Dave Gettleman, Norman, & The Divison

[Teach_Panther]

1 minute ago, The_Rainmaker said:

especially being a run first team having the best dual threat QB. Its similar to giving Luke Star, KK, Butler, Ealy, etc but thats okay. 

Are you saying that you get your best player killed by asking them to do too much?

 

[The_Rainmaker]

9 minutes ago, Saca312 said:

So, Daryl Williams is trash? He's looking the part when everyone's mostly healthy, and held his own for the most part over some weeks.

Andrew Norwell is trash? He's been a solis guard.

Extended Ryan Kalil, a key piece.

So, Trai Turner regressed? Fair, because he doesn't have all pro C Kalil beside him anchoring the oline, but still solid for the most part. But he was a probowler last season, so understand he's been a solid pickup.

Sure, arguable for LT, but a substantia upgrade over our old trash, and he was solid most of last year.

Again, injuries killed us this year.

Please though, entertain us some more with how these guys when healthy are all trash?

 

 

Oher & Remmers are JAG and when you  face agbove JAG pass rushers consistently  your going to pay the price. Esepcially since this offense is not WCO where you can get the ball out quickly.  

D.G. doesnt truly  understand the Panther's offensive philosophy 

[mcdougal]

4 minutes ago, The_Rainmaker said:

 

I like OTs to be in top 10 like how we have our DTs cause you know they are going to face preimum talent 

Stay Green my friend. 

You may think you know somethinng about football but you really dont  :) 

 

 

derp we signed a sub-par tackle...what more do you need derp derp?

Meanwhile, Dave goes back to back DL taken in one year...cuts the entire WR core the next therefore forcing him to take a WR the next year (the only draft pick he spends on WR)...then the next yea goes right back to drafting DL AGAIN.

If Cam got 1/2 of the resources that Luke gets on defense...I would understand...

Instead, we draft defensive linemen like crazy...draft defensive overall like crazy...then expect our limited offense to go toe to toe with the league's highest scoring offenses...

Meanwhile, that same defense is giving up 15/15 for 200 yards in the first half and 300 yards to WRs performances.

 

[Mr. Scot]

16 minutes ago, The_Rainmaker said:

I like OTs to be in top 10 like how we have our DTs cause you know they are going to face preimum talent. Williams is a good pick up but we should have invested in the OTs long ago in the draft.

Stay Green my friend. 

You may think you know something about football but you really dont  :) 

I know a couple of things you clearly don't.

(more than a couple actually, but hey...)

One, we haven't drafted a DT in the top ten. We haven't actually had a top ten pick in the last four drafts. Our highest pick in those drafts was 14.

Two, the bust rate for top ten picks has gone up quite a bit over the past few years. Heck, just today the Rams benched left tackle Greg Robinson.

Why? Because as has been discussed here before, colleges have gone to simplified systems that don't ask much of their tackles and thus leave them ill prepared for pro systems that require reads and adjustments.

That means lots of guys who are thrust into the starting spot early are looking bad, whereas guys drafted later who can take a year or two to adjust to the game are making the easier transition.

See, this is what we call "real world football" where it's not as simple as the guy who's drafted higher is automatically better because he has the higher player rating in the game engine.

But hey, keep checking Madden or PFF.

It's all you've got to work with, anyway.

[The_Rainmaker]

11 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

I know a couple of things you clearly don't.

(more than a couple actually, but hey...)

One, we haven't drafted a DT in the top ten. We haven't actually had a top ten pick in the last four drafts. Our highest pick in those drafts was 14.

Two, the bust rate for top ten picks has gone up quite a bit over the past few years. Heck, just today the Rams benched left tackle Greg Robinson.

Why? Because as has been discussed here before, colleges have gone to simplified systems that don't ask much of their tackles and thus leave them ill prepared for pro systems that require reads and adjustments.

That means lots of guys who are thrust into the starting spot early are looking bad, whereas guys drafted later who can take a year or two to adjust to the game are making the easier transition.

See, this is what we call "real world football" where it's not as simple as the guy who's drafted higher is automatically better because he has the higher player rating in the game engine.

But hey, keep checking Madden or PFF.

It's all you've got to work with, anyway.

Dude I see plenty of teams with OTs that have picked at our range or where willing to move up that turned out to be starter materials. Also if  it takes longer for a draft prospects to adapt then Gettelman should have planned for OTs several season ago to bring the prospect up to speed. He just doesnt value OTs and that has hurt the team. 

I have tangible stats backing my info up 

New englands OTs, David Bakhtiari, Moses, etc

You dont know poo, just talking out of your ass. 

 

[Mr. Scot]

8 hours ago, The_Rainmaker said:

Dude I see plenty of teams with OTs that have picked at our range or where willing to move up that turned out to be starter materials. Also if  it takes longer for a draft prospects to adapt then Gettelman should have planned for OTs several season ago to bring the prospect up to speed. He just doesnt value OTs and that has hurt the team. 

I have tangible stats backing my info up 

New englands OTs, David Bakhtiari, Moses, etc

You dont know poo, just talking out of your ass. 

 

 Exactly as predicted.

You've never even played football, have you, kid?

[Zaximus]

OP is going a bit mad but he's not really wrong that Dave is probably the #1 reason we're having issues (since the beginning of the season).  Coaching is probably on the same level as Dave as well though.   Between not getting help at needed positions on both lines (and Norman thing) and Shula's play-calling, I'd have to say that's the biggest issues.  

I think most people would have been OK losing Norman if we used the money on upgrading other positions.  Maybe Weddle who is balling or Okung.  One of those would have been affordable and would be helping us a ton right now.

Instead he didn't use it at all.  He's also failed to extend Short.   I have little confidence he will and wonder if people will finally give him the blame he deserves.   He's going to have to check that ego at the door a bit to get these guys signed.  I hope we have good draft, we should have decently high picks at least.   So to me, Dave has another offseason to really prove himself, if he can right the ship.

And even if he let Norman go to sign people, why not make him play on the tag?  You'd still have money to sign people after this year and we would have had another run at the Super Bowl.   If we weren't in the running for the SB, who care?  We were though.   And for those saying he wouldn't play out the tag, that's not true, hardly any players do that.   At his age and position, there's no way he leaves 14 million on the table.   It's a negotiating tactic that no one believes anymore (except maybe Gettleman?).  

[Kakarot]

53 minutes ago, Zaximus said:

And even if he let Norman go to sign people, why not make him play on the tag?  You'd still have money to sign people after this year and we would have had another run at the Super Bowl.   If we weren't in the running for the SB, who care?  We were though.   And for those saying he wouldn't play out the tag, that's not true, hardly any players do that.   At his age and position, there's no way he leaves 14 million on the table.   It's a negotiating tactic that no one believes anymore (except maybe Gettleman?).  

This is what many have been saying for the longest. Norman even said it himself, that he wasn't going to holdout and he wanted to be in Carolina. You've got many on here who are selective in who they want to believe. One minute it's, "who do you think I'm going to believe, a huddler or a guy that's actually in the locker room?" The next it's, "why should I believe Josh Norman? He's just trying not to look bad." *shrugs* Inconsistencies and selective in who you want to believe.

Oh well. The Norman situation is done. Dave made a mistake, and we just have to hope he rights the ship and tempers that ego. It's going to start with Short's contract, and no matter what any on here say, we need to retain Short. He's shown what he's capable of and he's still in his prime.

[AceBoogie]

12 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

I'm sure Josh Norman has no reason to lie to make himself look good.

I'm sure Igo's probably lying about him privately saying he'd rather hold out than sign the franchise tag too.

So you're calling Norman a liar then using what he said to Igo to further your case? What a tangled web that is

[tiger7_88]

12 hours ago, Kakarot said:

Josh Norman himself says he would've signed

He had weeks with the contract in front of him that he could have signed it.

He never signed it.

I used to offer my son money to cut the grass.  Over and over again I'd remind him that I'd put that money in his pocket if he'd get out and just cut that grass.

He wouldn't cut the grass.

Then I'd get out and cut the grass myself.

Then he'd be all mad that I didn't let him cut the grass because, gosh Dad, I was really, really, really gonna do it.

We all know my son was never gonna cut that grass.  Just like we all know that Josh Norman was never gonna sign that franchise tag.  We know that because he was given all the opportunity in the world to do so and he never did it.

I understand that in y'alls Lollipop Dreams and Cotton Candy Wishes that my son was REALLY REALLY gonna cut that grass and that Josh Norman was REALLY REALLY gonna sign that contract.  Back down here in the real world, that never happened and was never gonna happen.

[The_Rainmaker]

2 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

 Exactly as predicted.

You've never even played football, have you, kid?

lol you act like you have NFL scouting knowledge but really is  just trying to live a  fantasy dream of being General Manager. I just gave you successful OTs that where picked around the same range as Panthers.

 

Again you don't bring any facts or stats just taking out of your FUPA ass. 

 

[Navy_football]

I could be wrong but I thought a lot of players waited to sign the franchise tag. They have no incentive to sign it early and they usually punt on training camp and just work out on their own. Some even avoid preseason to avoid risk of injury in meaningless games. 

Norman wasn't gonna sit on $15M. He would have played this year.

 

[heel31ok]

10 hours ago, The_Rainmaker said:

Dude I see plenty of teams with OTs that have picked at our range or where willing to move up that turned out to be starter materials. Also if  it takes longer for a draft prospects to adapt then Gettelman should have planned for OTs several season ago to bring the prospect up to speed. He just doesnt value OTs and that has hurt the team. 

I have tangible stats backing my info up 

New englands OTs, David Bakhtiari, Moses, etc

You dont know poo, just talking out of your ass. 

 

Correct ,and please don't bring up Bakhtiari...we can't sit around waiting for the perfect LT to just appear...isn't talent evaluation G-MAN's mythological claim to fame? Another year behind in development because he rolled the dice on Oher who was never more than a 1 yr fix...and we were already behind last season...same goes for Corner where we have been one or more behind since Gamble left... G-MAN, the original perpetual motion machine...

[The NFL Shield At Midfield]

that op, holy poo