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LTs & arm length (basically: This draft's OTs are great but...)

saX man

By saX man,
in Carolina Panthers

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mrcompletely11 Grand Master

mrcompletely11

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9 hours ago, bythenbrs said:

Jordan Gross 33.25”

When the draft experts on this board say that slater is going to be a guard because of his size, they conveniently forget that Slater and Gross are identical in size and Slater is stronger.  Both of their games are exactly the same.  They are smart effective blockers that are relentless and want to rip your head off

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BrianS Veteran

BrianS

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I would be over the moon if we manage to land another Jordan Gross.  We all liked Jordan when he was here, but when he retired is when we really realized just how GOOD he was.  LT just wasn't a thought during his career.  It was just "handled".

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d-dave Veteran

d-dave

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I don't know why everyone get's caught up on a couple of inches, especially my wife!  =0

I'll be here all week!  Try the veal!

 

(If it was only about numbers, Little would be an all pro...We've seen plenty of examples of guys without those ideal measurements be excellent players in the NFL.

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saX man Mentor

saX man

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1 hour ago, mrcompletely11 said:

When the draft experts on this board say that slater is going to be a guard because of his size, they conveniently forget that Slater and Gross are identical in size and Slater is stronger.  Both of their games are exactly the same.  They are smart effective blockers that are relentless and want to rip your head off

I'm posing the question with the thread.  Appreciate the points about leverage by come and the apt comp to Gross.  But it is true some staff's do in fact look at arm length as it is a big component to the position.  But as with everything it's one of many and countless exceptions to the rule are found that make up for it like Jason Peters, Joe Thomas, Jordan Gross as I mentioned.

I'm just saying with these top-2, it's something to temper expectations for.  It's possible we could trade down with either Slater or Sewell available, much to the chagrin of many board members, so am tempering the mood on these guys as they'd probably be ranked 3-4ish in last year's class

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Untouchable Collaborator

Untouchable

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I've mostly heard of a 33" min for teams at tackle, but it's just a component. Yes length is one of those things that helps you win on the margins, but so is athleticism. And the tape should be the most important component.

It being Fitterer's first draft were not sure how much emphasis will be put on it. Length was a heavy emphasis in Rhule's first draft. The only exceptions where Pride and Roy (both showed very good speed though).

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KatsAzz Grand Master

KatsAzz

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Long arms versus short arms is a bunch of hog wash. It’s often argued that guys with longer arms are better able to keep defenders at bay and that a player with short arms simply can’t be successful.

This is especially confusing when considering that there is no real consensus on what are considered “long” or “short” arms. I quite often see a scouting report where 34” arms are called long, while 33 ¼” arms are considered short by the same scouting service.

Look at a ruler and measure out ¾ of an inch. Does it seem logical that such a small distance makes such a big difference in holding off defenders?

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bythenbrs Grand Master

bythenbrs

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14 hours ago, saX man said:

This year's offensive line class is really good.  Really damn good.  I think 5 first rounders.  9-11 in the top-50.

But what I can't get past is that it's rather undersized; even the top talents. Fit mentioned how important size is and gotta say, I do wonder how it's swayed our opinions on some of these guys.

Notable League-starter LTs:

Wirfs: 34"

Bahktiari: 34"

Trent W: 34.5"

Duane Brown: 34.25"

Whitworth: 35"

Dion Dawkins: 35"

Hell, Moton: 34.13"

Draft Prospects:

There are 3 total LT prospects even over the typical 34" threshold: Darrisaw (34.5"), Leatherwood (34.4), & Spencer Brown (34).  Darrisaw is the one true LT prospect IMO.

Notable shortees:

Penei Sewell: 33.25"

Rashawn Slater: 33.00"

Teven Jenkins: 32.88"

Jalen Mayfield: 32.63"

Liam Eichenberg: 32.35"

Samuel Cosmi: 33.00"

Dillon Radunz: 33.28"

--

I'm not intending to throw shade as all 7 of my shortlist are really awesome talents and there are no doubt exceptions to the rule like Jason Peters. However, given what we've heard, I'm curious to who we like the most.  Wonder if Darrisaw (who draws Okung comparisons) is viewed highly and could be a trade down target. 

I don't believe arms length to be make or break but a lot of teams deem it critical on the LT criteria list. This draft has GREAT OL talent, and we better capitalize, but IMO, last year's was superb and this years is slightly behind.

Whatsayyou? How important is arm length?  Does it warrant pause even if they look like absolute brick walls on tape? I mean, in Slater's case, this is even in the face of Chase Young last year, really controlled the dude. 

 

 

 

T-Rex had short arms.  I'm sure he was an ineffective hunter...

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d-dave Veteran

d-dave

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14 minutes ago, saX man said:

^^jfc, I'm not saying short arms is a must.  Can anyone have a nuanced convo about this?  It's a thing scouts look at whether you like it or not, but like I mention, there are plenty of exceptions to the rule. 

Jokes aside, at the end of the day arm length is just a number.  An attribute.  In the draft, it's about finding the best player.  Sometimes you can find a guy who has all the measurables and he turns into an all pro.  Or a guy without who becomes a HoFer.

Personally, I don't think it's something to dwell on.  Either the guy can play or he can't.  He's a people mover or a turnstile.

I remember hearing from a scout at some point during some draft year about measurements being a confirmation of film.  Like if a guy plays fast but runs a 4.6.  Then that helps finish out an evaluation.  Why did they perform this way?

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saX man Mentor

saX man

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28 minutes ago, d-dave said:

Jokes aside, at the end of the day arm length is just a number.  An attribute.  In the draft, it's about finding the best player.  Sometimes you can find a guy who has all the measurables and he turns into an all pro.  Or a guy without who becomes a HoFer.

Personally, I don't think it's something to dwell on.  Either the guy can play or he can't.  He's a people mover or a turnstile.

I remember hearing from a scout at some point during some draft year about measurements being a confirmation of film.  Like if a guy plays fast but runs a 4.6.  Then that helps finish out an evaluation.  Why did they perform this way?

Yeah I think there's a line that can be drawn but it's from prospect to prospect, not an overall "must be this tall" type thing.

It reaches a point where no matter the skill, a certain frame or body type will simply have trouble against the higher level competition and NFL defenses.  Sewell & Slater are both absolute studs so I don't think 3/4" is anything to dwell on like you said. 

I however do think when you get down to the 32ish range, it becomes a bit more of an issue because then it's notable and their game needs to compensate for it. Stepping back, some guys make up for it with their footwork, agility, quickness, & technique.   It just depends but when they are a bit undersized, then those top traits need to hit on all cylinders.  I believe they do with Sewell and Slater for the most part.  They've held their own against some of the best DEs.  A bit less with Eichenberg, Cosmi, & Mayfield.  I will say, the Radunz kid is pretty interesting and I like Jenkins & Darrisaw a lot.  I've grown a bit wary of Cosmi and Mayfield after liking them a lot initialy.  It's kind of a combo of considering their performance and stepping back and seeing their builds. 

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pantherclaw Grand Master

pantherclaw

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16 hours ago, LinvilleGorge said:

It's important, but I'll take great feet with mediocre arm length all day everyday over 35" arms and mediocre feet. If you don't have the feet to stay in front of a guy two inches of arm isn't going to help you.

That it folks.  This thread is over. 

We'd like to thank you for coming in and reading. 

Have a great day! 👍

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