least land a worthwhile free agent that stays on the team?

 

In all honesty, Gettleman does not even come close in his first two off seasons to the success Hurney had as a GM. Will Gettleman even come close to matching what Hurney did in his first two seasons as GM? Hurney replaced the former regime and drafted 6 key starters and brought in 4 key free agents which led to the 2003 Super Bowl. That is nearly replacing half of the core team, which Gettleman has not done in his first two off seasons. And 4 of the 10 Hurney brought in his first 2 off seasons went to the Pro Bowl.

 

Argue with those facts.

 

Of course this shows quite a few years of personnel.   How about taking Hurney first two season against Gettleman's first two seasons.  

 

I did a post a 4 or 5 years ago where I show at one time Carolina was second only to NYG of players drafted that were still in the NFL.  (not necessarily still with Carolina)  That has now crumbled to really low numbers.

 

Hurney wasn't bad at it but I don't ever remember UDFA really making a difference like G'man's did.  Lester and White were huge contributors last year and there could be a couple that make it this year. 

 

If I had to choose between G'Man and Hurney it wouldn't even be a second thought.  I would take G'man day in and day out.  That is not including the salary mess Hurney put us in.

[CPantherKing]

That's not realistic though. Plenty of guys drafted in the first three rounds don't start year one and still manage to carve out really good careers. 

 

It is realistic for the teams that go to the playoffs year in and year out, and go to the Super Bowl.

 

The teams that fail to have success, which is the majority of course, are the ones that make this look unrealistic. There is a correlation.

[CPantherKing]

Of course this shows quite a few years of personnel.   How about taking Hurney first two season against Gettleman's first two seasons.  

 

I did a post a 4 or 5 years ago where I show at one time Carolina was second only to NYG of players drafted that were still in the NFL.  (not necessarily still with Carolina)  That has now crumbled to really low numbers.

 

Hurney wasn't bad at it but I don't ever remember UDFA really making a difference like G'man's did.  Lester and White were huge contributors last year and there could be a couple that make it this year. 

 

If I had to choose between G'Man and Hurney it wouldn't even be a second thought.  I would take G'man day in and day out.  That is not including the salary mess Hurney put us in.

 

First, I was comparing the current roster only. I did not include the players who impacted the Panthers last season on the way to the playoffs, which would have made Hurney look even better. Even though Hurney is not here, those are still his players that are leading the Panthers to success. Gettleman did not replace what Hurney did, he sat back and enjoyed the ride in the team that Hurney built. You cannot argue with this.

 

Second, I already did a comparison of Hurney's first two off seasons against Gettleman's. It was at the end of the post. I knew people would say it is unfair to credit players from the current roster to Hurney because he was with the team longer. So, I showed how Hurney supplanted a team with new young talent that went all pro/Pro Bowl and a new Head Coach, and got them to the Super Bowl after his second off season. I showed how Gettleman inherited an entire team that was about to turn the corner, did little to bring in core franchise players in his first two off seasons, and acts more as a caretaker than an architect.

 

Gettleman needs to have Star, Benjamin, and Turner get into Pro Bowl contention, and have the Panthers winning in the playoffs and sniffing the Super Bowl to even keep up with Hurney at the same stage in their careers.

 

This is still Hurney's team until Gettleman replaces Hurney's players and coaches with better talent.