Heading into the off season - ID our Core Players

[Paa Langfart]

Heading into off season, who do you see as the Panthers core players?  We know that a lot of our core play makers from this season will be gone - Ryan Kalil, Julius Peppers, and most likely T Davis among others.  Of those guys who are left who has shown they can consistently make the big plays,  inspire this team to win AND are healthy ?  I can think of maybe 2 or 3 guys.  I am curious who other Panthers fans think our " Core" will be going into next season.

[Chardee MacDennis]

It's hard for NFL teams to have a core group of guys really. There's so much movement of players in free agency, draft, injuries, players aging out, players just not being what they were the year before. It's crazy.

 

But if I had to try, it would look something like this, in order of importance to the team's future:

Offense- CMC, DJ Moore, Daryl Williams, Taylor Moton, Trai Turner, Curtis Samuel, Ian Thomas, Cam Newton. 

Defense- Donte Jackson, Shaq Thompson, James Bradberry, Eric Reid, Dontari Poe, Rashaan Gaulden, KK Short, Efe Obada, Luke Keuchly

I think this team is 1 LB, 1 Safety, and 2 pass rushers away from having a complete defense. 

And 2 OL, 1 TE, 1 RB (weapon), and a QB to groom away from being a complete offense. 

Really we are like 8 guys away. Free Agency and the draft should be sufficient but then again it all depends on who is at the helm, not to mention what the team philosophy is depending on coaching changes. 

[CarolinaNCSU]

Honestly, and probably a taboo thing to say...but it will be good for us to lose some of our "name" players. I love them to death, but our old guys...

• Olsen has been hurt and almost invisible for two years now. 
• Same for Ryan Kalil. 
• Pep is great, but he's a rotational guy making a play once every 4 games. 
• TD is looking slow and missing tackles, something he used to NEVER do. Not to mention, he got beat in coverage a couple times yesterday. 
• Captain/Mike Adams - - Get out

We're looking at 30 million or so up top, for guys who barely have played, or have rarely balled out. Now some younger "name" guys we had hoped would become something...

• Shaq - We'll end up keeping him, but someone explain to be how he's worth his 5th year option of 9-10 million?
• Funch - Get out
• KK Short - Living off of a good season. He'll be here next year, but that contract will be a nice cut the year after IIRC

I feel like I just listed half of our starting line-up...the good news, though, the other half of our starting lineup are or can be studs to build around.

• Offense - Cam, CMC, Moore, Samuel, Thomas, Moton, Trai, (and D. Williams, too, potentially)

Defense - Luke, Donte, Bradberry

• And here's the problem. Our offense is crazy talented, but young.  Mistakes and inconsistency will come, especially with Cam's inconsistency.  We're crazy high or crazy low, no inbetween.
• That defense though...yeesh.  Even guys like Addison are JAGS. 
• Luke, Donte, and Bradberry are the only three guys I can without question say are here in 3 years. That's scary, and this draft needs to be a home run to keep up. 

[Icege]

Offense - Cam, CMC, Moore, Samuel, Moton, Trai, Thomas, Armah

Defense - Luke, KK, Shaq, Bradberry, DJax, Addison

ST - Palardy, Jansen

 

Really want to see us retain Daryl Williams and Eric Reid. Will be interesting to see if Olsen and/or Davis are retained as well as if whether or not we'll see a core player develop out of Carter, Smith, and Haynes.

Haven't zero'd in on a first round, but I'm quickly loving the idea of Michael Deiter out of Wisconsin in the 3rd. Has experience all over the line which gives him versatility and is projected to likely start at guard in the NFL. Potential to start at center as well, but could be an upgrade (this coming season or the following) for Van Roten. Top 3 positions of need imo are going to be defensive end, center, and free safety.

[Carl Spackler]

Core guys to build around

Luke, CMC, Moore, Samuel

Guys who could join that core

Jackson, Thomas, Moton

Guys who are good where they are

Cam, Trai, Armah, Jansen, Palardy

Question marks who could be fine too

Reid, Bradberry, Daryl Williams, Wright

Guys who need to retire as Panthers soon

Olsen, Pep, TD, Ryan Kalil

Guys we need to cut as soon as we can

Funchess, Matt Kalil, Poe, Gano

[kungfoodude]

7 minutes ago, Chardee MacDennis said:

It's hard for NFL teams to have a core group of guys really. There's so much movement of players in free agency, draft, injuries, players aging out, players just not being what they were the year before. It's crazy.

 

But if I had to try, it would look something like this, in order of importance to the team's future:

Offense- CMC, DJ Moore, Daryl Williams, Taylor Moton, Trai Turner, Curtis Samuel, Ian Thomas, Cam Newton. 

Defense- Donte Jackson, Shaq Thompson, James Bradberry, Eric Reid, Dontari Poe, Rashaan Gaulden, KK Short, Efe Obada, Luke Keuchly

I think this team is 1 LB, 1 Safety, and 2 pass rushers away from having a complete defense. 

And 2 OL, 1 TE, 1 RB (weapon), and a QB to groom away from being a complete offense. 

Really we are like 8 guys away. Free Agency and the draft should be sufficient but then again it all depends on who is at the helm, not to mention what the team philosophy is depending on coaching changes. 

It is highly unlikely we are able to fill all of our roster needs in one offseason, much like it was this past offseason. If we can get someone to groom at DE in the draft and then try and get a rental as a stop gap, perhaps we can have have moderate improvements on the DL. The odds are we have to make a complete overhaul in the next 2-3 seasons regardless.

The LB corps we may be able to punt on if TD comes back for another season. Eventually we are going to have to have a path forward for replacing him, however. I don't see the current roster options being able to be a long term replacement for TD.

I honestly believe we aren't that bad at DB, despite the results. We could do a lot worse than Bradberry and Jackson. Adams has to be replaced at his age and Reid could be extended as a stop gap measure. Ultimately we need two starting safeties and I don't see any player on the roster as a viable long term option. It would also be nice to upgrade over Munnerlyn if we have that luxury.

Offensively, we need a real backup QB. I don't think Heincke is an NFL caliber QB. He is a #3 QB at best. Cam's health is a big question and will likely continue to be, so we can't ignore this forever.

At WR we seem to be set long term. Finding another guy to replace Funchess on the depth chart will have to happen but Moore and Samuel seem to be the obvious long term answer. I would keep Wright, as well. Thomas looks like he could be a solid replacement for Greg.

The OL is a big, big question. Both Kalil's will be gone and we don't know if signing Daryl Williams will be an option. If not, we are looking at a pretty big overhaul. If that is the case, only Moton is probably a long term member of the OL. Turner is likely on his last contract with us. So there is a chance we have to obtain three new starters as a worst case scenario. IMO, this is the area that has to be the absolute priority over any other. If the new regime continues to neglect protecting Cam, I honestly do not see the reason to keep him. Shoring up this unit is the one thing we absolutely must do this offseason. No excuses.

We are fine at RB/FB. It would be nice to add another depth back but that depends on availability. Not a critical need.

As a team we need to be getting younger. We will not be able to accomplish that in one draft. We will absolutely not be able to accomplish that reasonably in one free agency period. The hope is we can shore up very critical needs(OL/DL) and fill in with enough stop gap signings to tide us over until the next offseason. I said during this past offseason that we were looking at a 2-3 year retooling or rebuilding effort. I stand by that assessment. 

[MGH1989]

Offense:

Cam, CMAC, Trai Turner, Daryl Williams, Taylor Moton, DJ Moore, Curtis Samuel, Ian Thomas

Defense:

KK Short, Efe Obada, Shaq Thompson, Luke Kuechly, James Bradberry, Daryl Jackson. 

 

Honestly, we aren't too far off. I think the biggest thing personnel wise for this team is adding a legitimate pass rusher. We haven't had that since CJ/Greg Hardy 5 or so years ago. This team can, and has had great defenses with average talent in the secondary, but DJ and Bradberry are definitely good enough to really make this defense great again if we can get a great pass rush. I also would like to see us actually address safety and add a ball hawk type of player that can make game changing plays. Offense it really doesn't seem that bleak, even with how bad the line has been the last couple of week, if we get DW's back, move Moton to LT we are pretty set if we can just get serviceable play at LG and Center.

[Squirrel]

My list is short and young

 

Offense

Cmc

Turner

Samuel's

Moore

 

Defense 

Jackson 

Short

Bradbery

Luke 

Addison 

 

 

[CRA]

6 minutes ago, Squirrel said:

My list is short and young

 

Offense

Cmc

Turner

Samuel's

Moore

 

Defense 

Jackson 

Short

Bradbery

Luke 

Addison 

 

 

I would only add potentially, Thomas on O.  I like what we have seen form the rookie. 

on D, I'd add Shaq.  Shaq looked his best before Davis came back.  I think when he is the dude, he is better.  

[Carl Spackler]

1 minute ago, CRA said:

I would only add potentially, Thomas on O.  I like what we have seen form the rookie. 

on D, I'd add Shaq.  Shaq looked his best before Davis came back.  I think when he is the dude, he is better.  

Shaq is the Gerald Henderson of the Panthers. Not a bust, not bad, but not what you want out of a first-round pick either.  

[CRA]

1 minute ago, Carl Spackler said:

Shaq is the Gerald Henderson of the Panthers. Not a bust, not bad, but not what you want out of a first-round pick either.  

well, you want your first round pick to start, grow and be a beast. Shaq has literally never had that opportunity in the position he is literally built for.  Because of TD. 

So that is a Panther issue, not a Shaq issue IMO. 

Why need matters when drafting.   What is going to haunt this team is spending multiple first round picks who were destined to be backups for years and years.    Who drafts you matters in terms of your success.  Shaq and Butler went to horrible spots for their individual careers IMO.  They were both destined to be backups for years and years.  Playing time meant relief work or playing outside of your ideal spot.  

[ickmule]

CMC, Luke, Samuel, Moore....... That's about it. 

[Seoul_Panther]

1 hour ago, CarolinaNCSU said:

Honestly, and probably a taboo thing to say...but it will be good for us to lose some of our "name" players. I love them to death, but our old guys...

• Olsen has been hurt and almost invisible for two years now. 
• Same for Ryan Kalil. 
• Pep is great, but he's a rotational guy making a play once every 4 games. 
• TD is looking slow and missing tackles, something he used to NEVER do. Not to mention, he got beat in coverage a couple times yesterday. 
• Captain/Mike Adams - - Get out

We're looking at 30 million or so up top, for guys who barely have played, or have rarely balled out. Now some younger "name" guys we had hoped would become something...

• Shaq - We'll end up keeping him, but someone explain to be how he's worth his 5th year option of 9-10 million?
• Funch - Get out
• KK Short - Living off of a good season. He'll be here next year, but that contract will be a nice cut the year after IIRC

I feel like I just listed half of our starting line-up...the good news, though, the other half of our starting lineup are or can be studs to build around.

• Offense - Cam, CMC, Moore, Samuel, Thomas, Moton, Trai, (and D. Williams, too, potentially)

Defense - Luke, Donte, Bradberry

• And here's the problem. Our offense is crazy talented, but young.  Mistakes and inconsistency will come, especially with Cam's inconsistency.  We're crazy high or crazy low, no inbetween.
• That defense though...yeesh.  Even guys like Addison are JAGS. 
• Luke, Donte, and Bradberry are the only three guys I can without question say are here in 3 years. That's scary, and this draft needs to be a home run to keep up. 

 Great post and I agree about the older guys. I feel like because there are so many holes to replace we may end up keeping TD maybe even ST and VB because we can’t replace them all at once. (I’m not saying I want to)!

 I have our core players as: Offense-Cam, McCaffrey, Moton, Moore

Defense-Kuechly, Addison, Jackson.

I disagree with your assessment of Addison as a jag, because despite being old he is on course for his third successive 10 sack season. 

 What I notice looking at this is none of the defensive core guys are young except Donte. That clearly needs to happen through the draft and I agree that cutting unmerited contracts of older players should happen too.

[Frenchy]

I will not mention the vet'. This team look slow and old this season. I want only young guns with a new coach staff where they can rise.

Offense : Cam, CMC, Moore, Thomas, Moton, Roten, Williams and Trai.

Defense : Luke, Shaq (bye bye Davis thanks for all), Jackson, Short (sigh too) and Bradberry.

To be honest i would change everything about the Dline and safeties.