Draftng a QB now could be a big mistake

[TheRed]

Allen and Grier are not franchise quarterbacks.

If you want to win you need a QB and in that instance unfortunately you throw crap at the wall until something sticks unless you intend on gambling with signing one to a big contract in free agency. The Panthers are not and will not be the only team desperate for a quarterback. And when we do find ours he will be paid big if he is any good. That's the way of the NFL.

[NanuqoftheNorth]

I suspect the most highly skilled and mobile QB in the league, Patrick Mahomes, wouldn't look nearly as good behind the Panthers O line.  He would spend most of his time in the backfield running around for his life or getting knock on his ass.  Also considering how porous our defense was this season, Mahomes would have had a difficult time mounting one of his famous comebacks from the sidelines while opponents ran the ball down our throats and time off the clock.

Bottom line:  Carolina needs to rebuild their lines, until that happens it doesn't make much difference who our QB happens to be.

 

[TheRed]

Kyle Allen threw 16 interceptions over a span of 9 games. We lost to multiple 2 win teams with him under center. If we want to tank for the #1 overall pick in 2020 he could fill in for us in that capacity.

Otherwise if winning is the ultimate goal then the highest priority needs to be acquiring a capable signal caller sooner rather than later.

[TheRed]

As far as the OP goes. I'm just going to take the gloves off. You relentlessly railed against Cam for not winning enough in his first few years to the point you openly advocated trading him in 2013 before we went on a win streak.

Your blatant double standards here now making excuses for losing is mind bogglingly ridiculous and you are frankly a trash fan. I'll risk a ban and an account deletion sayng so. I don't care.

[stirs]

I said a week ago to keep your powder dry on all of the definitely this and have to have that.  The big boards are going to fluctuate a lot and I mean a lot now that the Senior Bowl, combine, etc are coming around.

I am thinking trade down or take the DT if he is there

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000001098476/article/daniel-jeremiahs-top-50-prospect-rankings-for-2020-nfl-draft-10?campaign=tw-cf-sf228701221-sf228701221&sf228701221=1

 

[TheSpecialJuan]

2 hours ago, MHS831 said:

I am increasingly of the mindset that if we are going into full rebuild mode, we need to trade Cam, build the OL and defense. We live in an era of instant gratification.  If any of you do not believe that I mean you, how many of you get impatient when your internet slows down a bit?  When it takes a whole minute to heat a hot pocket in the microwave?  When an order on Amazon takes over 3 days to arrive?  How often have you been wrong when you predict things?  So when you reply to this thread, do so with some humility and self-awareness.  Any "know-it-all" replies are probably overcompensation for personal equipment issues--we understand. Your best bet is probably a hotline, not a football discussion board. So if you think you are certain about the QB position in Carolina, you are probably not the expert you think you are.  Do I know?  Nope. I like my personal equipment situation and have come to terms with my ignorance.  But I know this:

Throughout NFL history, it has been proven that a good QB needs a few things in order to be successful:  A good OL, good WRs, a solid defense, and experience.  Inexperienced QBs that are forced to play catch up from behind bad lines, as is the case for QBs that have to play on bad teams, face incredibly difficult odds.  The defense pins their ears back, forgetting the run.  The OL ducks and whiffs.  The time to get the ball out is decreased, increasing the speed of the game.  They face more blitzes and stunts.  A good DC knows how to go in for the kill.   The best QBs in that situation will fold. 

So just how bad has Kyle Allen been during his first 15 starts as a big league QB.  He had 1 game vs. New Orleans scrubs and he played with a lead—with a better OL than DL that played, he was good, and beat the Saints easily.  This season, he came in vs. some teams early in the season and we led most of the games; he won 4 in a row—something neither of the QBs below managed to do.  When the D started to struggle horribly vs. the run, that shortened the number of possessions for him and he had to play behind a bad OL from behind—the recipe for disaster for any inexperienced NFL QB. 

Ask yourself this question with honesty: Would you have booed the following QBs and demanded their benching?:

• In his first 16 games after being pressed into starting duty Quarterback A completed 56.7 % of his passes and had 28 interceptions vs. 24 TDs.  His QB record was 3-13.
• In his first 10 games after being pressed into starting duty Quarterback B  completed 47.5% of his passes and had 14 interceptions vs. 7 TDs.  His team was 4-6 with him as a starter.
• In his first 12 games pressed into starting duty Quarterback C completed  38.1 % of his passes and had 24 interceptions vs. 6 TDs. He appeared in 12 games, starting 8.  His QB record was 3-5.
• In his first 15 games after being pressed into starting duty Quarterback D completed 62.7 % of his passes and had 16 interceptions vs. 18 TDs. His QB record was 6-7.

So just how bad has Kyle Allen been during his first 15 starts as a big league QB?  He had 1 game vs. New Orleans scrubs and he played with a lead—with a better OL than DL that played, he was good, and beat the Saints easily.  This season, he came in vs. some teams early in the season and we led most of the games; he won 4 in a row—something neither of the QBs below managed to do.  When the D started to struggle horribly vs. the run, that shortened the number of possessions for him and he had to play behind a bad OL from behind—the recipe for disaster for any inexperienced NFL QB. 

The QBs above were forced to play under the same circumstances during the debuts to their careers.  They were booed.  People screamed for them to be benched.  One of them is Kyle Allen, the others are in the Hall of Fame.  QB A is Peyton Manning, QB B is John Elway, and QB C is Terry Bradshaw.  Allen is QB D.

This is not to say Allen is a Hall of Famer, but it is to say 2 things.  If we do not draft a QB this year and build the OL, we see what we really have in 2 young QBs.  We were so bad up front and on D, any young QB would have sucked.  If we bring in a rookie first round draft pick and put him behind our OL and he is supported by this defense, it is likely that we do not improve our QB situation much, statistically.  So why bother with a QB this year.  (This is assuming Cam is gone; if Cam plays, we do not learn what we have behind him but we instantly improve with better DTs and OL.  Therefore, Cam does not seem to work into the long term plan, but would improve us next year.—if we keep him for a year and let him walk, then we are back in the same situation at QB—we would not know much about Grier and Allen and we would be looking for a rookie to save the day.  It will be interesting to see what they do.

 

true

[MHS831]

6 hours ago, rayzor said:

It would be a reach and a desperation move. This isn't a good QB class at all.

I really thought it was going to be--but when Burrow comes in the others get injured or exposed, you are left with a bunch of longshots--Even Burrow is a long shot based on his experience.

[TheSpecialJuan]

[AceBoogie]

Herbert is the only good QB in this draft. 

[GoPanthers123]

Rookie QBs can’t be asked to win without help, that’s the way the league works.   That’s why so many QBs drafted no 1 get destroyed.   

[45catfan]

6 minutes ago, AceBoogie said:

Herbert is the only good QB in this draft. 

[45catfan]

Herbert was lethal in the 8-10 yard range at the Senior Bowl today.  Not one impressive throw, IMO.  His TD was a garden variety screen pass to the RB.  Game manager.

[Pejorative Miscreant]

Need line imo. 

[Tarheel119]

3 minutes ago, 45catfan said:

Herbert was lethal in the 8-10 yard range at the Senior Bowl today.  Not one impressive throw, IMO.  His TD was a garden variety screen pass to the RB.  Game manager.

To the defense of the QB’s, the O-lines were horrible in pass protection. Plus, the refs would blow some plays dead to “protect” the QB’s.