BREAKING: Panthers sign CB Eli Apple

[Cary Kollins]

Has anyone said Eli Crapple yet?

no?

Im going back to bed 

[45catfan]

11 minutes ago, jfra78 said:

Most of those are probably on rookie deals.  For example Rams Jalen Ramsey averaged 5.8 mil, but this season is 13.7 mil

 

Apple didn't get his 5th year option picked up, otherwise he'd still be on his rookie deal too.  Point was the top paid corner (considered CB1) on every team doesn't get $16M a year and yes, some CB1s are just getting paid several million this year.

FYI, I referring to the other dude with the snappy quip.

[KatsAzz]

Our new CB, Eli Apple had good reviews from several scouts,one is listed below.I hope we have a coaching staff that can help him reach his full potential, if they can, we may have gotten a bargain, it  depends on the type contract he received.

 

{" Eli Apple possesses,ideal height, good speed, good route recognition and ability to adjust to the ball in mid-air."}

 

{" The 10th overall pick of the 1st round in 2016 by the New York Giants out of Ohio State, Apple has exhibited all the traits that made him such a valued prospect coming out of college."}

[TheSpecialJuan]

[45catfan]

Here's his last two years of stats:  Ewwwww.....

Games		Pass Coverage												Pass Rush					Tackles
Year	Age	Tm	Pos	No.	G	GS	Int	Tgt	Cmp	Cmp%	Yds	Yds/Cmp	Yds/Tgt	TD	Rat	DADOT	Air	YAC	Bltz	Hrry	QBKD	Sk	Prss	Comb	MTkl	MTkl%
2018	23	2TM			15	15	2	118	57	48.3%	869	15.2	7.4	3	74.4	12.7	619	250	0	0	0	0.0	0	75	15	16.7%
		NOR	LCB	24	10	10	2	85	38	44.7%	639	16.8	7.5	3	72.6	13.1	473	166	0	0	0	0.0	0	52	12	18.8%
		NYG	LCB/lcb	24	5	5	0	33	19	57.6%	230	12.1	7.0	0	79.1	11.4	146	84	0	0	0	0.0	0	23	3	11.5%
2019	24	NOR	CB	25	15	15	0	76	48	63.2%	683	14.2	9.0	2	100.9	11.4	483	200	1	0	1	0.0	1	58	6	9.4%

[MasterAwesome]

2 minutes ago, 45catfan said:

Okay, I went out of my way to say NOT FRANCHISE CB1s, but people can't help themselves but think they can get a cheap dunk on someone.  Here is a list of let's say 1970's CB1s (under $6 million) in 2020 as listed as the top paid CB salary:

Rams: $5.8M

Jets: $5.0M

Seahawks: $3.5M

Falcons: $3.5M

Raiders: $3.3M

Packers: 3.1M

Chiefs $3.0M

Vikings: $2.7M

Bucs: S1.8M

And before Apple--Panthers$1.2M

So as you can see, the top paid CB on teams across the board isn't $16M.  Unlike Madden, teams have to choose where to spend such wads of cash and all 32 teams don't choose to spend $16M for their top paid corners.

 

 

 

That's a very flawed analysis of what constitutes "CB1 money". There's a big difference between "CB1 money" and what a team is currently paying their highest paid CB, which incidentally might not even be their CB1.  The Saints are an example of that...Marshon Lattimore is unquestionably their CB1, yet Janoris Jenkins makes more than him because of Lattimore's limiting rookie contract.  But let's take the Panthers as an example: you consider Donte Jackson as making "CB1 money" just because our pitiful CB situation necessitates that he be forced into that role?

How about Bradberry: was he making CB1 money on his rookie contract where he was being paid less than $1 million annually?  Or is he now making CB1 money with the Giants at $15 million annually?  If both are considered "CB1 money", then how do you reconcile that enormous discrepancy when you say something like "Oh Apple is probably going to be paid CB1 money"?  That almost becomes a vacuous statement when you're talking about a salary that can range anywhere from $1 million - $15 million annually.

We appear to have very different definitions of "CB1 money".  You seem to be taking an extremely literal approach by just looking on paper at what the top CBs from each team make...which I explained is flawed, since you're not accounting for limited rookie contracts, CBs that are CB1s in name only (out of necessity), CBs that are considered #1s but aren't even the top paid on their team, etc.  I think a more abstract, theoretical approach makes sense in that you take a proven CB who can be reasonably expected to hold their own against most #1 WRs, and then consider what their likely market value would be in free agency.  To me, that's in the $8-10 million range annually.

[TheSpecialJuan]

[Basbear]

@stbugs they are trying to win. they do not care about comp picks,, talent, or dead cap. Of course they need about 9 HUUUGE miracles to go their way. Regardless they are trying, Rhule is taking a less than 1% chance and going for it this year. True gamblers move with a high chance to blow up in his face, he insisted on a 7 year deal for a reason.  

Apple is a true enigma. Need a CB with starting game exp and this is one comes with nfc south exp. I know when Dave trades a player, its a big red flag. Apple fits the numbers and age part, if not for the 10th overall pick he'd be out of league after being a cancer on the giants.  

[TheSpecialJuan]

[45catfan]

2 minutes ago, MasterAwesome said:

That's a very flawed analysis of what constitutes "CB1 money". There's a big difference between "CB1 money" and what a team is currently paying their highest paid CB, which incidentally might not even be their CB1.  The Saints are an example of that...Marshon Lattimore is unquestionably their CB1, yet Janoris Jenkins makes more than him because of Lattimore's limiting rookie contract.  But let's take the Panthers as an example: you consider Donte Jackson as making "CB1 money" just because our pitiful CB situation necessitates that he be forced into that role?

How about Bradberry: was he making CB1 money on his rookie contract where he was being paid less than $1 million annually?  Or is he now making CB1 money with the Giants at $15 million annually?  If both are considered "CB1 money", then how do you reconcile that enormous discrepancy when you say something like "Oh Apple is probably going to be paid CB1 money"?  That almost becomes a vacuous statement when you're talking about a salary that can range anywhere from $1 million - $15 million annually.

We appear to have very different definitions of "CB1 money".  You seem to be taking an extremely literal approach by just looking on paper at what the top CBs from each team make...which I explained is flawed, since you're not accounting for limited rookie contracts, CBs that are CB1s in name only (out of necessity), CBs that are considered #1s but aren't even the top paid on their team, etc.  I think a more abstract, theoretical approach makes sense in that you take a proven CB who can be reasonably expected to hold their own against most #1 WRs, and then consider what their likely market value would be in free agency.  To me, that's in the $8-10 million range annually.

The top paid player on a roster at any given position is typically their #1.  Now if you want to start averaging CB1 money, then yeah, $8M is about average.  It would be even higher if there wasn't 'x' number of salaries lower than that...regardless of the situation (rookie deals, prove-it deals, team rebuild, cap casualty etc..).  That's the reason I tried to stipulate not Franchise CB1s.  Those guys are the cornerstones/building blocks for the foreseeable future for those clubs.   Apple is looking like a one year rental.  That being said, he's going to be our top--#1 CB this year.

[jfra78]

20 minutes ago, 45catfan said:

Apple didn't get his 5th year option picked up, otherwise he'd still be on his rookie deal too.  Point was the top paid corner (considered CB1) on every team doesn't get $16M a year and yes, some CB1s are just getting paid several million this year.

FYI, I referring to the other dude with the snappy quip.

I already told you at 4 mil 40 cbs would make more than him

[WOW!!]

2 hours ago, stbugs said:

Agree. I want to see the young guys get reps and snaps and allow the coaches to get them better. We aren’t going to the playoffs with so many changes and a much more limited offseason not to mention a talent issue (rookies aren’t studs day 1. I’d rather not worry about W-L record and work on long term experience to make the rookies much better in year 3/4+ of the rebuild. Again, not lying down to tank but realizing that we aren’t playing for this year. 

We did this already and it failed.  You hurt others development by putting nothing but rookies on the field.. They get wrecked and lose confidence..

[LinvilleGorge]

1 hour ago, Smithers said:

I sure as hell hope they think they are going to compete.  That’s the culture any good coach should instill.  I don’t want a coach who takes the field every Sunday with no plan to compete or be competitive.  

 

56 minutes ago, 45catfan said:

Don't tell that to a handful of people here...seemingly perturbed Rhule isn't in tank mode with them.  If Rhule was only smart enough to know that tanking is in the team's long-term best interest!

He won two games in his first season at Temple and one in his first season at Baylor. I just think his lack of NFL experience may have him not realizing that he's walking into a similar dumpster fire in Charlotte.

[45catfan]

1 minute ago, jfra78 said:

I already told you at 4 mil 40 cbs would make more than him

Your point is he's not going to get paid like a top-tier CB. True and that was never the argument, but I laid out that not every CB earns top dollar in order to be the #1 guy for their team.  That's the very reason we let Bradberry walk is we didn't want to sink $15 million into the CB position and have what you are calling a 'true' CB1.  We probably could have brought Cockrell back cheaper and got the same production.